ANNOUNCING THE NEW RACER 2!

[amberjack]

gold racer looks and feels fine in the coil area so going on that the R2 should be as good.

AJ

 

[triplehooked]

I'm going to give this one a go. I've owned the Core in the past and was very impressed with its capabilities in iron. The problem I had was it's (Core) inability to adjust the iron audio volume, and the user interface being on the side of the unit. The latter not being a huge factor, just a nuisance more than anything. Obviously, the Racer doesn't have that issue. With the addition of the adjustable iron audio I think this unit will be a keeper for me. I like its tones and capability in iron. My question is regarding the alleged change in oor coil? What is that about and why the change?

 

[Monte]

Interested, but waiting to see if they addressed coil ear breakage, coil bolt breakage, pole breakage and ' i can not go over 69 on the sensitivity' issues that people have experienced.

Coil ear breakage was addressed and that coil problem resolved. It appears they are switching to the Nokta FORS 'series' 7X11 DD coil which is more rugged and durable and has had no issues.

The coil bolt was shorter and hollow, and the hollow design lead to the bolt breakage. They resolved that by gojng to the longer, solid design lever-bolt as used on the Nokta FORS 'series' as far as I have determined.

Pole breakage? I have never hear of a rod, middle or lower, breaking.

As for Sensitivity levels, for a year my search Sensitivity level is usually '85' in any mode, and at times I have increased it to '90' or higher in favorable conditions, and lowered it to ''35' to '45,' if I felt it was helpful. Usually it is '85' and I haven't had any problems with EMI unless by a very offending power source in an urban location that would bother any detector. You must have caught one post by someone in a bad location because I use, and many of my friends use, the Makro Racer and they are not limited to '65' or under, either.

Once these things are addressed i'm sure it will be an awesome piece of equipment which i will gladly purchase. Looks like things are going in the right direction, keep up the good work guys.

Taken care of and the longer you wait to order, the farther down the list you will be. The Racer 2 is really an awesome performing detector.

Monte

 

[Furious T]

Thanks Monte, for your information on the 7x11 DD coils. That has basically given me the information I needed, and I hope that the "new" style coil for the Racer 2 will allow me to use that coil. With my red racer (red makes it go faster), I have only used the 10 x 5 DD coil...it provides the depth I need and is good in most areas ( I have ordered the smallest coil, to give it a run). As usual, your information is precise and easy to understand....thanks again, Pete.

 

[Monte]

n/t

 

[Monte]

I'm going to give this one a go.

Good decision. The Racer 2 is a wonderful detector in many ways.

I've owned the Core in the past and was very impressed with its capabilities in iron. The problem I had was it's (Core) inability to adjust the iron audio volume, and the user interface being on the side of the unit. The latter not being a huge factor, just a nuisance more than anything.

I owned the FORS CoRe a month before I got the original Racer in-hand and still have and use my FORS CoRe. The side-positioned controls and master display are just fine, so far as I am concerned, as I only used the handle-mounted display for Target ID read-out.

The FORS and Racer series use different methods of function adjustment and I like both, and kind of prefer the FORS 'series' because you stay on the last-used adjustment function until you are finished making adjustments to that setting and change back to a different mode or function setting. The Racer series are designed to go back to the main Mode selection after a delay of about five-seconds. Both have their pros and cons, which means both are likeable in some ways.

You can't adjust the Iron Audio Volume on the original Racer or on the original CoRe, just like I can't adjust it on my FORS Gold Plus, or Makro Gold Racer. The new Makro Racer 2 DOES have an Iron Audio Volume control and it is a desired feature on detectors that are used with low Discrimination settings to hear Iron Nails. That's how I usually hunt. My friend, Oregon Gregg, and I met up day-before yesterday to hunt a site he had located [size=small](since all of our nearby ghost towns and mining camps are still under 5" to over a foot of snow )[/size], and he used his FORS CoRe and I grabbed my Racer 2.

Once the official announcement was made I let Gregg know I had a Racer 2 and he came over to check it out .... then immediately ordered one. When we hunted that site I took my FORS CoRe along with the 'OOR' coil mounted, as well as my FORS Gold+ with the 5½X10 mounted as I thought the site might be only moderately littered. It wasn't, and while the Gold Plus I like a lot for Relic Hunting, with my CoRe a close second, I decided to work the Racer 2 because it had the Iron Audio Volume feature and there is a lot of iron, nails especially, at that location where a lot of former wooden structures once stood.

