Testing the Racer 5x10 and the Deus 9"

[JFlynn]

Here's what I see as part of the Turkish machines mystery. From most all our experiences you are not going to learn what either machine is telling you in under say 45-50 hrs use I don't care who you are. You definately won't learn what they are telling you with bad headgear or not using headgear at all. A lot of people started out using 2 tone on both machines. Great in clearer ground. 3 tone is very telling of whats there not unless you like to watch a TID screen which is required in 2 tone, a must. Here's the kicker.....trash is different to everyone, the amount of trash that is. Where I hunt most would run from fast! The idea that "oh it's a trashy place" is different in everyones eyes. If a ML machine will run there, imo and compared to where I hunt it isn't trashy at all. Matter of fact it would be like open field hunting to me if a ML will run there. It's what we are accustomed to as heavy trash. You gotta face it, that's where the abundance of coins are now, heavy trash. There isn't but a couple of machines that will handle that kind of trash made at this time no matter what coil you put on em and it's not who the user is either. Of course, you might find one or two, but a lot of people are finding a lot of stuff in heavy trash that has been hunted to death, using the Turkish machines. If you don't learn the audio and nuances of these machines you'll never know. The one common thing with people who have learned them is they are finding a lot of stuff where they had hunted previously before with the higher priced machines, me included. I do know the Turkish machines are no joke and from what I've seen and experienced they'll hunt behind any machine you want to bring, and you will be humbled before the session is over at what your non Turkish machines missed.

 

[Cal_Cobra]

Well said JFlynn. Just to add to that, I'm finding a lot of stuff in places I've already hunted with the Sovereign, Etrac, F70, F75, Omega, AT Pro, etc, and surprisingly a lot of the things are not that deep, 6"-7", with some being 8" or so, but many were just mixed in with trash that threw the other machines off and amazingly the Racer was able to pick them out. Were they great, 5 star, 4-way signals, many were not, but once you learn how the Racer sounds in these environments, the light bulb comes on and you're off to the Races (no pun intended)

 

[Low-Boy/LCPM]

I will go with two tone all. Day. Long

 

[Low-Boy/LCPM]

I think the racer is way better then a lot of top detectors on the market. I'll put in in the top five

 

[Southwind]

I think the racer is way better then a lot of top detectors on the market. I'll put in in the top five

And there is an example of the ridiculous claims I spoke of. Yes it is just a persons opinion. But a ridiculous claim none the less.

basstrackerman has it close. What you see as the cats meow I may see as a POS. That is exactly why I prefer to try each myself. But before I make the decision to give a detector a try I do lots and lots and lots or research looking for the one thing that tells me Its worth a try myself. That one thing is a VAST MAJORITY showing the results I'm looking for. Videos, I find great value in videos. As the y say "Some people can read War and Peace and come away thinking it’s a simple adventure story. Others can read the ingredients on a chewing gum wrapper and unlock the secrets of the universe." The think about a video is even though the person may be telling you one thing you see and hear another.

I've tested a hell of a lot of detectors in the last 40 years and while it may take 45-50 hours to be competent with a detector, you can get a good idea of a detector potential, good & bad with 12 good hard hours or less. Anyone with any time detecting with different detectors knows you can take a detector to most any worked out spot and find some missed goods. That does mean squat UNLESS it is done consistently by multiple people. I'm sure I don't need to convince anyone with any experience that the E-Trac stands out from the rest as a deep coin machine. The difference is it has proved its ability many many times over and over. That is the mark of a better than average machine.

Again I say, the Race is a fine machine. In my opinion a toe-to-toe with the AT Pro nothing more. I give the advantage to the Racer as a better relic machine and the advantage to the AT Pro as the better gold/beach machine. I personally found the AT Pro to be more comfortable to use for causal coin shooting in parks and schools as well.

