Hi folks,I'm a newbie here and I've got a problem, my Tesoro Cibola was delivered today so I thought I would try some air tests, while I was trying out the pin point function I put a half crown about 2 inches away from the centre of the coil, the machine gave out a low tone for about a second then went quiet, it keeps on doing this and won't give a constant tone when the coin is still near the centre of the coil with the pin point button still pressed down. Have any of you guys found this with Tesoro machines? my old Ace 250 would keep a constant tone until I took my finger off the pin point button, is there a problem with the machine? All help appreciated. Alan
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Tesoro pinpointing problem, help please
- Thread starter agmcg81
- Start date
agmcg81 said:
So, what the detector is doing is tuning itself to your half crown. Sweep the half crown across the width of the coil crossing the centre of the coil. The design of the detector requires motion across the coil. It does not take much motion, but the target needs to move across the width of the coil. Hold it still and the detector tunes to the target and it goes silent. Move the target in the detection field of the coil and it will make a sound.
Hope that helps.
Cheers,
tvr
WV62
Well-known member
From the manual, it looks like PP mode is non-motion to me. I copied and pasted from the manual see below.
OPERATING TECHNIQUES - FIELD USE
Pinpointing a Target
When pinpointing a target, the ALL METAL Mode can offer advantages over the DISCRIMINATE Mode, such as no false signals and no need to move the searchcoil to get a target response.
A good method for pinpointing in ALL METAL Mode is
OPERATING TECHNIQUES - FIELD USE
Pinpointing a Target
When pinpointing a target, the ALL METAL Mode can offer advantages over the DISCRIMINATE Mode, such as no false signals and no need to move the searchcoil to get a target response.
A good method for pinpointing in ALL METAL Mode is
Just re-read the manual and then tried my Cibola to make sure. The manual does not match what the Cibola really does. With the Cibola in all-metal more (pin-point) if the target is held stationary, over the coil, the Cibola retunes and the tone stops. With very little motion, the detector sounds on the target. It does take some motion, but not much.
It looks like where the manual says "no need to move the searchcoil to get a target response" is not accurate. It does take a little bit of movement.
Cheers,
tvr
It looks like where the manual says "no need to move the searchcoil to get a target response" is not accurate. It does take a little bit of movement.
Cheers,
tvr
WV62
Well-known member
tvr said:
That can sure make it hard to learn a new machine. Not sure all Tesoro's work the same, but I was looking through the manual on the the Tejon that I have coming and both of its all metal modes are motion. So not saying the Cibola is the same, but it would seem that it could be the same as the Tejon. Good work tvr and thanks for going the extra mile, clearly you have found agmcg81's pin pointing problem. Now for the 2 post quoting the manual one being mine just forget those and go with the other guys posting on motion.
Good luck,
Ron in WV
Alan,
I have the same thing with my Vaq - it 'auto tunes' in the pinpointing mode, and quiets down to the threshold when held stationary over a target.
'Detuning' (if I understand what I think you mean), requires a detector that has no motion all metal AND a switch or push button that resets the tune. This would allow the user to 'retune' the detector ( in all metal) to the barely audible threshold setting while over the target. Moving off the target now, the detector goes quiet. The only signal you here now should be directly under the center of the coil.
Auto tune's big benefit is the elimination of threshold creep, keeping a consistent threshold when using all the all metal mode. It also prevents manual detuning.
-Ric
I have the same thing with my Vaq - it 'auto tunes' in the pinpointing mode, and quiets down to the threshold when held stationary over a target.
'Detuning' (if I understand what I think you mean), requires a detector that has no motion all metal AND a switch or push button that resets the tune. This would allow the user to 'retune' the detector ( in all metal) to the barely audible threshold setting while over the target. Moving off the target now, the detector goes quiet. The only signal you here now should be directly under the center of the coil.
Auto tune's big benefit is the elimination of threshold creep, keeping a consistent threshold when using all the all metal mode. It also prevents manual detuning.
-Ric
Guys, if you don't believe me about the non-motion pinpoint, maybe you'd believe Andy Sabisch http://www.losttreasure.com/content/archives/tesoro-electronics-cibola. I'm not one of the heavyweights someone in this thread referred to, but I did own a Cibola for a couple of years and I know what mine did.
johnnywayne
New member
I would take your word over "the heavyweights" any day of the week, heck I would even take a person who has detected for 2 minutes over said "Heavyweight"
My El Dorado retune's over a object aswell if left over a object for an extended period (especially on large objects and good objects at surface), it is working as intended
Well considering I can't post a link to a site that explains the issue for some reason...Google: VCO-style metal detecting and about the seventh link down stating pinpointing targets will explain it to you.
My El Dorado retune's over a object aswell if left over a object for an extended period (especially on large objects and good objects at surface), it is working as intended
Well considering I can't post a link to a site that explains the issue for some reason...Google: VCO-style metal detecting and about the seventh link down stating pinpointing targets will explain it to you.
MarkCZ
Well-known member
Canewrap said:
I'm getting the idea that there isn't any "Tesoro" company people on this forum (Big Guns, or Heavy Weight, ect..) that check in from time to time like on some of the other forum's here.
