Kicked out of a park today

[Dan-Pa.]

Unfortunately never saw a sign NO Metal Detecting....but most park rules prohibit damaging the area and yepper in the minds of many digging holes is damaging....fortunately all one needs is a screw driver for shallow clad but it takes a while to become proficient...
In the last 20 yrs large fences are going up, many liability claims keeps us off private property and the hobby may one day go the way of the dodo bird which is extinct...

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Dan, sure, there are rules that forbid "alterations" "damage" "vandalism", and so forth. I mean ... .duh ... did any of us really think we could go in and ask "hi! Can I please alter, damage, and vandalize the park please?" Thus yes, those type rules exist in EVERY park, at EVERY level. But no, I do not make the automatic equivalence that md'ing = alterating, damaging, and vandalizing. Because when you think of it, all such verbage inherently applies to the END result. Thus if you leave no trace of your presence, then technically, you have not alterED, damagED, or vandalizED anything, now have you?

But you already beat me to the punch on this, by correctly pointing out " ... in the minds of many..." Meaning, yes, we may *technically* be clear of such verbage, but this won't stop someone from assuming we'll leave holes, or just claiming such things, and .... you're right, we're probably going to be on the loosing side of such a debate of semantics. Heck, if you even showed up with so much as a screwdriver only (to "probe" and "pop"), you will STILL find a busy-body who is simply going to see the detector, and make assumptions. So, no, the screwdriver (verses a leshe) does not solve that problem entirely. I would also point out that while a screwdriver is fine for popping out shallow clad, .... no, you're not going to be able to get 9" deep barbers or seateds from the turf, without making a big mess. I mean, by the time you're done chasing those deeper silver whisper with nothing but a screwdriver, you're going to have been better off to have just cut a plug, to begin with.

But then yes, you're back to square 1, where someone can claim this runs afoul of damaging or alterations clauses (even though YOU AND I know, we'll leave no trace).

And the solution to this dilema is not to think to pre-empt such encounters, by going to city halls, and asking. Because that too has had a track-record of fetching "no's", where .... quite frankly .... people had simply just gone without problems (presuming you weren't "sticking out like a sore thumb" or being a nuisance in some other way)

So to me, the best policy, is just to avoid those type busy bodies who, as you say, "have it in their mind", TO BEGIN WITH. You know, like pick low traffic times. If you see the landscapers/lawn-mowers there that day, come back later or go to another park. Heck, it's even gotten to where I hunt turfed parks mostly at dusk or night now (or odd-ball times like of federal holidays when city staffs are on skeleton crews). Call that "sneaking around" if you like, fine. But it's kinda like nose-picking: You're never going to get everyone to like it when you pick your nose in front of them, right? Thus we all sort of ... uh ... "use a little discretion" in our timing, do we not?

 

[Coinseeker 78]

-- moved topic --

 

[tabman]

I was at a school the other day and this lady drove up and said that she was the principal of the school and wanted to know what I was doing there. I told her that I was looking for lost things. She said what kind of lost things? I told her rings, coins and stuff like that. While I was telling her that, I was pulling out of my finds pouch a huge handful of twisted can slaw and a broken glass bottle with a screw cap attached . I told her that this is what I find the most of. She said do you take that with you. I said yes, because I wouldn't want a kid to fall and cut themselves. She said that I could come there and do that all I wanted to. We exchanges names and I told her that I wanted her to look at something else. The gold class that I just found. I asked her if its from this school. She said that she has never seem one like that before and wanted to know if I was trying to find the owner. I said yes. Long story short, I made a friend and good first impression. She drove up there with every intention of running me off, but I turned the tide.

Also she pointed out some good places to search on the school grounds. I got kind of a history lesson.

tabman

 

[Ism]

Tab, I had a similar experience with a school official. I also had a pouch full of assorted trash. He just asked me to turn in any keys that I found and said have fun.
Also changed a groundskeepers mind on hunting my favorite soccer field. Had no problem after he saw my retrieval technique and the sharp objects that I had in my pouch.
However I have been booted from a great soccer field by the groundskeepers. They had no problem with me hunting other areas but the soccer field was off limits.
Have to say it was the best kept soccer field and the treasure to trash ratio was unbelievable. I will go back in the late evening or a Sunday morning when the season is over sometime in the future.
Early morning on holidays can work also. Park workers often get holidays off and Mrs Cratchet's of the world generally love to sleep in.

