Question on pinpoint on ace 250

[ohio fred]

When i read backward hunting i couldn't figure out how he could listen to signal all the time.Then my brother law Tim dude says the pinpoint sound is only when it is over a target other wise quite.Mine no matter when you push the pin point on the ground or in the air i get the sound,it get louder over a target and Will stop when i use it for pinpointing over a target.But no matter when i push the pinpoint button i get a pinpoint tone is this correct?anyone check for me and tell me if this is correct.Thanks

 

[ohio fred]

I need to know the answer because I might send it in to have it looked at. I appreciate any comments. Thanks!

 

[MikeW]

Mine mostly gets the tone in the air when I press pinpoint and sometimes not.Pinpoint works either way, with or without a tone.It will get louder over a target.Havent even read the manual yet so I dont know for sure what the correct answer is)

 

[Uncle Willy]

Actually when you hold the pinpoint button down all the time you are in full threshold and will get a constant hum. When you encounter a target you will then get the full pinpoint sound or belltone. It's sort of like hunting with the old BFO's.

Bill

 

[Uncle Willy]

I answered it.

Bill

 

[BigCatDaddy]

I still can't figure out why anyone would hunt while holding the pinpoint button down. They just weren't designed to do this, I'm thinkin'. I've learned over time, if you push a device or tool past the limits of it's design, pretty soon you have an expensive piece of scrap. The extra little bit of depth you might gain for a few coins couldn't be worth the price you will eventually pay. Just my 2 Zinkers worth!!

 

[ohio fred]

My brother in law is silent when you push the pin point button until a target.Mine when you push button is always on,I don't really backward hunt,but it brought to mind i might need a tune up on my machine.Thanks

 

[ohio fred]

n/t

 

[Uncle Willy]

I would imagine it sucks up batteries pretty fast also.

Bill

 

[Danimal]

Bill has it right. When running the ACE in pinpoint, it makes a slight hum, depending on several things: mineralization of the soil and the height the coil is from the ground when pinpoint is depressed. Moisture content seems to affect the tone as well. It is common when I hunt this way (which, BTW, is NOT all the time...it depends on how many trashy targets are around) for the "hum" to drop off after several sweeps. I just stop the coil, depress again to get the tone I want, and sweep again. Sometimes I have to depress each sweep.
Two things here: The main reson I do this is because, with the ACE, when hunting "normally", especially with sens turned all the way up, the computer 'decides" when to sound one of the three tones based on a LOT of data coming in. Depending on soil type, this means a LOT of chatter and false tones are thrown out (again, with sens cranked) and it's EASY to miss a GOOD tone during the course of an afternoon's chatter, NOT reversing the sweep to see if the tone's worth focusing on, changing sweep directions on and detrmining if a dig is warranted.
When running in pinpoint, it's easy to home in quickly on REAL targets...and hear ALL targets in a sweep, and release for a decent ID attempt.
As to how this affects the machine's reliability, so far so good (6 months, and the coil's battered and bruised) Early on when writing about this, I did voice my concern about the pinpoint button itself going bad and the need to convert it to a switch. Again, so far so good.
To repeat, when soil type and lack of trash allows a "normal" hunt WITHOUT turning sens down (and losing depth) and WITHOUT tons of false beeps and chatter, I hunt "normally".
I think I am doing rather well as far as results, having only been swinging since Jan 2006.
-Silver count is at 21 coins, with 9 mercs, 2 barber dimes, 4 rosies, 2 washingtons, 1 SLQ, 2 war nickles and a 1939 Walker half.
5 Buffs, 1 V nickle, over 200 wheaties.
-tons of old tokens (and NEW ones..including a 12 coin Chuck E Cheese cache!!)
-good asst of old foreign coins.
-29 rings, including 4 gold bands, rest silver, with asst stones.
-many earrings, including one w/ a 1/2 carat diamond.
-nice big collection of keys!!! (don't we ALL have these?)
-dozen old pocket knives.
-two pocket watches..three old wrist watches.
-growing collection of old spoons.
-HUGE collection of bullets and shotgun shells (some old three ringers too)
-lots of cool old pins.
-three 1950's cap guns.
-over $350.00 in clad since Jan.
and besides this, buckets of other junk I've kept, and bags of trash I've tossed.
-broken TWO Gator digging tools (own a Lesche now...MUCH MUCH stronger)
-broken three pinpointers (own a whites now...holding up well)
My plan is to replace the ACE next Xmas with a better machine using the clad money and Ebay funds when I sell the jewelry.
I am thinking a Minelab EXPII (PLEASE don't flame me...I love my Garrett!!)

This is a great hobby!!

HH to all

 

[padigger]

What I do when I find a target is to move the coil away from it, put the coil on the ground press the pinpoint button and I hear a hum, lift the coil an inch or so and it goes away, then slowly swing over the target and the closer I get the louder it gets as well as the meter goes up to max when directly over it!

 

[Uncle Willy]

Yeah you're doing good. Wouldn't be to much trouble to swap the pinpoint button for a toggle switch then you'd be home free.

Bill

 

[CaptainTrips]

Huh? You expect to get the best performance without reading the manual? I work tech support. We have a saying when things aren't working "the way they are supposed to": RTFM! Read The F'ing Manual!

