After paying an extra $150 for a DD coil for my bad ground to go with my X705... I will have exceeded the price of a used Explorer or Safari. My question is... Would a FBS machine that comes with DD coil work better in my hot ground than the single freq X705 with DD coil? I suspect it will... So I am contemplating reselling my X705 and getting either an Explorer II or a Safari. I'm leaning toward the Explorer II, but would appreciate any suggestions or help. I really didn't expect my ground to be this bad. Every single rock comes up as a -8 on my X705 and messes with my target id readings.
Find's Treasure Forums
Welcome to Find's Treasure Forums, Guests!
You are viewing this forums as a guest which limits you to read only status.
Only registered members may post stories, questions, classifieds, reply to other posts, contact other members using built in messaging and use many other features found on these forums.
Why not register and join us today? It's free! (We don't share your email addresses with anyone.) We keep email addresses of our users to protect them and others from bad people posting things they shouldn't.
Click here to register!
Need Support Help?
Cannot log in?, click here to have new password emailed to you
Changed email? Forgot to update your account with new email address? Need assistance with something else?, click here to go to Find's Support Form and fill out the form.
One more question
- Thread starter Utuk_Xul
- Start date
If I remember right, you are the one with a load of hot rocks in the ground.
First of all, if you get FBS, get an Explorer, don't fool with the Safari.
Here is a good question for you, are you patient and don't mind taking extra
time to learn a complex audio driven detector?
If not forget FBS and I am sure trying to learn it with loads of hot rocks won't
be fun either.
The Explorer is a serious detector that takes time to learn and not for the faint
at heart.
It is going to be heavier than the Xterra also, hope you don't mind swinging a
heavier detector.
Now you might be thinking I am trying to talk you out of getting an Explorer
but that really isn't the case since I have been using one for a long time.
You may be going about all this wrong anyway, sometimes hot rock city
will not allow as deep detection as better ground, maybe you should try
a small detector in order to have a smaller footprint, you may actually
get better depth with a small coil.
Remember this, whatever decision you make you are the one that
will live with it.
Or you could keep your 705 for now, buy an Explorer then use both and
decide which to keep or if you want to keep both.
Good luck whichever way you go.
First of all, if you get FBS, get an Explorer, don't fool with the Safari.
Here is a good question for you, are you patient and don't mind taking extra
time to learn a complex audio driven detector?
If not forget FBS and I am sure trying to learn it with loads of hot rocks won't
be fun either.
The Explorer is a serious detector that takes time to learn and not for the faint
at heart.
It is going to be heavier than the Xterra also, hope you don't mind swinging a
heavier detector.
Now you might be thinking I am trying to talk you out of getting an Explorer
but that really isn't the case since I have been using one for a long time.
You may be going about all this wrong anyway, sometimes hot rock city
will not allow as deep detection as better ground, maybe you should try
a small detector in order to have a smaller footprint, you may actually
get better depth with a small coil.
Remember this, whatever decision you make you are the one that
will live with it.
Or you could keep your 705 for now, buy an Explorer then use both and
decide which to keep or if you want to keep both.
Good luck whichever way you go.
Thanks for the input, Steve. I am a very patient person. I enjoy learning, and I love gadgets. I get a TON of noise with the X-Terra now and it doesn't bother me. My only thought was the cost to performance ratio in my particular soil. I suppose it won't hurt to just purchase the extra DD coil for the X-Terra and see if it improves my situation enough to make me happy. I've pretty much been digging -8 signals if they show 4+ arrows on the depth gauge. That will improve my chances of getting a coin below 4" here with the 9" concentric. Hopefully the DD coil will improve the ID problem. I kinda feel bad because I spent close to $700 on this detector and if I'm gonna spend a extra $150 on a DD coil... that would put me in the FBS detector range. Just worried that DD coil won't improve the target ID enough to see a quarter at 4 to 5" properly.
Mick in Dubbo
New member
You should be able to hit good target with the X-Terra even in bad ground. A dd coil reduces the effects of the mineralised ground by around 70%. Hot rocks don't normally give solid repeatable hits. A good target will, although the numbers can be way off. Keep the ground tracking on.
As far as the FBS detectors go. One of the fellas in the local detecting club here (most of which hunt for gold) took his Quattro out onto the goldfields and it ran fine. Actually he was asked by a couple of blokes to check out some targets that they were hitting with the PI machines. They were quite impressed with it.