That was the very useful feature the Racer 2 offered me that Gregg wished he had on his FORS CoRe .... and I wish I had it on my CoRe or the Gold Plus as it is a great adjustment to have on a Relic Hunting detector when you have to deal with a lot of iron discards. Other than that, his CoRe still had very good performance like I did.

Obviously, the Racer doesn't have that issue.

The Racer doesn't have Iron Audio Volume, but the new Racer 2 does.

With the addition of the adjustable iron audio I think this unit will be a keeper for me. I like its tones and capability in iron.

I agree. This is a very versatile detector for any avid hobbyists to own and use. I'm going to make that long drive back out to that location mid-morning today, Monday, and meet up with Gregg so we can take advantage of the spring-like weather we are having ... at least thru Wednesday. It's 42° at midnight and going to hit ± 60° today in partly cloudy/partly sunny weather.

My question is regarding the alleged change in oor coil? What is that about and why the change?

According to Dilek at Makro and Nokta, she corrected my earlier post about an 'OOR' coil in the Pro-Package. It was an 'OOR' coil supplied to us evaluators, but she stated the Racer 2 will ship with the newly designed standard 7X11 DD coil, and the Pro-Package will have the round 5" DD in it.

I do not know the specific 'Why' for the change to the 5" coil. It might be cost or it might be easier to wind and make the inner workings, but either way you really can't tell much difference. My Nokta FORS CoRe has the 'OOR' coil, but my FORS Gold+ came standard with two coils, the smaller being a 5" DD. I have worked them side-by-side in comparison, and they both work quite similar.

My Makro Racer Pro-Package included the 'OOR', like the evaluation Racer 2, but my Makro Gold Racer has the round 5" DD for it. Again, comparing the different Racer series models with 'OOR' and 5" DD coils, their performance is quite similar. In use you really can't tell a difference in performance in dense trash.

The Racer 2 with the Pro-Package is going to be an excellent product for anyone who wants to learn it well and master it, regardless of the shape of the smaller coil.

Monte

 

[triplehooked]

Great info. Monte. Thank you! Now we need to get you rigged up with a gopro camera to show us how that R2 does! Lol.

Obviously, the Racer doesn't have that issue.

The Racer doesn't have Iron Audio Volume, but the new Racer 2 does. Monte

What I meant here was that the Racer's interface is on the front rather than the side as on the Fores series. Had the adjustable iron audio been an option on the Red Racer I would have owned one when they first came out! I probably wasn't quite clear in my original post.


95% of my sites contain medium to heavy iron. What I found that works well at these sites is little to no disc., adjust the tone break to just above the average iron nail of a given site, but keep the iron audio as a low rumble in the background to help maintain site contact, therefore higher target concentration. It also helps in discovering key areas such as entry ways, privys, and stables. All speculation of course, but with these features added to an already proven platform, it's a no brainer for me. The R2 seems to be a good choice.

Hopefully they will be shipped before our Michigan spring thaw!

 

[eSCANZ]

lets hope they wait for a few month before they release a Racer 3 its hard to keep up now

there were 3 different Tek Delta 4000;s from memory with minimal changes

looks like there are significant changes between Racer1 & Racer2 so I cant wait for a continuing line of Racer models - Proud to own either one yet they are different enough to want to own them all - lol

 

[vincentvangerven@gmail.com]

i'll keep an eye on these, if the kinks are worked out on this model then i'm sure it's going to be a bestseller and i'll then order one as well.

 

[vincentvangerven@gmail.com]

Interested, but waiting to see if they addressed coil ear breakage, coil bolt breakage, pole breakage and ' i can not go over 69 on the sensitivity' issues that people have experienced.

Coil ear breakage was addressed and that coil problem resolved. It appears they are switching to the Nokta FORS 'series' 7X11 DD coil which is more rugged and durable and has had no issues.

The coil bolt was shorter and hollow, and the hollow design lead to the bolt breakage. They resolved that by gojng to the longer, solid design lever-bolt as used on the Nokta FORS 'series' as far as I have determined.

