Seems the focus on the posts is not on the actual X-70 . . . .

[Andy Sabisch]

Rick,

Finally some questions that forum visitors are interested in seeing the responses to . . . . thanks for getting things back on track!

As far as selecting an X-Terra for coin hunting, the answer depends on a few things.

1) GROUND CONDITIONS

Obviously as ground conditions degrade, the manual GB of the X-50 will help you get better performance than the X-30, and if they continue to get worse, the added range of the X-70 as well as the auto GB and tracking features help get even better performance. I have talked to some users in low mineralization areas that find the X-30 and X-50 run close to each other in comparing signals. So, you need to look at the ground conditions as one factor in selecting the detector of choice.

2) TARGET DEPTH

I know a number of hunters that simply enjoy getting out there and digging coins . . . quantity over quality. Nothing wrong with that, I still do it at times myself. But if that is your hunting preference, targets are not deep and hence the X-30 might be all you need.

Now if you are after the deeper targets, you need both more "power" as Tim Allen used to say as well as consistency of target ID indications at depth. If you get a beep yet the ID varies wildly, what do you know other than a target is there? That leads into the last point . . .

3) TARGET ID STABILITY / CONSISTENCY

Coins 6" down should not be a problem as far as a consistent ID. As the mineralization increases and/or ground moisture drops, the target ID readings tend to move a bit.

Now you asked about the expanded range of the X-70; i.e., segments vary by 2 vs. 3 on the X-50 and 4 on the X-30. Since I know you are an old Sovereign user, does the "550 meter vs. the 180 meter" ring a bell? Sometimes expanding the range or refinement of notches causes the ID to lock on less than with fewer notches. Heck on the original 550 meters, you looked for a range of numbers since it jumped around on each pass. Why do you think Sun Ray's meter or other modified meters were so popular? It eliminated the jumpiness and improved target ID capabilities. Even the XLT & DFX fall prey to the same issue . . with a range of 190 notches, targets never hit with no change with several sweeps.

With that said, the X-70 addresses this in two ways. First, the notches are not all of equal width so that those which should capture coins will be a bit wider so that the ID does not bounce out into adjacent segments and confuse the operator. This is also why trash does bounce and makes it easier to ID on any of the X-Terra's. The second addition is the Target Stabilization circuit which improves the target ID in hot ground and at depth. This one feature is not as simple as it sounds but once you master it, it can pick out targets that would be hard for other single frequency detectors (including the X-30 & 50) to pick out if conditions are harsh enough.

============

So, not sure if I answered your question, but if you are a serious coin hunter that needs as much depth as an X-Terra can give along with the ID capabilities and you hunt sites with more than medium mineralization, the X-70 is your choice. But the X-30 and X-50 have been making some great finds since their inception and for many hunters, they provide all the bells-&-whistles needed.

Andy Sabisch

 

[Joe of South Jersey]

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[JBM]

Hi Andy which coil do you prefer when using the x50 or x70 when looking for for coins.Thanks.Jerry.

 

[Andy Sabisch]

The HF coils which work on the X-50 and X-70 seem to be best suited for 1) prospecting, 2) possibly beach hunting for gold jewelry and 3) really maybe for relic hunting in fairly clean sites looking for lead and brass. What I and others have noted when using the HF coil for coin hunting sites we normally go to is that he increased sensitivity of the HF coil makes it almost unusable when you get into trashy areas. I've pulled some <1/4" square pieces of aluminum cans from 4" to 5" with solid signals. Never realized how many cans must have been hit by mowers at these sites but after dozens of holes, I did not need to add anymore aluminum to my collection and switched coils back to the MF coil.

During the testing phase I had the opportunity to test some coils that were literally one-of-a-kind in that they were hand built to test the performance. As a result, I am not sure which are going to be built and which are not; i.e., size, type or frequency.

I did use the concentric LF coil at some older sites in town and found it did respond a tad stronger to copper and silver coins that the MF coil did . . . . .but the MF coil works well for that application . . .

So, the MF coil is a great choice for all around hunting (and is usable on all three models), the HF coil is really not an option for coins (on the X-50 and X-70) and for an edge on deep coins; i.e., copper and silver, the LF edges the MF on the X-70 only.



Hope this helps

Andy

 

[Mike Hillis]

n/t

 

[Andy Sabisch]

Noe sure what you are asking . . . . .

 

[Mike Hillis]

that when I hunt using the DFX in the single 15khz mode, will wrap target id for high conductive targets (like quarters) around into the iron range. Just an effect of high frequency and high mineralization. Example, a quarter would normally read around 84ish, but in this dirt at that frequency, it wraps around into the iron range and reads as a -94.

Do you think the X-70 with the 18kHz freq coil will cause the same effect? Or maybe a better question would be, "could you test this?"

Thanks

 

[Andy Sabisch]

not sure why you would want to use the HF coil in hot ground for coins. First, I and others have found the HF coil too sensitive to common small trash in areas for coin hunting such as tiny pieces of foil and aluminum slivers. Second, the LF coil is better suited for hot ground and hits better on higher conductive targets such as copper and silver coins . . . . .

But I am going out this afternoon with the X-70 if you want me to try and see if I can find a deeper high value coin and switch to the HF coil and see the impact on the ID reading . . . . . .

