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would requiring a permit help or hinder our hobby

D

diggervance

New member
I posted this on another forum and thought I would post it here and see what the feed back would be.
I have been wondering about something so I thought I would throw it out here and get some feed back.Do you think with all the state and municipalities being in dire straits if they was to sell metal detecting permits or licenses like they do for fishing or hunting do you think it would open up more opportunities on hunting grounds and Less flack. I think it could generate cash for park and rec departments.Maybe some kind of rules of the hobby book or handout that must be followed, or fines to those that are less respectful of the grounds that we all hunt. I don't know whats your thoughts on this would it help or hinder our hobby?
Diggervance
 
Personally I wouldn't mind as long as it was not more than $5-10. That being said it would have to include state wide parks or government grounds. There would have to be some incentive to not just search private properties and not get the permit.

Justin
 
-- moved topic --
 
Diggervance, whenever the subject or idea of "permits" comes up, md'rs wax romantic and think it's a great idea. It just "rolls off the tongue". And we all have images of just being able to whip out that puppy, show it to any busy-body-gripers, and they just leave us alone. RIGHT?? But it never works that way. A simple look at any places that have such things (very few places by the way), shows they are NOT what you want. Here's various reasons and scenarios:

When you read of such things, they invariably contain baggage. Strange things like "detect but can't dig", or "no detecting within 10 ft. of a tree", or "only on sandy beaches", or digger probe/device can not exceed 3 inches in length", and all sorts of silly things. Or another thing that has sometimes happened, is that inexplicably, permits get pulled, and are simply not issued at a certain point (at a renewal time, or whatever, they decide to can the program, etc...). Because, you see, the mere fact that it is now something "regulated", simply gives bureaucrats something to have to decide on all the time at their annual meetings, of "do we want to allow this?" and "what exactly do they do?" etc... And then it simply takes some archie to look a program, and say "why are we allowing these yahoos to do this?" In other words, it just as simply puts this into their hands as something that needs their "princely say-so", and then they can revoke the system, just as easily. Gee, and then what do you do?

So, no, "permits" is not a good idea. ESPECIALLY if someone thinks they are a good "pre-emptive move" to suggest to cities, counties, etc... where they live. Because, gee, then it just gives them a "pressing question" that needs addressing. About the only time it *might* be a lesser of evils, is if there were ALREADY a rule in place that said no detecting. But otherwise, it's the last thing you want.
 
Hi diggervance, Tom pretty much nailed it down for you. We are governed/regulated by laws drawn up totally by and for Archaeologists,allowing for their total control and interpretation of those laws. Confusion rules the day when the laws are inforced,and then many times at some Archie's personal discretion. That is pretty much a proven and well established fact for those particular ones that have have been subject to any run -ins with their laws. That is the way it is .Some folks would dissagree, but the system set up in the UK does manage a reasonable amount of give and take from all folks involved, but you will never see any reasonable system born of our government. It is too corrupt, and all " reason" and sensability has gone to hell by way of personal greed and the" I" word which is now banned by the PC Buttheads. Simple way is to hunt as legal as you possibly can, keep a low profile at all times and have all the fun you can, while you can. It likely won't last forever and that is plain for us all to see. HH, Charlie
 
Ive seen it work well in a state park near me ,, with the exception of a few of the state park people and their Buddy's violating their own rules by hunting the park prior to the park being open to the public.... any time permits are involved with anything you invite bureaucracy and interpretation of rules.... then they have to hire someone to enforce the rules...then they gotta pay the guy who enforces the rules....then they gotta get nit picky and find reasons to fine the detectorists so they have enough money to pay the guy... BAD IDEA........
 
Hey All,
Great points thanks for the input. You have raised some great points that I didn't think of.
Diggervance
 
But I like it for the REST of YOU! I'm pretty sure I can get by with a warning or two and clean out your permitted towns and parks without having a permit myself....Do not even THINK about bringing this idea up to any official! "Hey, heres an idea, please take my money" sorry, DV, I see your sort of new and are just thinking of ideas like we all have done.....take Tom's, Scubadee's, Charlie's, BH's advice please, just be invisible and hunt away. Full disclosure, I just wrote a check for my "winter taxes" and that has chapped my @ss worse than 4 feet of snow!
Mud
 
Very bad idea. Anytime the government gets involved with ANYTHING nothing good will come from it. You do not want a politician with no knowledge of the hobby regulating it. I find most regulations are made thru ignorance. Just my opinion.
 
great input guys. Yup, sometimes what you want is LESS visibility, not MORE. If it bothers someone that not everyone will love them and/or their chosen hobby, then perhaps they have chosen the wrong hobby. Because let's face it: this is an odd-hobby that draws the stares of lookie-lou curious folk. You know: "oooh, look at the man with the geiger-counter thingie over there" and "gee, I wonder if he's finding anything?", and "I wonder if he'll leave holes", etc.... We simply are not going to escape that, and.... no.... "permits" do not solve that, they merely make it something for a bunch of desk-bound bureaucrats (who perhaps would never have even given the matter though before) to "sign off on" and "address", etc...

MD'ing is a little like nose-picking: Not illegal, but ......... for pete's sake, we all sort of .... uh... use a little discretion in our timing, and no one goes around asking for permission to pick one's nose. As long as you're discreet, odds are, no one cares or notices. Do I wish our hobby wasn't such a odd-ball thing? Sure! Do I wish archies loved me? SURE. But no, its not going to be that way. So ..... as long as we're not wearing a big-orange "x" on us, odds are, most of the time, you're just ignored. Let's keep it that way. The less visibility, the better.
 
..... also, with a permit system in place ...... they could (as some do) take all the stuff that you have found away from you !

So, no, not a good idea with the 'permit' / 'revenue collection' thing.
 
Around here in South Eastern PA the county requires a permit to detect in the county parks. It use to be free. This is the second year they are charging $10. They check your drivers licence when applying.
They also give us a piece of paper saying any historical items found has to be turned in to the office and there are a couple parks that detecting around the historical buildings is prohibited.

The game warden or park ranger (same thing) will stop and check to see if you have a permit.

Can you imagine taking a bucket of junk finds to the office and asking if they have a in-office archaeologist to check if this stuff is historical ? X all the detectorists in the county dropping of buckets...what a joke.

We don't need a permit to detect in the State parks you just have to stop in and get a verbal "OK" to hunt.
 
I don't think gold coins or bust halves are particularly "historical". Do you ?
 
Unfortunately, they're already doing it. It went to detect in an area of Las Vegas the other day. Stopped to read the voluminous "Park Rules." Way down at the bottom was, "No Digging. Metal detecting OK for surface items." As onerous as it may seem, licensing may be the only way to keep the bureaucrats from completely locking us out of public areas. And, it may be a way to educate some of the newer guys to keep them from
 
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