Tried 50 tone FC today!

[doc1964]

doc,

You say "If it's consistently high with a high audible tone then it's probably an iron false"

How high do you consider high?

This evening I tried the 50 with HT and an open screen except for the bottom. It was a very interesting experience. I went back and forth from it to the GH open Combined on six dug targets, 1-qtr, 2-dimes and 3 older pennys. It did really sing with that combination.

I will experiment some more. I moved up from a 705 where I used the 28 tones so it wasn't that strange. I had got lulled into the Combined by all the hype without really trying the 50; glad I finally took the time.

I would consider an FE number over 25 to be high. I run Andy's old coin discrimination pattern, so it tops out and starts nulling if it goes past 28. If I'm bumping that 27/28 FE number, then you can assume that there is iron in there somewhere for sure. If, when I switch over to ferrous-coin combined and it get solid iron grunting with little or no conductive response, then I walk.

Doc

 

[GateKeeper]

Hey Doc, you know it would be real helpful to some of the members if you could shoot a quick video showing an actual good/bad target in a real hunting situation. Thanks in advance.

 

[doc1964]

I'll have to do that - as soon as it stops raining!!!

BTW, if you want to try the mode in question, it's in the Resource Center for download (it's my "coins" mode).

Cheers

 

[GateKeeper]

I'll have to do that - as soon as it stops raining!!!

BTW, if you want to try the mode in question, it's in the Resource Center for download (it's my "coins" mode).

Cheers

I've got both

 

[martygene]

I dig a lot of nails in the 12-41 / 12-43 range too.. but I can't not dig those numbers even if I only get a one way tone...

 

[WildOutdoorAddict]

Exactly martygene..they sound to good to not dig..lol

 

[doc1964]

What separation mode are you guys running? I know that it has been well documented that running 50 tones with ferrous-coin or ground-coin the CTX can false with ferrous numbers near the 12 line - running high trash should give you a better idea of iron with high ferrous numbers.

 

[parkgt]

doc,

You said "I know that it has been well documented that running 50 tones with ferrous-coin or ground-coin the CTX can false with ferrous numbers near the 12 line"

Are you suggesting that running 50 tones is a factor in the falsing? I thought the tone profile only impacted how you hear alerts, not what alerts you hear or how real or false they are?

 

[Buried Crap NJ]

I don't get the combined use! Why would you take a machine and limit it to just 4 tones? I ran in combined for the first 2 months and found it so limited as compared with 50 tones. When you can get a pull tab to sound so much different than a coin in 50 tones, combined with a number readout it's a hunters real dream. If using 4 tones that same pull tab has to fall in one of your 25% area's of targets. In 50 tone it's 1/50th of you tones or there about's as they do tend to drift a little. But one thing always holds true is they just don't sound round and lack density! I dig few nails not sure the reason but I know they tend to be high and squealing!
BCNJ

 

[chuckciao]

Great point, I have been pondering the same point and remember how my finds improved on my 705 when I switched to multi tones. Based on this post, I have gone back and switched all of my modes to 50 tones Co.
HH
Chuck

I don't get the combined use! Why would you take a machine and limit it to just 4 tones? I ran in combined for the first 2 months and found it so limited as compared with 50 tones. When you can get a pull tab to sound so much different than a coin in 50 tones, combined with a number readout it's a hunters real dream. If using 4 tones that same pull tab has to fall in one of your 25% area's of targets. In 50 tone it's 1/50th of you tones or there about's as they do tend to drift a little. But one thing always holds true is they just don't sound round and lack density! I dig few nails not sure the reason but I know they tend to be high and squealing!
BCNJ

 

[doc1964]

doc,

You said "I know that it has been well documented that running 50 tones with ferrous-coin or ground-coin the CTX can false with ferrous numbers near the 12 line"

Are you suggesting that running 50 tones is a factor in the falsing? I thought the tone profile only impacted how you hear alerts, not what alerts you hear or how real or false they are?

On the CTX it appears that running that combination can lead to falsing - "Earthmansurfer" had some great videos early on (last spring/summer) showing nails falsing exactly like a good target in ferrous-coin separtation/50 conductive sounds (both audibly and number wise). The responses when using combined and FE-coin separation was much better at giving you accurate information and I got exactly the same results in my hundreds of hours on the CTX - I don't run 50 tones with FE-coin or ground-coin - only high trash (in my normal ground conditions). In my experience, the combined (5-tone) sounds are best used with the "new to the CTX" FE-coin and ground-coin separation modes. The 50 tone sounds are best used with the other separation modes (high trash, low trash).

 

[parkgt]

[No message]

 

[doc1964]

I didn't mean to take this too far into the weeds since these topics were discussed a lot last summer when we were trying to figure this beast out ;-)

I'm going off what was learned then and how it has affected how I hunt with it now (and I'm still learning). The combined tones feature is an outgrowth of the TTF mode that the E-Trac has - and on that machine it offered better separation in iron than multi-tone in many cases. The twist with the CTX is that now we have the added digital interplay with fe-coin and ground-coin modes. In my experience, these 2 modes are definitely an enhancement to the signalling versus the other separation modes - they just react to targets differently - even giving different target number pairs than the other modes and usually, cleaner signals.

This is why at the beginning of the post I said that I jump between my combined and my multi-tone modes for a different perspective - it really is like having 2 different machines in hand at the same time.

 

[parkgt]

doc,

Many of us were not around the CTX last summer and getting back into the weeds may not be a bad thing for some that are coming to the party a little later. This became evident recently when the "GB enable" thread showed how many misunderstood and misused that feature to the detriment of their detecting.

I have seen posts in which people mistakenly think that changing Tone Profiles changes how the CTX detects. Being very specific with some of this information allows those that want fully understand, know how the CTX works rather than just how to use it.

The manual lack clarity on both the how and the why of using the CTX in different ways. Too bad there is not a ML engineer participating on this forum to answer the more technical question that some of us have.

I continue to look for that clarity in my own understanding and hope other recent arrivals find it quickly.

Greg

 

[AngelicStorm]

This is why at the beginning of the post I said that I jump between my combined and my multi-tone modes for a different perspective - it really is like having 2 different machines in hand at the same time.

That is a very nice two center! Cool find, and I have never found one.

Doc,
I might have to start switching between modes on iffy targets or targets that aren't giving the best signal. So far I've mainly ran Combined Ferrous Coin mode.