Yesterday, I bumped into a new club member that owns an E-Trac. He had taken it down to his parents farm (which is in gold country) and snagged himself a 2 ounce gold nugget with it. He took that nugget and buried it in some extreme ground at a depth of 12 inches. One of the club members went over it with his GP3500 and couldn't hear it. after taking 2 inches of dirt off, he could just make out the nugget. After removing another 2 inches, the E-Trac was hitting it in from what I remember, in pinpointing mode. It couldn't here it in normal coins mode. Bottom line is, the FBS seem to do OK
in mineralised ground.
BTW, so does the Sovereign GT.
Mick Evans.
As far as the FBS detectors go. One of the fellas in the local detecting club here (most of which hunt for gold) took his Quattro out onto the goldfields and it ran fine. Actually he was asked by a couple of blokes to check out some targets that they were hitting with the PI machines. They were quite impressed with it.
Yesterday, I bumped into a new club member that owns an E-Trac. He had taken it down to his parents farm (which is in gold country) and snagged himself a 2 ounce gold nugget with it. He took that nugget and buried it in some extreme ground at a depth of 12 inches. One of the club members went over it with his GP3500 and couldn't hear it. after taking 2 inches of dirt off, he could just make out the nugget. After removing another 2 inches, the E-Trac was hitting it in from what I remember, in pinpointing mode. It couldn't here it in normal coins mode. Bottom line is, the FBS seem to do OK
in mineralised ground.BTW, so does the Sovereign GT.
Mick Evans.
Thanks for the input, Mick. My X-terra right now is IDing a quarter at 4" as Iron. Solid -8 tone. Hot rocks are giving solid repeatable -8 tones. Every once in awhile I will get one that gives me a solid repeatable 46 or 48. These rocks look like they are from the river. Big smooth and grayish. I live right next to the Clackamas River here in Oregon. I can pick any one of them up and pass it over the coil... instant signal. I just can't tune them out no matter what I do. I can't take a step without hitting multiple hot rocks. I've dug some that are a foot wide (Literally). Those are usually the ones that give me a solid silver signal. Even with Sens at 9 they sound off as -8. As it is... I don't think I will have a good time of it. I was hoping a DD coil would mitigate the problem. For some reason my Fisher F2 doesn't see the hot rocks, but it's depth is reduced even more than the 705. I'll try and keep my hopes up... Even though I'm getting tired of digging hot rocks and nails... It is great exercise for me and it's good to be out.
Hi bubber... Yeah here in the Pacific NW we have pretty hot ground. The volcanic activity of the past and such is partly responsible I think. I don't mind all the noise from the hot rocks really... I just want to be able to ID a coin at 6". Most of my hot rocks come up -8, but I have a LOT of them :-D I really like the 705. it's getting better depth than the other detectors I've had. I dug an iron buckle from 7" the other day with the 705, but that is a big object and of course was IDing at -8. All the coins I've buried in the ground I can't get a positive ID on 4" and deeper. This is after clearing all the hot rocks and nails from the area. I took a reading on the x-terra with the hidden mineralization feature.. and it's hot hot hot. So I don't fault the machine.
Over the past 30+ years I've used many Minelabs, Sovereigns, FT1600, etc,all were great machines, but this XT70 is something else. I sent it in "cause it wouldn't lock on any signal, just jumped all over, got it back, same thing, so it's been sent back again. I'll see what happens when I get it back. I'm a glutton for punishment, got a XT705 coming this week. From your post, it'll pro'bly be the same thing all over.
lol.. glutton for punishment.. I hear ya.
My 705 locks solid on every target on in air testing so I know it's just this bad ground causing the ID and falsing issues for me. I'm not sure there is anything I can do really. I'll probably try a DD first and see if it helps with coin ID... If not... I will just resell and try an FBS machine. These machines seem to hold their value.. so not much of a risk. I just wanted to find out if FBS machines were better in hot ground like we have on this side of the country than the single frequency machines. I grew up in Virginia... Where I lived the ground was very mild and my detectors worked well. I wasn't expecting the ground to be this bad out here when I moved. It's just something we will have to work around. Hey... it's great exercise at least :-D
My 705 locks solid on every target on in air testing so I know it's just this bad ground causing the ID and falsing issues for me. I'm not sure there is anything I can do really. I'll probably try a DD first and see if it helps with coin ID... If not... I will just resell and try an FBS machine. These machines seem to hold their value.. so not much of a risk. I just wanted to find out if FBS machines were better in hot ground like we have on this side of the country than the single frequency machines. I grew up in Virginia... Where I lived the ground was very mild and my detectors worked well. I wasn't expecting the ground to be this bad out here when I moved. It's just something we will have to work around. Hey... it's great exercise at least :-D
Mick in Dubbo
New member
That sure must be some very chronic ground! I haven't heard of ground that bad. Perhaps a Garrett Infinum might also be more useful in that type of ground. It's a pulse induction machine with some basic audio discrimination on it. I know this is a Minelab forum,but just trying to look for the best solution for your particular problem.
