Question on Pinpoint re-tune on Vaquero

[DigDugNY]

So I decided to try to bury a silver dime in the ground to see how my Vaquero would pick it up now that my coils are re-tuned. I used the stock coil and in an air test it would pick up at 11" maxed out, but when I buried it at 7", I could barely pick it up maxed out. I know that it hadn't been in the ground long enough to form a halo or anything, but does anyone have any numbers of how much a difference that makes? The weird thing though, and this pertains to my question is that I would get like one or two beeps going over it, but then the signal would go away...then I would press the pinpoint button for a second and then go back over it and it would pick it up again, this time as a constant beep..but then if i changed a setting, like DISC or something, it would go away again and then pressing the pinpoint button would bring the signal back. I can't see this as an effective way of picking up signals...has anyone else noticed this? Next time I'm out detecting, if i get a signal for a couple beeps and then it goes away, should I just press the pinpoint button and then go back over it? is that a re-tune or something?

 

[Rainyday101]

Freshly buried coins are a waste of time. You disturbed the ground matrix and the coin has not been in the ground long enough. Been their and tried it.

I think the pinpoint button puts the detector in all metal mode, which does not use discrimination, giving you more depth. This could be why you are picking it up with the pinpoint button.

 

[DigDugNY]

Freshly buried coins are a waste of time. You disturbed the ground matrix and the coin has not been in the ground long enough. Been their and tried it.

I think the pinpoint button puts the detector in all metal mode, which does not use discrimination, giving you more depth. This could be why you are picking it up with the pinpoint button.

The thing is I'm not holding the button in when I go back over the target...I just press it quick and then do it and it seems to pick up the target better. Idk, its just something I observed

 

[Habanero]

Hmm, sounds a little like there is some outlaw dna in there now with that button.

 

[DigDugNY]

Hmm, sounds a little like there is some outlaw dna in there now with that button.

Yea it's weird. I never noticed it before. So now I'm wondering if some of those signals that go off like twice and disappear are actually some deeper silver coins. So now I'm wondering if i press the pinpoint button quick and go back over them, if they will come out clearer and stuff

 

[SpiritRelic]

If not supertuned it is good to listen to the target in all metal.The button does nothing but switch to fast tune all metal.If you want deep coins i would supertune the vaq some and see how that works for you.Keep up the good observations.Nice find on the Reale bobby! Keep up the search. :-D

 

[DigDugNY]

If not supertuned it is good to listen to the target in all metal.The button does nothing but switch to fast tune all metal.If you want deep coins i would supertune the vaq some and see how that works for you.Keep up the good observations.Nice find on the Reale bobby! Keep up the search. :-D

That's what I'm confused about, but that's what it was doing. I tried turning up the sensitivity after it happened and it would do the same thing...because I changed the setting it would only beep once or twice, then I would press the pinpoint button, let go, go back over the target an it would be a clear signal again

 

[Monte]

So I decided to try to bury a silver dime in the ground to see how my Vaquero would pick it up now that my coils are re-tuned.

I read this far and just knew what was coming .... I know that several times year I get approached in person or by phone or in an e-mail from someone discussing the concept of fresh-burying a coin in the ground t compare signal response as well s depth. Sometimes, it is brought up more than once in a single week, and even by two or three people looking for either an answer, or someone to judge the winner of their small group debate (discussion).

1st problem: You are commenting on burying a coin in a ground matrix that almost every reader is unfamiliar with, since we don't all live and hunt in the same ground conditions you have. They could be very mild, moderate, or downright nasty.

2nd problem: We, the readers, are not there to see and check and compare the actual coin position and depth, and the control settings, the sweep speed and search coil presentation.

I used the stock coil and in an air test it would pick up at 11" maxed out, ....

It's an "Air Test", which is fine, kind-of. I use Air Tests to do some rough checks of a detector and coils, but I also know they are simply tests of a target w/o any influence of the ground mineral signal. Also, I know that any 'test' should be done with settings AND TARGET MOTION SPEED that is considered 'average' for general detecting.

Most of the time when I see a video or actual "air test demonstration," it is done with a target that is literally whipped back-and-forth past the search coil at ridiculous speeds. So, not only is there no ground signal to influence the overall detector performance, but the unaffected target is presented in a manner that just can't happen in real-life metal detecting. That produces a result that can not be fairly compared with a buried sample target and leads to frustration with a detector's performance when, in reality, the results on a buried sample would be just normal.

... but when I buried it at 7", I could barely pick it up maxed out.

