Just put my new F-5 on classifieds

[Harley Dave]

So before i get lambasted for selling it so quick i'll give my main reasons for askin for a trade for another detector.
The "prefered" ground balance method outlined in the manual is far to tedious and difficult. You also need about 3 hands to hold pad turn things, hold up the machine. Thats the best interface ever? All these extra features like confidence but how about a simple auto ground balance instead? No wonder B. Ladd left that out in his video there. I had to carry the manual around to try to get it right. Then doing balance the other way i found myself stoppin' every 5 min to make sure the numbers was an exact match as soil keep changing. Hows about designin a machine that has auto number match? Also i read on here some place that it was deeper than an X5. This sold me and its gut good deepth but i didnt see it any where near my X5. sorry.
dave

 

[Mr.Bill]

Once you have it set just, just re-hitting the button should have re-set the numbers together. Being that concerned about the GB, having to re-set it every 5minuets, would certainly been a pain.

It's certainly not like your X-5, but your talking about a detector that cost you about $500. The X-5 was $1000. The X-5 didn't work very good where I live. I can tell you that first hand. If the X-5 worked as smooth as the F-5, I would still have it.

So I would say you felt about the F-5 as I did the X-5. Hey, that's what keeps the world spinning.

Good luck on your detector sale.

 

[Streak!]

Sorry your not happy with it. Dont know WHY Mr. Ladd left the Phase lock procedure out of the video, but it goes like this:
Just thumb the disc button down to the AM mode. (Autotune). Press and HOLD the phase lock button down. Pump the coil. .... (from between and inch to about 6 inches off the ground).....and when the GB and phase numbers match (usually after only two or three pumps)....release the button while STILL pumping. Thumb it back in Disc mode...........and your in buisness. You can do this with ONE thumb, right or left handed. (I'm a leftie, but can do it easily with either hand.....) Takes about 10 seconds to do.
Try it like this before you dump it.....as it really IS easy to do. Also......in side by side tests in MY test garden (nice soil...GB's About 65-70).......the F5 will match the X5 inch for inch on my deepest targets. AND.....................deeper COINS will be louder with the F5 than they are with the X5. I used an X5 for a LOOOOOOONG time.....so am VERY familiar with it!!! Like Bill said though................to each his own!!! Hope you make out better with another unit.............. Streak!

 

[Low-Boy/LCPM]

You just put it in AM and pump and turn the GB to the numbers on both sides match that is easy like a ten turn key but better anyone that wants to buy it go for it it is a nice unit for under $500.00

 

[Bill Ladd]

I had under 11 min. to try to include all the important features of the detector, PLUS a short in the field dig at the end. The original footage had both ground balancing methods in it. Then during editing I found out that half the 10 min. were "wasted" on ground balancing both ways. So, it was my decision to leave the easier, quicker way in there and not take up the whole movie OK? I don't think ground balancing twice for 5 min. makes for a great introductory video do you? In fact, if I left all that in there that probably would have scared buyers away.....
So, in a way I have to agree with Harley......I hate to ruffle feathers and keep bringing up the taboo Los banos Fisher's, but I push one button on the Coinstrike and I'm all balanced, and if I use auto ground tracking I continue to stay balanced for the entire day........

 

[tony (Orlando FL)]

Harley,

For what its worth, there is no hard fast law or rule that says you HAVE to keep adjusting the GB on the F5. The meter is there as a visual indicator to show you how the ground is changing in the area you are detecting. You can hit the button if you want to compensate for the ground changes. Of course, optimum ground balancing should provide for the best performance. Consider this, detectors that do not have auto ground tracking, also have this same situation going on with their detector however there is no meter or display to make them aware of the ever changing ground conditions. Detectors that have preset GB, there is nothing they can do expect continue detecting and many of THOSE units do quite well.

The X5 you mentioned was subject to the same thing, you just weren't shown the changes, yet I am sure you would GB the unit every now and again or simply leave it in its preset gb setting.

While the real time GB indicator is nice to have, it looks like many folks are getting 'paralysis through analysis' by watching this gauge too closely. If you still have the unit, try to use it and ignore the information the unit is providing on GB while you gain confidence in its other abilities, then slowly, once you decide that the unit is capable in the field, slowly start getting accustomed to GB corrections by checking it every once in a while BUT let it do its thing and simply dont let it get to ya.

Tony

 

[Harley Dave]

i havent had many trade offers and maybe i'll keep it? Still not sure yet. but stand by that in my ground the X-5 is a lot deeper and it takes more than 1 thumb to ground balance it
Dave

 

[Streak!]

Ground tracking.......by its very nature........is "iffy". You DONT get a good ground sampling "swinging the coil"......so you have one strike against it right there. Also............where there are many targets......you may get the edge of a target the second it tracks....and your GB will be lightyears off then. They (the machines that track) DO usually have a track inhibit circut to keep the machines from tracking over soild targets, but WILL still track if the Gb difference isnt a huge one.....and will end up not exactly spot on. Nope..........I'll take manual Ground balancing over tracking any day of the week. it only takes seconds to confirm a good GB setting....and with the Fast grab of the F70 and 75...its never been easier.

 

[tony (Orlando FL)]

Dave,

GREAT, you still have the F5.

no matter which detector we get, unless it finds some really nice find right out of the box is going to be questionable UNTIL it does find something of value or finds it in a weird situation that can not be explained as to why it had been missed for all these yrs.

Whenever I get a new tector, and head out to use it in the field, unless I really hate it immediately, I leave the other one(s) home so its not that easy to call it quits with the new one, put it back in the car and get one that has proven itself to be good.