 

[JFlynn]

And that is your opinion. You have people that didn't spend enough time to learn them and you have people who did. Not a ridiculous claim at all. Months ago you could have never told LB anything about the Racer was good then he bought one and spent the time with it. Several months, and it did what he thought it couldn't do. He learned it plain and simple.

I think the racer is way better then a lot of top detectors on the market. I'll put in in the top five

And there is an example of the ridiculous claims I spoke of. Yes it is just a persons opinion. But a ridiculous claim none the less.

basstrackerman has it close. What you see as the cats meow I may see as a POS. That is exactly why I prefer to try each myself. But before I make the decision to give a detector a try I do lots and lots and lots or research looking for the one thing that tells me Its worth a try myself. That one thing is a VAST MAJORITY showing the results I'm looking for. Videos, I find great value in videos. As the y say "Some people can read War and Peace and come away thinking it’s a simple adventure story. Others can read the ingredients on a chewing gum wrapper and unlock the secrets of the universe." The think about a video is even though the person may be telling you one thing you see and hear another.

I've tested a hell of a lot of detectors in the last 40 years and while it may take 45-50 hours to be competent with a detector, you can get a good idea of a detector potential, good & bad with 12 good hard hours or less. Anyone with any time detecting with different detectors knows you can take a detector to most any worked out spot and find some missed goods. That does mean squat UNLESS it is done consistently by multiple people. I'm sure I don't need to convince anyone with any experience that the E-Trac stands out from the rest as a deep coin machine. The difference is it has proved its ability many many times over and over. That is the mark of a better than average machine.

Again I say, the Race is a fine machine. In my opinion a toe-to-toe with the AT Pro nothing more. I give the advantage to the Racer as a better relic machine and the advantage to the AT Pro as the better gold/beach machine. I personally found the AT Pro to be more comfortable to use for causal coin shooting in parks and schools as well.

 

[squirrel1]

Southwind,

What's ridiculous about the claim? When you factor in everything---i.e. cost, ergonomics, performance. The gent may not be that far off the mark.

Southwind rather can calling someone's comments ridiculous, how about you telling us your top 5 detectors, and the reasons (in detail) for why they belong there.

You do seem to usually leave out a lot of details and make a lot of superficial statements when it come to detectors.

 

[Low-Boy/LCPM]

Thanks Jack...but yes the racer is a machine that was made the right way for the right hunter and a turn on and go machine with unmasking power for me hits a home run everytime and will be hard to beat for relic hunting

 

[squirrel1]

And Southwind,
You seem to be quick to point out your experience when trying to make your points. Consider this. What about some of the newer engineers who join the field??? Because of their inexperience, should they just pick up their marbles and go home??? Actually I think it's some of the lesser experienced engineers who operate out of a different box so to speak, bringing fresh ideas and thinking. Could the same be said about detectorists???

I think so!!!!!

 

[Southwind]

Southwind rather can calling someone's comments ridiculous, how about you telling us your top 5 detectors, and the reasons (in detail) for why they belong there.

Happy to! I understand what you're trying to say, but my point is you could also say the Ford Festia is "in the top 5" as long as you don't identify the kind of group. Yes, it gets much better gas mileage than the Corvette, Ford GT, Dodge Hell Cat or even the Mustang. Performance wise, it isn't even in the same class.

In my opinion, my top 5 choice is, In no particular order:

1. CTX 3030 New technology of being able to see AND identify more than one target at a time under the coil. Deepest accurate target ID'ing. Deep right out of the box. Water proof.
2. E-Trac Deep right out of the box. Still has no rival for deep and accurate target ID other than the CTX.
3. Deus best all-around machine out of the box. Accurate ID and deep. Great on gold where the CTX and E-Trac lack. Best ergonomics period.
4. V3i Most precise target ID on the market. Great solid reliable right out of the box. Typical Whites quality.
5. MXT All Pro Great performance at a budget level. Precise target ID and depth at a great price.

Each of these detector has proven to be above average depth and quality to me.