Also, I know from time to time the people who work out the manual's or the final draft of it will sometimes not come across with the information very well at all! and sometimes it can be down right confusing
Mark
Alan,
The Cibola is identical to my Vaq with the exception of manual ground balance (external adjustment) and All Metal mode, so I did some quick testing to see if I could replicate your issue. From what I've been able to determine, this is most likely 'Auto Retune' rather than motion, although motion plays a part in this.
Set your your detectors threshold to an audible hum while pressing the pinpointing button. Now, while holding in the pinpointing button, put the crown a few inches from the coil, resting your hand/arm on the pole. This will insure you're 'stationary', and limit movement. Almost immediately. ...and if you're holding still. ...the detector should 'retune' to the audible threshold you initially set. Next, if you quickly move the crown outside the area of the coil, you will hear the detector go quiet momentarily, then retune back to the threshold. This lets you know that the detector WAS picking up the target, but that the auto tune feature adjusted the signal you were getting back to the threshold you initially set. Lastly. ...if it goes totally quiet when holding the crown stationary under the coil, that's another issue and most likely a problem for Tesoro to look at.
Auto Tune's big benefit is the ability to keep the threshold adjusted to your preferred setting, compensating for 'creep' or 'drift' when using the All Metal mode. This is something that occurs for a multitude of reasons (ground matrix change, shade to sun, etc), and was compensated on earlier models with a manual retuning button or toggle switch to 'retune'. Auto Tune's function is to continually analyze the matrix under the coil and make any adjustments necessary to keep the threshold at your setting. It does not however, react quickly enough to compensate for targets while sweeping, and minimal motion is all that is required while hunting to overcome it's affects.
Yes. ..motion is required to 'vary' the audible input you're getting when hunting or pinpointing targets. But, even without motion, you should still have audible over the target. ....it's just that Auto Tune is attempting to reset the signal to threshold, and if the target remains stationary under the coil long enough, it will.
Hope that helps-
-Ric
The Cibola is identical to my Vaq with the exception of manual ground balance (external adjustment) and All Metal mode, so I did some quick testing to see if I could replicate your issue. From what I've been able to determine, this is most likely 'Auto Retune' rather than motion, although motion plays a part in this.
Set your your detectors threshold to an audible hum while pressing the pinpointing button. Now, while holding in the pinpointing button, put the crown a few inches from the coil, resting your hand/arm on the pole. This will insure you're 'stationary', and limit movement. Almost immediately. ...and if you're holding still. ...the detector should 'retune' to the audible threshold you initially set. Next, if you quickly move the crown outside the area of the coil, you will hear the detector go quiet momentarily, then retune back to the threshold. This lets you know that the detector WAS picking up the target, but that the auto tune feature adjusted the signal you were getting back to the threshold you initially set. Lastly. ...if it goes totally quiet when holding the crown stationary under the coil, that's another issue and most likely a problem for Tesoro to look at.
Auto Tune's big benefit is the ability to keep the threshold adjusted to your preferred setting, compensating for 'creep' or 'drift' when using the All Metal mode. This is something that occurs for a multitude of reasons (ground matrix change, shade to sun, etc), and was compensated on earlier models with a manual retuning button or toggle switch to 'retune'. Auto Tune's function is to continually analyze the matrix under the coil and make any adjustments necessary to keep the threshold at your setting. It does not however, react quickly enough to compensate for targets while sweeping, and minimal motion is all that is required while hunting to overcome it's affects.
Yes. ..motion is required to 'vary' the audible input you're getting when hunting or pinpointing targets. But, even without motion, you should still have audible over the target. ....it's just that Auto Tune is attempting to reset the signal to threshold, and if the target remains stationary under the coil long enough, it will.
Hope that helps-
-Ric
WV62 said:
Tejon re-tunes faster in both all-metal modes than the Cibola does. Slowing down the all-metal retune on the Tejon is one thing I would like changed on the Tejon.
MarkCZ said:
Yes it does that, but hold the target absolutely still at the center of the coil and the target goes silent and all that is left is the little bit of threshold hum that was set up prior to placing the target in the coil's field.
Maybe Robert (allcav) can provide some insight on the retune or motion / no motion discrepancy between the manual and what at least some of us experience with the Cibola.
Cheers,
tvr
Try detuning.....as it may help as it usually works with any unit......simply when you get the signal move the coil to the side and double clutch the pinpoint button several times and while holding button in go over the target. It should detune(make the signal smaller) and easier to pinpoint...
Great question, great observation. The Vaquero operates the same way. The term "Non-motion" is not entirely accurate. Although it does appear to be truly non-motion, the slightest motion, and I mean slightest, will make the detector sound out. You will also find that if you hold the coin outside of the coil field and then pass it in front of the coil, the sound drops out once you pass the center point - perfectly normal as well. By the way this is exactly how my Whites MXT operates. It's great your taking a good look at your detector and although many don't feel "air tests" are valid, here is an example of why they have their place. Keep doing what you're doing and really get to know your detector, it will improve your overall success.