Andy Sabisch

 

[Rick(ND)]

I have used the 30 and the 50 at a old farm site looking for coins my Sovereign or Explorer may have missed, now I would like to try the 70 for some of the deeper ones yet. With the 70 the way I see it I will get some better ID on those deeper targets, but like all detectors it will not be 100% accurate and have to dig most all solid signals. The odd will be more in my favor with the 70 plus when the lower freq coil come out I can even increase my odds for silver.
From the little I used the 30 and 50 before freeze up I find there is a learning curve to each one and both have been impressive and I am sure the 70 will even be more impressive. I can see where the 30 will be the one for those that want quantity over quality and just want to dig coins as it is a very reasonable and capable detector.The 50 you will get some better ID and better depth if you have mineralized soil but for reg ground the 30 can keep up with the 50 real well. The 70 I feel from what I am reading is going to be for those that like the Sovereign and Explorers as we want the good tone ID along with the meters to give us the best chance of spending more time digging the better targets and not so much trash. This will not be for everyone as some don't like to spend the time to understand what this detector can do and tell you.
I thank you for explaining this as I am sure it will help many decide on which X-Terra to get.

One more thing before I for get, the X-Terras are not made to replace the Sovereign, the Quattros or the Explorers as they are a class to themselves, so it is hard to compare them. In some area the X-Terras are better while the other Minelabs in another area, the one thing I like with the 30 and 50 is they are light weight, easy to use and they do have some great depth and very sensitive to smaller items.

Rick

 

[Mike Hillis]

You are right, its not a good coin hunting frequency in that type of ground, but if you know the effect, you know whats going on when you run into it. Mostly curious on how the display handles the discrimination range shift from the 7.5 to the 18 kHz frequency.

Well, if you get a chance to check it, let me know how the spread shifts.

Thanks,

Mike

 

[Daniel Tn]

The rage here in the last few years has been the higher freqency machines. Say 14khz to 20khz for relics and coins. No doubt they are sensitive to small items. I think we've saw more posts with percussion caps and super small lead and brass than ever before. BUT the thing people don't understand is the higher khz machines do not perform that great in mineralized soils due to exactly what you stated. The "wrap around" effect is present on them all. I've hunted with some of the better higher frequency machines and my dirt here reads around -92 to -94 on the DC Phase of a DFX. I run into the same thing you described...on high frequency mode the objects will wrap into the iron range and sometimes vice versa. What that means...as you know...is if you are rejecting iron in that range, you are discriminating out some good stuff that wouldn't normally be rejected. Some of these guys that have soil that favors the higher frequency machines will laugh and call you crazy when you say they don't work that great in bad dirt and or another machine works better that they didn't get good results out of.

A prime example and then I'm going to shut up. In this dirt here, you can take a Tesoro Bandido II or one of those machines in the 6-10 khz range. And you'll dig stuff just as deep, and in some cases deeper, than the newer Tesoros with the 14-17 khz frequency. I play around with the 15khz on the DFX from time to time but more often than not I have it stuck on 3khz. But yet that lil X-Terra 50 with Medium freq coil 7khz...it really really rocks around here. If I get an X-70 it will be with the stock 7khz and then I'll add the 3khz as an accessory.

 

[JBM]

Hi Andy sorry if Iam being a pain but I must get this right.

Your words "Quote The HF is really not an option for coins(on X-50 and X-70)"

Are you saying this is the best coil for hunting coins?

With respect sometimes you guys use words in a different way than folks this side of the big pond.
Many thanks,Jerry.
.

 

[Joe of South Jersey]

I'm not Andy, And I am sure he will post his response.

I like the stock coil at least over the 18 kHz at this point. I will have to wait until the 3 kHz is availible to let you know on that. The 70 is smoother on the targets in the test garden than the 50 with the same coil.

 

[Andy Sabisch]

Jerry,

No, what I meant to say is that due to the extreme sensitivity of the HF coil (which works on the 50 & 70), many of us have found that you spend too much time on looking for tiny pieces of foil and cans . . . . 4" to 5" on slivers of aluminum drive you nuts after a while and you find out just how much junk there is . . . now you can reject those segments but you will be tossing out a lot of potential jewelry targets and in Europe, some real old stuff as well. The MF and LF coils are better for coins here.

Hopefully Des in Ireland is reading these messages and will post what coil he prefers and why.

Andy

 

[bugg]

Does the x50 also use the wider and narrower notches that the 70 uses?
Or are the notches all the same width on the 50? thanks

 

[Andy Sabisch]

No, all of the X-Terra's have slightly different notch widths . . . they were developed based on testing a lot of targets at the factory and validated in the field. That's why nickels for example hit as 12 so consistently while trash tends to jump around . . . .

The difference between the models is the number of segments that cover the ferrous - non ferrous range.

Andy

 

[JBM]

Thanks Andy thats loud and clear.
Time for bed now Jerry.

 

[Doug[Manila]]

[quote Andy Sabisch]No, all of the X-Terra's have slightly different notch widths . . . they were developed based on testing a lot of targets at the factory and validated in the field. That's why nickels for example hit as 12 so consistently while trash tends to jump around . . . .

Andy[/quote]

Are the notch widths designed for US coins only?

 

[Andy Sabisch]

Doug,

No, the notches were developed by testing a whole lot of stuff at the factory (from what I heard they got an intern to sweep targets and record values) including US coins, international coins and a lot of other stuff like trash and the like.

Based on the results, they tweaked the sizes of each notch so that where "goodies" hit, they were less likely to bounce out or they recentered the notch so the good target hit in the middle and even some varation would keep it in the notch. Then the rest of teh range was filled in with the other notches.

Is this perfect for all targets? Obviously no since relics and jewelry can hit anywhere and when I was in England last year I found Roman coins that hit from just above iron to the silver range . . . . but once you see what targets you are looking for read as, it is pretty darn accurate.

Let's see what others using even the 30 and 50 have to say on this topic.

Andy

 

[Doug[Manila]]

n/t