Now that is the class for performance and features. Take in to account the type of hunter I am. I am a very very selective hunter. That means accurate target ID at depth in one of my number one concerns. Now if you want to create a top 5 of the best for the money then I would agree 100% with the Racer being in there. Problem was the statement didn't specify this but insinuated all the market.

You seem to be quick to point out your experience when trying to make your points. Consider this. What about some of the newer engineers who join the field??? Because of their inexperience, should they just pick up their marbles and go home??? Actually I think it's some of the lesser experienced engineers who operate out of a different box so to speak, bringing fresh ideas and thinking. Could the same be said about detectorists???

Another good point! I agree fresh ideas are what often drives new technology. I only point out my experience as a reminder I've seen the evolution of detectors from almost the beginning. We haven't seen a major breakthrough in detector depth in 20 years. In the end they all pretty much can archive the same depth, in the same class. That is to say you're not going to get a $100 Radio Shack detector to perform along side the CTX 3030 no matter how much experience you have. That is the difference in classes. I've simply been trying to say I agree the Racer is top in its class, but in my opinion, not even in the same class as most top end machines.

 

[JFlynn]

Now that's where I differ in my thinking. I used the Deus in our places we hunt and couldn't keep up with the other machines you mentioned except the Whites, they won't run there. Dug way to much trash for a good target ratio with the Deus. After a few months the finds dried up so much that my other hunting partners didn't even want to hunt there. About a month before that I aquired the CoRe. Unbelievable at the amount of coins and buttons and jewelry the top end machines had missed, even myself. Standing in the same places I and several others had ran top end machines over many many times, I couldn't hardly move for digging coins and buttons and some jewelry. You've seen a couple of the videos and pics of the places/sidewalks. Can't for the life of me figured why these machines missed so much. Made a believer out of me and my hunting friends. That's some of what the people are seeing but maybe not to the extent I did. My experience was unreal and dead nuts on at what these are capable of. It's hard to swallow when I'm digging good stuff 3 to 6 inches deep that the top end money wise machines can't even see. It's a hard pill to swallow.

 

[squirrel1]

Okay Southwind appreciate your response.

I disagree with your statement about the V3i providing the best ID. In low mineral or inert soil yes, but in higher mineralized soil both Etrac and CTX dominate on coins.

Now I notice all but 1 of the detectors you listed are top dollar machines except MXT pro, but even it cost most than a Racer.

Question, will an MXT pro detect anything in the ground (with all detecting scenarios considered) that a Racer won't detect?.

And is there scenarios where the Racer will detect things in the ground that CTX, Etrac, and V3i can't. Coil size for coil size????

And I remind you of a you tube you posted where the Racer was singing on a 8" wheat I believe, and Etrac struggled.

How about this question.

Let's say a person only has $800 to spend and they want to be able to hunt as many different environments/scenarios they can with just one detector---a Vlf detector that does have All Metal.
Which one detector "new" would be the best choice for a person??

For hunting
Relics
Jewelry
Coins
Beach Wet sand
Beach Dry sand
Parks
Old home sites

 

[Southwind]

Well JFlynn, like I said before you can think you've hunted a spot to death and turn around with some no name machine and hit the jackpot.

Just a few weeks ago I took my new MXT All Pro out to a fort site my club has hunted with every imaginable machine. I myself have hunted it will everything, including the Racer, and on the rare occasion you might score a small lead shot or percussion cap. Took the MXT out there and went home with 5 small shot, a 50 cal ball and a button. All from a small hunted to death area. I think just having a different machine can often hit targets others have missed just because it's different? I don't know, it made no sense to me because the MXT All Pro, while a great machine, wouldn't hold a candle to the CTX or E-Trac in my city park.

squirrel1 my reference to the V3i's ID was precise not accurate. The difference being on shallower targets the ID could tell a clad dime from a silver with no trouble. Or it could tell a silver quarter from clad with no problem. Get below 6" and the V3i starts having accuracy issues but then the vast majority of the schools and parks I hunt the targets are 6" or less.