Pole breakage? I have never hear of a rod, middle or lower, breaking.

As for Sensitivity levels, for a year my search Sensitivity level is usually '85' in any mode, and at times I have increased it to '90' or higher in favorable conditions, and lowered it to ''35' to '45,' if I felt it was helpful. Usually it is '85' and I haven't had any problems with EMI unless by a very offending power source in an urban location that would bother any detector. You must have caught one post by someone in a bad location because I use, and many of my friends use, the Makro Racer and they are not limited to '65' or under, either.

Once these things are addressed i'm sure it will be an awesome piece of equipment which i will gladly purchase. Looks like things are going in the right direction, keep up the good work guys.

Taken care of and the longer you wait to order, the farther down the list you will be. The Racer 2 is really an awesome performing detector.

Monte

Posted a link to a european forum where some guys had trouble with the sensitivity, if they turned it up over 69 the detector would go haywire. Turned out these were defective coils, Makro stepped in, did the right thing and replaced those. Should be no problem on the new racers, at least from what i have read they use a different manufacturing proces more like the nokta fors core, haven't found any postings of people experiencing problems with the Nokta coils.

As for pole breakage, a couple of users experienced pole breakage right where the screen sits.There is a hole drilled in the pole where the wires run from battery compartment to screen, it was oversized on some, leading to metal fatigue right around that hole, i guess because of the repetitive swinging motion or hitting something hard when detecting.

That web link i posted is now gone; sorry if i broke any forum rules, i did not see that this is a 'no-no' in the basic forum rules.

 

[Monte]

If you are using a competitive model that has an Iron Audio Volume control, then you have 25% of a very effective combination for very iron littered sites.

Twenty-five percent? How's that? Well, the percentage amounts allotted to each of the four categories might differ a little between each of them, but for simple purposes we will just credit each category equally. So, what are they?

• Iron Audio Volume control to help deal with the annoyance of hearing a loud response from ferrous or low-conductive targets.

• Search coil size and type for the site environment.

• Use of a metal detector which, by developed design, provides highly efficient performance to unmask desired targets in a very challenging situation.

• The operator's knowledge, skill set, and patience to work the package in a very versatile manner.

What I meant here was that the Racer's interface is on the front rather than the side as on the Fores series. Had the adjustable iron audio been an option on the Red Racer I would have owned one when they first came out! I probably wasn't quite clear in my original post.

I understood what you meant, I believe, and all the display location or position might do is encourage more users to glance at the display information more often and that could, possibly, distract an 'average' consumer. I do glance at the VDI numeric read-out, and on the FORS CoRe and FORS Gold+ that is displayed in the handle as well as the side-positioned display [size=small](I only glance at the handle display)[/size], but primarily rely of hearing a desired audio response.

Does that always mean a crystal clear and consistent audio report? Certainly not. It is hearing ANY audio response from targets I encounter that the detector responds to, meaning they are above my ID Filter [size=small](Discrimination)[/size] setting. If an 'iffy' audio response, then I try to determine if it is a lower-reading target close to ferrous junk so that the identity is masked, thus producing a lower TID numeric read-out, OR it is a deeper located target that is close to the audio response limit and/or TID read-out limit based upon the signal strength.

95% of my sites contain medium to heavy iron. What I found that works well at these sites is little to no disc., adjust the tone break to just above the average iron nail of a given site, but keep the iron audio as a low rumble in the background to help maintain site contact, therefore higher target concentration. It also helps in discovering key areas such as entry ways, privys, and stables.

Like you, the vast majority of my favorite sites are heavily ferrous-trashed. You need to know the iron is there to best work around it to uncover potentially masked targets.

I have had other brands with an Iron Audio Volume control, such as a pair of Teknetics Euro-Tek Pro's and two Fisher F19's as well, and use of minimal Discrimination with a reduced iron loudness of response certainly showed its benefits. But for me, the performance wasn't there in those dirty-bad-nasty environments. I parted with all of them, preferring detectors I had that worked better in iron littered sites even if they didn't have Iron Audio Volume control. Some still excelled over the Fisher and Teknetics models even with the Discrimination adjusted to just barely reject iron nails.