Any "fresh bury" target can be difficult to get a signal on, usually due to the disturbed ground compared with the adjacent ground that's not disturbed. In reality, we go out and hunt for targets that have been buried for a prolonged period of time. As such, they are usually located in an undisturbed position and all f the surrounding ground has a uniform matrix. Additionally, there is the stark reality that most coins are found in the surface-to-4" range. Targets that are deeper, over 4" and to the 5" rang, are really close to mid-depth, and when I find any coin or trade token or similar sized target at an honest 6" to 8" depth, I consider that to be a deep coin. Coins at 7" o more are very, very uncommon in the overall picture of lost coin positions.

I know that it hadn't been in the ground long enough to form a halo or anything, ...

Tree's a topic that has been over-used and wrongly touted. Common coins, made of gold, silver, copper, bronze, and even our US coins with a heavy amount of nickel, do not create a 'halo.' This is a topic that comes up a lot and is often contributed to be folks who haven't got a clue what really takes place, they just state something they have heard that is based more on rumor than reality.

... but does anyone have any numbers of how much a difference that makes?

The difference between a test target in an 'Air Test' and a same sampled target is the ground is generally quite noticeable.

The weird thing though, and this pertains to my question is that I would get like one or two beeps going over it, but then the signal would go away...then I would press the pinpoint button for a second and then go back over it and it would pick it up again, this time as a constant beep..but then if i changed a setting, like DISC or something, it would go away again and then pressing the pinpoint button would bring the signal back. I can't see this as an effective way of picking up signals...has anyone else noticed this? Next time I'm out detecting, if i get a signal for a couple beeps and then it goes away, should I just press the pinpoint button and then go back over it? is that a re-tune or something?

Set the Sensitivity and Discrimination level where you want them and do not tinker with them during a search. Leave the Disc. control where you want it from the start and don't change it or "thumb" the control to check a located target.

Then, one you have a signal in the Disc. mode, simply move the coil to the side a little keeping it close to he ground. Then press-and-hold the Pinpoint button while you cross the target to size-and-shape it and to Pinpoint the target. Once the target is recovered, continue hunting, but don't mess with the controls. The only one you might need to tinker with is the Ground Balance control, and only if the GB setting isn't right because the ground mineral has changed.

Quirky things can happen with some models on the market just because of some glitches in the circuitry design. We generally can't correct them, but we can learn what they are and deal with them until we get a better detector in our hands that is more 'problem free.'

Monte

 

[SpiritRelic]

If not supertuned it is good to listen to the target in all metal.The button does nothing but switch to fast tune all metal.If you want deep coins i would supertune the vaq some and see how that works for you.Keep up the good observations.Nice find on the Reale bobby! Keep up the search. :-D

That's what I'm confused about, but that's what it was doing. I tried turning up the sensitivity after it happened and it would do the same thing...because I changed the setting it would only beep once or twice, then I would press the pinpoint button, let go, go back over the target an it would be a clear signal again

Keep up the observations bobby,you could have a glitch with that vaquero.Try to figure out what is going on?.Could you make a vid on what it is doing?.Could be mineral ground,and the stock coil will not cut it or something?.May be something simple,but with electronics anything could happen.A bad solder joint.Check it good,hunt it and see.

 

[GunnarMN]

Bobby i get what your saying , scaning in disc, you can not get the coin, you press the pinpoint and let off so you are back in disc, and now you get the coin , sounds to me like its retuning , kinda like the outlaw, I do not find much diffrence in a fresh buried coin or one that has set for a wile. what do you do if you hunt a fresh plowed farm feild, ? thats like freshly buring a coin , but we still find them . I do not own a vaq but keep us informed of your observations.

 

[Idxpro]

Hmm, sounds a little like there is some outlaw dna in there now with that button.

Lol..

 

[DigDugNY]

Then, one you have a signal in the Disc. mode, simply move the coil to the side a little keeping it close to he ground. Then press-and-hold the Pinpoint button while you cross the target to size-and-shape it and to Pinpoint the target. Once the target is recovered, continue hunting, but don't mess with the controls. The only one you might need to tinker with is the Ground Balance control, and only if the GB setting isn't right because the ground mineral has changed.
Monte

The thing is I usually have the threshold set high enough to where I can't do an effective pinpoint without it blasting my ear. That's the reason why I only pressed it quick and then went back over it, but what confuses me is it was picking up the signal clearer when doing so..i didn't have to hold it down....the only thing i can think is that it had a delay or something or elle has some glitch where it retunes itself. I usually keep my settings set high, but if you have a good reference point of where I should have my settings, I'd appreciate it. I never realized how much the threshold can make a difference, that's why I keep it high.