The problem I see with this hobby is that the MORE we find and recover the less there is to find and recover ( I am referring to old stuff and not the salt beaches). If we take a new unit to a spot we have had great luck in the last 10 yrs it should come as no surprise that there is 10 yrs worth of less finds to be found now. This pounded site will make the new unit seem inferior to what you used to use, because we recall all the great stuff that this very site had given up. But most, a lot of the finds are now gone.

Give the unit some time, run it at its default settings, even though you are a pro...... then when you do locate a real (not planted) target, experiment by turning the sens way down to see how low you can go and still get the target reliably. Lift the coil, see how high the coil can be lifted before you lose it too. Take the time to intentionally mess up the proper GB and note what happens, if anything.

I have been tecting a long time, and do all these things as well to better understand how a new unit is going to react to settings and how I need to set it for best results.

Question: Does the F5 have a preset GB that the unit can be clicked into? Seems I forgot the answer to this...

Looking forward to hearing of some good finds........

Tony

 

[Bill Ladd]

why not have a similar fast grab on the F5 too? I think I would have like that alot better myself.....

 

[Jackpine Savage]

based on reading posts regarding auto tracking circuits on modern machines--- too many people live in fear of missing a target with tracking turned on. Sure it "could" happen in rare cases but IMO, tracking helps way more than it hinders.

2 cases to make my point. On the Coin$trike using tracking to set the GB whether you leave it on or turn it off afterwards gives greatly improved performance when hunting around old sites with iron and with the ML X70 when hunting in iron tracking on is a must. No, it does not track to iron at least not in the conventional sense of hurting performance. In actuality it acts sort of like an iron pre-filter and helps pull out more iffy signals. A few simple experiments is all it takes to see and prove the difference.

Just two cases but they are important to note.

.you may get the edge of a target the second it tracks....and your GB will be lightyears off then.

You could win the lottery too--- the odds are about equal


HH Tom

 

[Streak!]

thats neither a new trick, nor a "tracking" exclusive.
in fact...if it (the machine in question) IS tracking, ...you CANT maintain the control you might want in sites were THAT effect is wanted.
Sure.......it "may" make the machine quieter, but additional masking will have a counter effect, and you'll dig LESS targets. You dont know what your missing if you dont hear it!
I hunt lot with a guy that uses a X70, and they frankly dont do well at all in iron infested sites. not even debatable IMO.
If winning the lottery were as easy as having a misadjusted GB due to tracking OR simple user error...............hell......We'd ALL be millionaires! I think maybe thats not a good analogy. I also dont think too may of us "live in fear" about missing the odd target or two. Its just a hobby buddy! I know I dont lose too much sleep over it.
Thanks for the input Jackpine, but I think I'll stick to my guns on this one............... Streak!

 

[Jackpine Savage]

It's a lot different on the two I gave as examples. But if you don't want to belive me ... so be it.

Never said the X70 was better in iron that your favorite Fisher du jour, I was just pointing out what the Auto tracking circuit can do for the user. .. If they take the time to do a few simple tests.

We all miss targets and I don't worry about it either but I do want the machine I am using to be working at its best---So do most people.

Tom

 

[Digger]

But I don't think there is any way to simply click into it.

As you explained so well, the phase reading feature simply provides a running measurement of the ground matrix. Phase lock "matches" up the detector's GB setting with the current phase reading. However, watching all those phase numbers flying by is probably confusing a lot of users who never realized how much (and how often) the ground phase level changes within each sweep. If the phase reading wasn't there, I have a feeling the questions would be minimal.

Now, if it also had auto-tracking...... HH Randy

 

[tony (Orlando FL)]

n/t

 

[Mr.Bill]

Very simple, push button, raise coil, all GB'ed. Does not have auto tracking. Fastest GB of all the Fishers.

I have used the Coinstrike since it has come out, and I can't recall ever having a problem where it tracks off to never, never land. In fact I have never had that problem with any auto tracking unit. I certainly wouldn't call it "iffy".

What your stating is on the extreme end of things. Could it happen, sure it could, but under most conditions it doesn't. But that why the put a on / off button.

 

[zeekeys]

Dave I read you post on Sat. My friends loaned me a F5 for the weekend. Must take it back today. I really shouldn't answer on the F5 because I only have used it for 12 hours. I watched Bill's and Low-boy's videos and took it out on the beach right from the detector dealer. I used Bill's and Low-boy's settings and GB the way Bill showed on the video. I watched the GB readings that were going up and down during the swing. The numbers usually came back to the 76, that was the reading of GB. I didn't change the GB unless I changed other settings. I don't know if I had to do that? I did because I just wanted to try different settings. I really don't think I would have changed the GB if I hadn't changed the settings. Dave give it another chance. I hope the future of metal detecting will have a lot of the features that are on the F5. It is a cool machine and love the knobs and big screen. Picture of stuff found on the beach this weekend with the F5. Thanks for reading...Z

 

[Streak!]

I tend to HUNT those extreme conditions most all the time. Most all of my best sites are a carpet of nails. I want and need 100% control over Gbing. Thats probably why I have that perspective on it.
Besides.....I dont think there are any modern machines that are hard to balance anymore. There are also a lot you CANT balance as well. A few posts here suggested the fact that it probably isnt as important as we all seem to think sometimes........ and thats probably so in a lot of detecting scenearios...........but when those favorite sites of yours start to get thin..........you want every tool in your arsenal to get evey last target you can squeeze out! Streak!

 

[Streak!]

n/t

 

[Mark in NC]

One of the things I love about the F5 is that the button is an OPTION...you still have a good ol' fashioned knob if you wanna use it. The F5 seems to be very tolerant of a pretty wide range (probably due to the high resolution in the GB circuit) while in Disc. mode. I still love the way it lets me know when I've strayed too much though...without having to guess or re-check with all metal.