Mick Evans.
Mick Evans.
Utuk, you mentioned those you bury you can't get an ID on.
Just keep in mind, the greater the mineral problem is, the less likely
a good ID will result from recently buried objects.
You should be able to get a better ID on naturally buried items by a
little extra depth anyway.
I still think it might be a good idea to consider a small coil for the job since
it will see less dirt and generally small coils get a higher percentage
of their diameter depth wise than larger coils especially in bad ground.
Even though I don't have hot rocks here, there may a discernible difference
in the quality of the audio tones when dealing with them.
You may be able to use prospecting mode to your advantage since hot rocks
should give a really fast zip when you scan them.
I would toggle to prospect mode without any iron mask and see how it sounds
after you encounter a potential hot rock in standard mode.
Maybe others who have dealt with severe mineral ground can help out more.
Hope you can find a way to use it, if all else fails, get an old 4 filter detector.
Just keep in mind, the greater the mineral problem is, the less likely
a good ID will result from recently buried objects.
You should be able to get a better ID on naturally buried items by a
little extra depth anyway.
I still think it might be a good idea to consider a small coil for the job since
it will see less dirt and generally small coils get a higher percentage
of their diameter depth wise than larger coils especially in bad ground.
Even though I don't have hot rocks here, there may a discernible difference
in the quality of the audio tones when dealing with them.
You may be able to use prospecting mode to your advantage since hot rocks
should give a really fast zip when you scan them.
I would toggle to prospect mode without any iron mask and see how it sounds
after you encounter a potential hot rock in standard mode.
Maybe others who have dealt with severe mineral ground can help out more.
Hope you can find a way to use it, if all else fails, get an old 4 filter detector.
Well I appreciate any suggestions/comments I can get, Mick. 
I recovered just about every coin in the first 2" of dirt here with the F2... Now I'm just wanting a deeper machine to get the stuff below the 2" mark. So far out of this place I've recovered 2 Silver rings, '52 D Rosie, lots and lots of copper pennies, a few wheats, lots of clad, and an old cloisonne bracelet. I know there is more here... many families have called this old farm home. As I said though... I don't mind the hot rocks sounding off. It's kinda musical :-D Just find it irritating that I can't get a positive ID at 4"+.
I recovered just about every coin in the first 2" of dirt here with the F2... Now I'm just wanting a deeper machine to get the stuff below the 2" mark. So far out of this place I've recovered 2 Silver rings, '52 D Rosie, lots and lots of copper pennies, a few wheats, lots of clad, and an old cloisonne bracelet. I know there is more here... many families have called this old farm home. As I said though... I don't mind the hot rocks sounding off. It's kinda musical :-D Just find it irritating that I can't get a positive ID at 4"+.
Hi Steve... Some of these coins I've had buried for over a year for testing. The quarter was new, because I got curious to see how shallow it had to be before I got a good ID.
I'm not opposed to trying a smaller coil.. as the trash density of this place is very high around the house. The fields are better with targets few and far between near the surface. I've done pretty well with my F2's 4" coil.
Oh.. and switch in and out of prospecting mode all the time to verify targets. The hot rocks usually sound the same as a good target for me here. Nails and other iron are the only things that cause a quick sharp, broken tone on the targets I've dug. I thought seeing below the 4" mark was gonna be easier than this :-D It's a challenge, but I'll find a way lol. If I didn't try burying some coins... I'd still be out there unknowingly passing up good targets IDing at -8... Now i dig everything 4+ depth arrows.
I'm not opposed to trying a smaller coil.. as the trash density of this place is very high around the house. The fields are better with targets few and far between near the surface. I've done pretty well with my F2's 4" coil.
Oh.. and switch in and out of prospecting mode all the time to verify targets. The hot rocks usually sound the same as a good target for me here. Nails and other iron are the only things that cause a quick sharp, broken tone on the targets I've dug. I thought seeing below the 4" mark was gonna be easier than this :-D It's a challenge, but I'll find a way lol. If I didn't try burying some coins... I'd still be out there unknowingly passing up good targets IDing at -8... Now i dig everything 4+ depth arrows.