But I really hope there isn't some sort of glitch because I just got my Vaquero back from the factory not too long ago

 

[DigDugNY]

If not supertuned it is good to listen to the target in all metal.The button does nothing but switch to fast tune all metal.If you want deep coins i would supertune the vaq some and see how that works for you.Keep up the good observations.Nice find on the Reale bobby! Keep up the search. :-D

That's what I'm confused about, but that's what it was doing. I tried turning up the sensitivity after it happened and it would do the same thing...because I changed the setting it would only beep once or twice, then I would press the pinpoint button, let go, go back over the target an it would be a clear signal again

Keep up the observations bobby,you could have a glitch with that vaquero.Try to figure out what is going on?.Could you make a vid on what it is doing?.Could be mineral ground,and the stock coil will not cut it or something?.May be something simple,but with electronics anything could happen.A bad solder joint.Check it good,hunt it and see.

I may have to make a video at some point and see what happens, its just weird

 

[Hombre]

Great post Monte

Bobby s.......Monte hit it out of the park with his answer, there is nothing wrong with your Vaquero. Freshly buried coins are worse than an air test as you are dealing with disturbed mineralized soil on top of the buried coin. Now..... if you buried that coin at 4 or 5 inches, you might get a signal. I have a coin garden that is 14 years old with the big silver coins like half dollar and dollar going down to a foot deep. It took several years for them to settle in to the surrounding soil so that I could get a decent signal on the the deeper coins. I can guarantee you that it was not a "halo" around the coins that made the coins detectable. It is simply that long time buried coins (real finds) found in their natural, undisturbed soil matrix are more easily detected. On the other hand air pockets and disturbed soil would make it harder to detect a freshly buried coin, especially if the coin is buried too deep.

So I decided to try to bury a silver dime in the ground to see how my Vaquero would pick it up now that my coils are re-tuned.

I read this far and just knew what was coming .... I know that several times year I get approached in person or by phone or in an e-mail from someone discussing the concept of fresh-burying a coin in the ground t compare signal response as well s depth. Sometimes, it is brought up more than once in a single week, and even by two or three people looking for either an answer, or someone to judge the winner of their small group debate (discussion).

1st problem: You are commenting on burying a coin in a ground matrix that almost every reader is unfamiliar with, since we don't all live and hunt in the same ground conditions you have. They could be very mild, moderate, or downright nasty.

2nd problem: We, the readers, are not there to see and check and compare the actual coin position and depth, and the control settings, the sweep speed and search coil presentation.

I used the stock coil and in an air test it would pick up at 11" maxed out, ....

It's an "Air Test", which is fine, kind-of. I use Air Tests to do some rough checks of a detector and coils, but I also know they are simply tests of a target w/o any influence of the ground mineral signal. Also, I know that any 'test' should be done with settings AND TARGET MOTION SPEED that is considered 'average' for general detecting.

Most of the time when I see a video or actual "air test demonstration," it is done with a target that is literally whipped back-and-forth past the search coil at ridiculous speeds. So, not only is there no ground signal to influence the overall detector performance, but the unaffected target is presented in a manner that just can't happen in real-life metal detecting. That produces a result that can not be fairly compared with a buried sample target and leads to frustration with a detector's performance when, in reality, the results on a buried sample would be just normal.

... but when I buried it at 7", I could barely pick it up maxed out.

Any "fresh bury" target can be difficult to get a signal on, usually due to the disturbed ground compared with the adjacent ground that's not disturbed. In reality, we go out and hunt for targets that have been buried for a prolonged period of time. As such, they are usually located in an undisturbed position and all f the surrounding ground has a uniform matrix. Additionally, there is the stark reality that most coins are found in the surface-to-4" range. Targets that are deeper, over 4" and to the 5" rang, are really close to mid-depth, and when I find any coin or trade token or similar sized target at an honest 6" to 8" depth, I consider that to be a deep coin. Coins at 7" o more are very, very uncommon in the overall picture of lost coin positions.

I know that it hadn't been in the ground long enough to form a halo or anything, ...

Tree's a topic that has been over-used and wrongly touted. Common coins, made of gold, silver, copper, bronze, and even our US coins with a heavy amount of nickel, do not create a 'halo.' This is a topic that comes up a lot and is often contributed to be folks who haven't got a clue what really takes place, they just state something they have heard that is based more on rumor than reality.

... but does anyone have any numbers of how much a difference that makes?

The difference between a test target in an 'Air Test' and a same sampled target is the ground is generally quite noticeable.