Question, will an MXT pro detect anything in the ground (with all detecting scenarios considered) that a Racer won't detect?.

In my honest opinion, yes. While the Racer is killer on higher conductive targets and matches well with the MXT in that area, when it comes to small odd shaped gold and prospecting the MXT is the clear winner. The Ground Grab is really the MXT All Pro's claim to fame. Put's it head above many higher end machines where GB really counts. That and Whites, even the DFX, are just killer tot lot/gold machines. Of course the being precise comes from the number of target segments. THe more there are the more precise it can be. THe DFX has like 199 and the MXT has 198 if I remember right.

And I remind you of a you tube you posted where the Racer was singing on a 8" wheat I believe, and Etrac struggled.

Very true. There is no silver bullet. On my test garden I have a quarter at around 7" only a few detectors have hit and the Racer is one. This target is very surrounded by old rusted iron. Not the cheap trick rusted nail test you see on Youtube a lot, but rusted nails that have been in the ground for 50+ years. Big difference. Yes the Racer is a killer machine in that environment for the money,

Let's say a person only has $800 to spend and they want to be able to hunt as many different environments/scenarios they can with just one detector---a Vlf detector that does have All Metal.
Which one detector "new" would be the best choice for a person??

For hunting
Relics
Jewelry
Coins
Beach Wet sand
Beach Dry sand
Parks
Old home sites

In that scenario the Racer would be one of my top choices. Key here being "New". But I'd also put the AT Pro right there with it and my experience was it was the better gold machine. By quite a bit.

 

[squirrel1]

Southwind,
Now this is the kind of information folks want to read. And you actually talked about a few detectors and never bashed any of them---commendable!!!!

And this 14khz Racer op freq vs 15khz on MXT may be the reason for the slight differences/advantages the 2 detectors offer to folks.

I realize it does take more time to put more info out to folks, but it's worth it IMO.

Again thanks for the info Southwind.

 

[Southwind]

Now this is the kind of information folks want to read. And you actually talked about a few detectors and never bashed any of them---commendable!!!!

My intent is to never bash any detector as I feel they all can do the user right IF used and setup properly. What some may call bashing I call telling it like it is. I mean I'm not one of those people who reviews some POS detector and all they have to say is the good stuff like "It has one of the best handles I've held" Or "I just love the knob placement". If I feel its a POS I don't beat around the bush I call it a POS. Not bashing but being honest in my opinion. I do that because that's what I want to hear. Their honest opinion not some watered down review.

 

[squirrel1]

Understand Southwind, and my commenting about "not bashing" was not meant as an insinuation but rather show how detectors can be talked about in the same post without in fact---bashing.

 

[Southwind]

Got'cha!

I actually got great respect for Makro and the Racer. They have indeed, in my opinion, raised the bar for both the mid-level and high-end detector lines as far as depth. It used to be, and I'm not bashing any particular detectors, With the entry level machines you could expect 5-6" reliably, the Mid-Level was 7-8" and at the High-End 10"+. The Racer is knocking at the backdoor of those High-End machines when it comes to raw depth. Now as far as features that's a whole other ballgame. The good part is that challenges the High-End to improve. If you're all about depth why spend $1000+? I just happen to be a feather guy. Being a selective hunter requires a high-end discrimination system. What I like so much about the DFX/V3i and the E-Trac is being able to turn on or off any single one of the target segments.

 

[Davethejunky]

BUT....... Did they hit for the same price?

 

[steve herschbach]

Southwind, you say:

"While the Racer is killer on higher conductive targets and matches well with the MXT in that area, when it comes to small odd shaped gold and prospecting the MXT is the clear winner."

I would like to know your real world basis for this comment. How much gold prospecting have you done in the field with the Racer versus the MXT?