 

[Carl-d-Frogg]

Sorry for the delay Tom. The answer to your question is no. I've hunted some in the water for years at that park. Apparently you not allowed to do that which, is a raw deal. I can understand if it were on a historic location but, its not!
I've seen violations being made by others while there. Live shells being taken by the bucket loads by beach goers for instance. Your not suppose to take them live from my understanding. I've even seen a couple having sex in the water in
plain view. The best one I saw was a park ranger using a metal detector after park hours. He was detecting the off limit picnic area but, when he caught sight of me he put it away in a hurry! I didn't care that he was doing it because, I don't
see it as a problem. I wish I could have taken a picture of him but, I didn't have my phone with me! I remember once being stopped by one of the rangers when I was detecting by the waters edge. She told me she would appreciate it
if I would move away from there so I wouldn't scare the sand piper birds. You see by waving the detector side-by-side scares them. Then she sped away with her 4-wheeler and scared them anyways! They just don't want you there.
I no longer give them my $ to enter the park. I just access the park which is wide open with no fence from public side after hours. No more hassle for me. I'm not there while they are for now on!

 

[oneguy]

I've had a tuff go of it lately myself. Drove 90 miles over to Idaho because they are digging up a downtown area on a major scale. LOTS of old coins are being turned up. Wasn't there 10 minutes and digging my second or third coin (new junk) and here he comes! You know....the low level guy that wants to feel important comes by and runs me off. I was a full city block away from any construction workers and 20 feet from the access road in. Wasn't hurting a damn thing and certainly couldn't hurt the tore up ground. There will be MANY old coins turned up and soon to be covered again for the next 100 years...what a shame........

 

[Tom_in_CA]

one-guy, you say a construction worker saw you (albeit from a block away, or whatever). What that tells me right away is: you were there during working hours. Why didn't you just wait till the workers were done for the day? Because just as your situation showed, it really doesn't matter whether or not you were "in their way" or not. Why not just make matters simple, and go after-hours? I don't get it.

 

[oneguy]

one-guy, you say a construction worker saw you (albeit from a block away, or whatever). What that tells me right away is: you were there during working hours. Why didn't you just wait till the workers were done for the day? Because just as your situation showed, it really doesn't matter whether or not you were "in their way" or not. Why not just make matters simple, and go after-hours? I don't get it.

I don't drive after dark and 180mi round trip took enough time from hunting in the first place. Guy wasn't a worker, he came out of one of their "boss" trailers parked on site. I could tell he was above the grunts but lower level as far as the bosses go. Place was also fenced so I'm sure it's locked and patroled on days off. Too far to drive back over and find out anyways..... Sure ain't like it used to be. Had a fire marshall run me off last week because I was detecting "hazardus waste" material dug from peoples yards in a "Superfund" clean-up area.....lol That was last week and that' seems to be the way things have been going for me lately since I've returned to the hobby after 15yr hiatus.....

 

[bilbos0@lycos.com]

Well said my friend......

 

[Tom_in_CA]

one guy, I'm old enough (52) to remember when demolition sites never had fences around them. Oh sure, ... perhaps some ribbon and a few orange cones (that you just stepped over), but that was it. But nowadays, d/t the litigical environment we live in (people wanting to sue for slipping on bananna peels), they started putting fences up around barren dirt, ...doh! Also theft of const. equipment and supplies is an issue (recycle metal values, etc...) which is also the cause of fences. So ... nothing to do with metal detectors, IMHO, as their origin or purpose.

I have rarely ever seen any that were "patrolled", as you say. Most of them you can stil get in, by simply un-doing the bailing wire that holds the gate panels shut .... and presto, just walk right in. Or get a cat-key off ebay, as a lot of times it's just a simple cat-lock on the gate. Or if it's a combo. lock, that's easy too: Just look at it during the day when it's open (using a little due discretion, of course), and ... odds are .... whenever they've opened it that morning, the person leaves the #'s on the lock (fails to spin the #'s). Then when you come back later, just enter in those #'s you saw during the day. Presto

You say you can't drive at night. So what's to have stopped you from going on Sunday when no work is going on? I mean, .... if you say others are getting old coins there now .... how are THEY doing it? How are THEY getting in?

 

[oneguy]

You say you can't drive at night. So what's to have stopped you from going on Sunday when no work is going on? I mean, .... if you say others are getting old coins there now .... how are THEY doing it? How are THEY getting in?

Nothing stopped me from going on a Sun.....I just happened to go during the week. I may go back tomorrow if I get a wild hair? I didn't say "others" were getting coins but I've been around long enough to know that when they dig up old areas in the old part of a busy downtown that the are PLENTY of old coins that get turned up. Plenty to be had also if one has the time......or ACCESS.....

 

[SpiritRelic]

If detecting keeps going,we are going to have to get permits,take a grounds protection course,keep licence,permit updated because it will become nation wide.But this is ok.Metal detecting will never die in America,never.

 

[HaroldILL.]

one guy, I'm old enough (52) to remember when demolition sites never had fences around them. Oh sure, ... perhaps some ribbon and a few orange cones (that you just stepped over), but that was it. But nowadays, d/t the litigical environment we live in (people wanting to sue for slipping on bananna peels), they started putting fences up around barren dirt, ...doh! Also theft of const. equipment and supplies is an issue (recycle metal values, etc...) which is also the cause of fences. So ... nothing to do with metal detectors, IMHO, as their origin or purpose.