You will have better luck when you do. First of all, remember -- when pinpointing, it helps to reduce your sensitivity. This will help you get pings over smaller areas. Sometimes, I even am pinpointing with it at minimum sensitivity, when general scanning at 4-5 bars.

Good luck, and do yourself a favor -- read the manual!

 

[NM5K]

Actually, I just tested that the other day. The
sensitivity is locked on pinpoint mode. Reducing
the sensitivity made no difference at all. I do
think it has an automatic detuning circuit of some
type, but I'm not really sure how it works. I didn't
design it...
I know the pinpointer sensistivity can vary quite a bit
just depending how the level of detuning that the
unit is using at that particular moment. That's
why I'll push the button 2-3 times just to make sure
it's at it max sensistivity if hunting in non motion.
Or, as in many cases, I'll reset it to lower the
sensitivity if in a busy place like you describe.
Myself, I also thought the sensitivity lowered
the pinpoint also, but after actually testing it, I
found it doesn't. In bench testing a coin, I found no
difference in pinpoint strength no matter what the
setting. It was the same on 1 bar, as on full blast.
But at the same time, the ID mode would vary drastically.
MK

 

[CaptainTrips]

Well, then, either your machine is broken, or mine is. I have noticed a definite change in pinpointing with the sensitivity adjusted down. I'm not going by bench or air tests -- I'm going by my experience at the beach. With sensitivity maxxed out, on a dime 4 inches down, I get a signal over about a one foot circle. When I go down to one or two bars sensitivity, I can pinpoint to within an inch or two, and get NO signal if I'm not right over the coin. Oh, and this is the way the manual (and other Ace users) say it should work.

I have tried it in air tests, and find the same thing you do. I've come to decide that air tests are only a very basic test of operations. Try it in the field. Find a buried signal (or bury a coin yourself), then try pinpointing with different sensitivity settings. I'll bet you'll find it works this way also -- if not, send it in for repair, because sensitivity is supposed to have an effect in either "normal" or "pinpoint" modes.

 

[Uncle Willy]

Yeah when in pinpoint mode you are in full all metal and max sensitivity.

Bill

 

[Uncle Willy]

You can detune over the target and get the same effect. I can detune the signal on a dime down to the size of the dime.

Bill

 

[NM5K]

Well, it was my field use that made *me* think it was
adjustable. But I think I was being fooled by the
detuning. There shouldn't really be much difference
between bench, or in the ground.
The basic operation is the same, just no halo on the
target, and no ground effects. In my test, I placed
a nickle on a plastic box. I varied the sensitivity
and noted the distance both the ID mode, and pinpoint
would detect the coin. The ID mode changed, but the
pinpoint mode was the same performance no matter what
setting. I could detect the coin just as far with "1",
as I could with "8". No difference at all. But if course,
the distance would change if the machine detuned.
But if I rechecked the detune, and made sure it was
full performance, and not detuned, I always got the
same depth with any setting. The ID mode would drop
way off with a low setting, but not the pinpoint.
This basic feature is not going to change just
because a coin is in the ground. I'm fairly certain
that what you are seeing is the detuning, and it's
just a fluke that it seems to happen as you turn it
down. I just checked the manual, and there is nothing
at all about the sensistivity vs pinpointer strength.
BTW, I was one ace user that *used* to say reducing it
did help, but I've since changed my mind... So far,
I've seen little reading from users actually testing
that function. It was I think Danimals post about
"reverse detecting", that got me curious enough to
actually test it. Uncle Willy is a pretty serious ace
user, and he seems to agree with me. I guess someone
could ask Garrett and see what they have to say.
It's possible that my machine is weird, but I kinda
doubt it. Seems normal to me.. With mine there is
no doubt that the pinpoint depth does not ever change,
unless it detunes. I spent a while testing it just to
make sure..
Now, it could be possible that adjusting the sensitivity
could effect the levels of *detuning*, without actually
changing the sensitivity when un-detuned, but that would
have to be another test..
Just my $2.41 worth... Like I say, I didn't build it so
it's hard to know all the details with the circuits.
MK

 

[Danimal]

Mine also reverts to max sens. when in pinpoint, one of the main reasons I detect the way I do (in pinpoint) using non-pinpoint only after a target has been centered for an ID attempt. Even then I run all-metal mode so I can tell ferrous-non ferrous quickly. Another ACE250 I tried was the same way, so I suspect that it IS detuning making him think it's adjustable in pinpoint. I DO use detuning when centering a difficult target. I will also detune from several different sweep directions to get a feel if it's "can-slaw" fooling the ID as a coin. Can-slaw will usually throw a larger footprint even when the unit's detuned to a VERY small area than a coin. Without detuning can-slaw can not only fool ID but give a screwed up depth indication, showing deeper than it actually is (again, making me think it's a older, deeper coin).
I actually think that, in pinpoint, the ACE250 reads deeper than when running normal. I will do a few quicky air-tests at lunch to confirm.

 

[MikeW]

if it beeps,dig it)The manual is very basic but it does have some good info on some of the features that I dont use.Good pinpointing tip.Thats what I like about the 250, everything is pushbutton to adjust)