Then in January of last year I put a Nokta FORS CoRe to work and it became my primary-use detector that featured visual TID. On top of that the balance was great and all-purpose performance was there, too. In February the Makro Racer became my #2 detector, or really tied with the FORS CoRe for adjustments and performance, in both cases preferring the smaller coil for dense trash. For many of my favorite sites I like to use a 2-Tone audio mode with VCO enhancement, and both feature this choice. They also have a very useful 3-Tone audio mode that I have used more for typical Coin Hunting sites, but there are times it is really nice to select for some littered older sites I hunt.

All speculation of course, but with these features added to an already proven platform, it's a no brainer for me. The R2 seems to be a good choice.

Hopefully they will be shipped before our Michigan spring thaw!

Then along comes the Racer 2, bringing us Racer-like performance with more useable added features, such as Iron Audio Volume, Tone Break, Notch, rejection, and variable Audio adjustment for the different mode tone ranges, and more. All this in an improved 'S' rod design for more comfort and control. I still can't resist using my Nokta FORS CoRe and FORS Gold+ for a lot of the sites I hunt, especially if the iron content is a little less frequently encountered. I have found the Gold+ at 19 kHz to provide me a little better performance in the 2-Tone mode when lower-conductive targets are a main target, such as old, small buttons, etc.

For the old places I have been working more this year, like POW locations and CCC encampments, that are 'OLD' for that general era but not as 'old' as the mining camps, old town sits, homesteads and military encampments I prefer that date from about 1855 to 1920 [size=small](not yet accessible until winter snow is departing in 1 to 3 weeks)[/size], I have been grabbing the new Racer 2 most often, and the primary reason is the Iron Audio Volume adjustment. I will use my FORS Gold+ or FORS CoRe in more open areas, like I'll be hunting later today, and all the while I'll be wishing they also had an Iron Audio Volume control when I work closer to the mess hall and other building debris areas.

Yes, the Racer is an already proven unit and the Racer 2 is going to be a very well received additional model for folks to select from. I hope you can get a Racer 2 before the thaw hits. No snow now in the lower elevations where I live, and it was 62° a couple of days ago, and should stay in the mid-to-upper 50's for the next week. Spring is on the way and soon I can get up into the gold mining camps and towns, long gone and void of any structures, but left littered, and enjoy another fun year in this great sport.

All the best to you,

Monte

 

[Monte]

new Racer 2 works great!

i'll keep an eye on these, if the kinks are worked out on this model then i'm sure it's going to be a bestseller and i'll then order one as well.

Kinks? What 'kinks' are you thinking of?

Basic performance platform? .. Proven.

Rod grip angle? .. Taken care of with a more comfortable 'S' curve.

Early Racer release 7X11 coil ear breakage? .. Quickly addressed by Makro with thicker, improved coil mounting 'ears,' and a change to a better bolt & nut system.

Planned 'standard' 7X11 DD coil? Taken care of also as they have gone to a different coil body design and appear to use a rod-mount point closer-to-center to provide better balance and handling.

I can't think of any other 'kinks' they could have addressed, and instead of only a 'fixed' model, they are adding to the Makro Racer line with a Racer 2 that has great added adjustment features, a new extra search mode [size=small](DEEP)[/size] and we can't forget to note other nice features like a reduced Iron adjustment range that provides us a broader and more functional numeric TID range to help classify many non-ferrous targets, and the new ability to easily save any adjustments we make to any mode.

I'd suggest just ordering a Racer 2 in, put it to the test, and realize there are no 'kinks.'

Monte

 

[MAKRO RACER POWER]

So when we can see a waterproof makro racer machine , still non waterproof why , i know you can make it then i promise i will buy it if the price 1000 $ . Regards

 

[Nokta Detectors]

So when we can see a waterproof makro racer machine , still non waterproof why , i know you can make it then i promise i will buy it if the price 1000 $ . Regards

Waterproof devices are in our development plans but it will not be the Racer.
Racer project was initiated long time ago and it was not designed as a waterproof unit.
Trying to convert it to a waterproof unit would be more time consuming and risky than designing a brand new detector.

 

[horikindaguy]

Monte, could you explain the difference between your statement for the Racer:

"For many of my favorite sites I like to use a 2-Tone audio mode with VCO enhancement"

and the VCO audio on the F19/G2+....

is one better than the other and if so, why?

thanks...