I've printed out the things that Digger wrote about this detector, I tried everything,different settings, everything I could think of, and what I read on line to try. I've never had a detector act like this before. It wouldn't be QUITE so bad in air tests, but it still didn't work right.
Utuk_Xul, hotrocks are suppose to register at +48, so man you must have some hot iron rocky ground there if the hotrocks are down in the -minus range!!
The solution would be to use or Ground Balance Beach(umbrella icon) and Target ID Stability(+ icon), with Pattern 1, which rejects -8, -6, -4, -2, +48, BUT quarters(25c) come up as a -minus number also in your ground is THE problem! Also with not much depth.
So what then is the solution? Have you tried Prospecting Mode with the IM(Iron Mask) set at 5, then try all the way to max. 20, experiment. Also use Track and shut it off when you encounter a target.
You do not have a round 10.5" MF(7.5 kHz) DD to try which is the best one for both hotrocks and coins. That is the coil to get for your ground.
Otherwise if all else fails get a multiple frequency machine, get a used second-hand Sovereign GT(there is a person who adds an aftermarket TID meter in place of the speaker, I have his contact) or Explorer SE (Pro). You could sell your 705, and then if you are flush get the best being an E-Trac(about $1,500) which has a stock DD coil.
I also heard here that a Fisher CZ model in salt mode worked in bad ground where others failed to work. I added in (brackets) below.
http://www.findmall.com/read.php?27,1156630,page=2
"The MXT WILL pick up sub-grain gold in bad ground. Actually, it might pick up smaller gold than the high frequency detectors in such ground. I was picking up gold down to about 1/3 grain whilst up in the Brooks range.. in ground that, aside from a CZ6a running in salt mode, was (the)only(one) really hunt-able with ML SD2200d's. >The white's GM4, Compass AU32, Fisher GB1, Scorpion Gold Stinger detectors that the other guys had were basically unusable.< I've also played around on the Coquihalla(B.C.) with a number of detectors and found the MXT to be the 'winner'. ..Willy."
Multiple Frequency machines on the market are the Fisher CZ(-3D), Whites DFX--Beach Hunter ID--& Spectra V3, Garrett Infinium LS, and all the various Minelab BBS & FBS models with the E-Trac being the best.
http://www.kellycodetectors.com/minelab-christmas-push.htm
Info on Multiple Frequency machines.
The solution would be to use or Ground Balance Beach(umbrella icon) and Target ID Stability(+ icon), with Pattern 1, which rejects -8, -6, -4, -2, +48, BUT quarters(25c) come up as a -minus number also in your ground is THE problem! Also with not much depth.
So what then is the solution? Have you tried Prospecting Mode with the IM(Iron Mask) set at 5, then try all the way to max. 20, experiment. Also use Track and shut it off when you encounter a target.
You do not have a round 10.5" MF(7.5 kHz) DD to try which is the best one for both hotrocks and coins. That is the coil to get for your ground.
Otherwise if all else fails get a multiple frequency machine, get a used second-hand Sovereign GT(there is a person who adds an aftermarket TID meter in place of the speaker, I have his contact) or Explorer SE (Pro). You could sell your 705, and then if you are flush get the best being an E-Trac(about $1,500) which has a stock DD coil.
I also heard here that a Fisher CZ model in salt mode worked in bad ground where others failed to work. I added in (brackets) below.
http://www.findmall.com/read.php?27,1156630,page=2
"The MXT WILL pick up sub-grain gold in bad ground. Actually, it might pick up smaller gold than the high frequency detectors in such ground. I was picking up gold down to about 1/3 grain whilst up in the Brooks range.. in ground that, aside from a CZ6a running in salt mode, was (the)only(one) really hunt-able with ML SD2200d's. >The white's GM4, Compass AU32, Fisher GB1, Scorpion Gold Stinger detectors that the other guys had were basically unusable.< I've also played around on the Coquihalla(B.C.) with a number of detectors and found the MXT to be the 'winner'. ..Willy."
Multiple Frequency machines on the market are the Fisher CZ(-3D), Whites DFX--Beach Hunter ID--& Spectra V3, Garrett Infinium LS, and all the various Minelab BBS & FBS models with the E-Trac being the best.
http://www.kellycodetectors.com/minelab-christmas-push.htm
Info on Multiple Frequency machines.