I have rarely ever seen any that were "patrolled", as you say. Most of them you can stil get in, by simply un-doing the bailing wire that holds the gate panels shut .... and presto, just walk right in. Or get a cat-key off ebay, as a lot of times it's just a simple cat-lock on the gate. Or if it's a combo. lock, that's easy too: Just look at it during the day when it's open (using a little due discretion, of course), and ... odds are .... whenever they've opened it that morning, the person leaves the #'s on the lock (fails to spin the #'s). Then when you come back later, just enter in those #'s you saw during the day. Presto

You say you can't drive at night. So what's to have stopped you from going on Sunday when no work is going on? I mean, .... if you say others are getting old coins there now .... how are THEY doing it? How are THEY getting in?

I wish then you could work your magic and get are Forrest preserves in cook county reopened to detecting. It's a shame they closed them down as they were so covenant and close. Now we have to go to city Chicago parks and take are chances.

 

[oneguy]

I returned on Sunday to the "big dig". Another 90mi one-way trip and place was locked up big time with KEEP OUT signs everywhere. I even tried to sneak around through the woods and no go. I'm from a town 25mi north of there before I moved to Montana and had informed a buddy I may stop by if I had no luck at the "big dig". His house was built in 1910 so I hunted it and another old foundation over the hill in an old area. Nothing special but did manage about 45 coins, 3 old bad shape pocket watches, some cool junk, and kicked up 5 wheaties dating between 1910 thru 21 so that gave me some hope on the silver someday. Had fun but the "big dig" spot is killing me not be able to hunt it. I laughed with my buddy about getting in full "special ops" camo, face paint, hooded flashlight, etc. and sneaking under cyclone fence at midnight for some covert detecting at the "big dig"!!!!! and seriously....ALMOST did it. Pretty tuff out there anymores but I guess we just have to work around it......

 

[Tom_in_CA]

How much you wanna make a bet, that the ONLY reason forest preserves in Cook county have this new rule ("no detecting"), is that someone (bless their little heart), probably went to the county awhile back, asking "can I metal detect in the forest preserves of cook county?". And alas, another law is born, to "address this pressing issue in front of a desk-bound bureaucrat".

If you're from that area, do YOU know the genesis, of why, one day, some bureaucrat got a burr-in-his-bonnet that he/they needed a "no detecting rule" ? Whenever this subject comes up for parks, someone will be quick to chime in "durned those people who must've left holes". Right? But THINK OF IT: This is a wooded forest for petes sake. NOT TURFED LAWNS. So OBVIOUSLY 'holes" had nothing to do with it. Oh sure, perhaps it was their "go-to" reason in justifying the law they just invented. But if you follow-the-dots back-wards in time, I bet you end up at someone who took-it-upon themselves to go waltzing into Cook county, and asking. And then someone where must "pass this question past the local archaeologist and lawyer, etc...". it's as if we can be our own worst enemy.

I know this information probably doesn't help you now (as there's a truly existing rule now there). But just saying, let this be a lesson to others to stop making themselves a big red X in need of attention.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Well, old-town demolition site hunting is not for the "faint of heart". You're not going to find demolition sites with neon signs saying "metal detecting welcome here". So ... sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do.

My hunting buddy owns one of 3 local firms that does demolition. So as such, he gets us "carte-blanche" into a lot of demolition sites that he, personally, is doing. However, we also hunt the others as well. He's not too worried, because .... even if someone came out, he can "drop names" and get himself out of hot water (if he really wanted to). But ....we've never had to deal with that, as we simply go out-of-site, out of mind, after hours, and .... know how to be discreet. But as I say, it's not for the faint of heart.

 

[KinTN]

Tom, its Cook County. They are famous for trying to control everything about everyone's life.
They are the poster child for those that love government and hate freedom.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

My wife is from Elmhurst, Ill. Which is a suburb of Chicago, in Cook county. So I've been there several times when we're seeing the inlaws. And as we've driven around, from burrough to burrough, we have sometimes taken routes through various woodsy greenbelt areas of the outlying suburbs. Not sure if that's type "forest preserves" you are talking about, or not. But I'll tell you: If I lived there, and was hiking around in the forests, and found a cellar hole that looked interesting, or had researched out an old picnic or stage stop, I WOULD NOT HESITATE to hunt it. From what I can gather, seems that most of it is just remote undeveloped forests. So is there REALLY any around, to frickin care, to begin with? Sorry, but ... I don't wait around for neon signs saying "detecting is welcome here". I've long since abandoned the thought that anyone's going to roll out the red carpet for me. But that's just me.

 

[JimGilmore]

When you say demolition site never had fences I'm wondering where you lived. I grew up in nyc and as long as I remember there was a fence or wall. Sometimes they had spots you could look through to see the work. But bever were you allows to wander in these areas.
It was not for theft as much as saftey.
But maybe your refering to rural areas and less urban areas.