The weird thing though, and this pertains to my question is that I would get like one or two beeps going over it, but then the signal would go away...then I would press the pinpoint button for a second and then go back over it and it would pick it up again, this time as a constant beep..but then if i changed a setting, like DISC or something, it would go away again and then pressing the pinpoint button would bring the signal back. I can't see this as an effective way of picking up signals...has anyone else noticed this? Next time I'm out detecting, if i get a signal for a couple beeps and then it goes away, should I just press the pinpoint button and then go back over it? is that a re-tune or something?

Set the Sensitivity and Discrimination level where you want them and do not tinker with them during a search. Leave the Disc. control where you want it from the start and don't change it or "thumb" the control to check a located target.

Then, one you have a signal in the Disc. mode, simply move the coil to the side a little keeping it close to he ground. Then press-and-hold the Pinpoint button while you cross the target to size-and-shape it and to Pinpoint the target. Once the target is recovered, continue hunting, but don't mess with the controls. The only one you might need to tinker with is the Ground Balance control, and only if the GB setting isn't right because the ground mineral has changed.

Quirky things can happen with some models on the market just because of some glitches in the circuitry design. We generally can't correct them, but we can learn what they are and deal with them until we get a better detector in our hands that is more 'problem free.'

Monte

 

[MarkCZ]

Fresh buried coins to work ring need to season a long time before they work right, if they ever do?
The Vaquero I had will hit one of my OLDER buried 6" nickels EASY and with the setting cranked way back. But if I move over to the fresher buried 7" nickels it just clicks and pops a little even cranked up!

I have found that coins buried down to around 4" will work fine, but beyond that and fresh buried its gets iffy.
Now I have an even older 8" garden (in the same yard) and the Vaquero did fine with those, I did have to crank up the settings, but not super tuned.

I don't believe its halo around coins (maybe zinc'ers) as it is disturbed soil.

My 8" garden is now well over two years old.

Mark

 

[DigDugNY]

The only reason why I really mentioned the situation of how i had the coin buried and stuff was so you knew my reference point and where I was coming from. I'm more concerned/confused with why this "re-tune" or whatever you want to call it was occurring on a Vaquero. I might have given up many a good deeper targets because my detector would only pick them up for one or two beeps then they disappear, which in that case many people would probably pass those up and now im finding out that by pressing the pinpoint button quickly and letting go, then going back over the area where I got the signal, it comes back and it is clear and solid. But then i wouldnt be able to change my settiings to further judge what it could be because the signal would disappear again until I pressed the pinpoint button again. That doesn't seem right to me that I would have to do that, but the next time I go out and hunt I'll have to see if it might find me deeper stuff. I have my threshold set high and that's why I can't just hold the pinpoint button down and keep it down to go back over it.

I know it sounds really confusing and I'm tryin my best to explain it. I may have to make a video to show it firsthand. I just didnt know if anyone else noticed this on theirs.

 

[SpiritRelic]

I know what might be your problem bobby.The vaquero has a very fast retune all metal speed,meaning the vaquero requires fairy fast movement of the coil.While holding the button you have to really sweep.I dought you missed anything.Do some test outside,in disc mode,all metal mode,put a coin on the ground and hit the pinpoint button.You could have a problem ,but i hope not.Bury some coins.Is your soil minerialized ?If you hunt in high iron areas ,deep iron can do funny things.Don't sweat it,it's covered.To me,disc mode hits better than all metal anyway. :-D

 

[atomicscott]

So I decided to try to bury a silver dime in the ground to see how my Vaquero would pick it up now that my coils are re-tuned. I used the stock coil and in an air test it would pick up at 11" maxed out, but when I buried it at 7", I could barely pick it up maxed out. I know that it hadn't been in the ground long enough to form a halo or anything, but does anyone have any numbers of how much a difference that makes? The weird thing though, and this pertains to my question is that I would get like one or two beeps going over it, but then the signal would go away...then I would press the pinpoint button for a second and then go back over it and it would pick it up again, this time as a constant beep..but then if i changed a setting, like DISC or something, it would go away again and then pressing the pinpoint button would bring the signal back. I can't see this as an effective way of picking up signals...has anyone else noticed this? Next time I'm out detecting, if i get a signal for a couple beeps and then it goes away, should I just press the pinpoint button and then go back over it? is that a re-tune or something?

Yep Bobby, I noticed the same thing. If I were out in the field would I dig a signal that beeped twice then disappeared? Probably not, I would assume it's just trying to disc out trash. Maybe someone from Tesoro could chime in?...

 

[atomicscott]

Woo! More "problem free"? That is saying alot in very few words!

 

[Rainyday101]

The only time you will get a halo effect on buried is with ferrous metal, iron. Coins do not produce a true halo effect.