Headphones, Not To Beat A Dead Horse, BUT

[Michigan Badger]

what exactly makes expensive headphones better for single tone pitch Tesoro detectors?

I could maybe see them for detectors that have all those high and low tone pitch sounds, but how are they better for the singles?

What I have found with all my Tesoro detectors is the good targets just stand out clear and bold. Some may be weak but very diffinite. That to me is the greatness of Tesoro.

 

[jabbo]

My $35 30 ohm head phones sound as good as my $89 150 ohm phones and they are lighter and more comfortable. I rarely use the $89 phones. Don't buy 8 ohm phones. jabbo

 

[Michigan Badger]

n/t

 

[markg]

[quote jabbo]My $35 30 ohm head phones sound as good as my $89 150 ohm phones and they are lighter and more comfortable. I rarely use the $89 phones. Don't buy 8 ohm phones. jabbo[/quote]

Why not 8 ohm phones?

 

[markg]

n/t

 

[Rick@Detect USA]

Tesoros put out a square wave to the headphones. The better the frequency response of the phones, the more the signal will sound exactly as it was intended. Plus, even with single tone machines, there are subtle differences in the sound depending on the target. You miss some of that information with narow response phones.

 

[Rick@Detect USA]

TEsoros have a 150 ohm limiting resistor at the phone output. For max volume, it's best to be close to 150. 8 is much to far away and would eat up battery time. By the way, if your phones have 150 speakers, they are actually 75 ohm phones.Plus if they are narrow responce, they can be all over in ohms depending on frequency. I got graphs on my site.

 

[Michigan Badger]

[quote Rick@Detect USA]TEsoros have a 150 ohm limiting resistor at the phone output. For max volume, it's best to be close to 150. 8 is much to far away and would eat up battery time. By the way, if your phones have 150 speakers, they are actually 75 ohm phones.Plus if they are narrow response, they can be all over in ohms depending on frequency. I got graphs on my site.[/quote]

that detector manufactures are so quiet on the subject? I mean, to me it seems like they would make sure the buyer receives the proper headphones with his detector or at least has the option to extra order them with his new unit.

If you check the big online dealers of detector packages what you'll usually find is a cheap set of phones are included with a $1000 machine.

Maybe I'm not being clear here but it has always seemed strange to me that a company selling expensive detectors would not see to it that the consumers received phones (most people use them) that deliver optimum performance from their machines.

I don't think most people today are trying to be cheap by buying low cost headphones. I think most buyers of detectors are thinking that if the expensive phones were a good thing the manufacture would have told them.

Okay, maybe I'm just thinking weird here but I think there's a lot to this.

Heck, I'd love to buy the best phones but how do I know what's best for my machines? The factory says nothing and on the forums you read all sorts of conflicting things.

Badger

 

[markg]

Great post. A lot to think about...

 

[jabbo]

To me, all beeps from coins, tabs, foil sound the same, in other words I hear no change in pitch from various targets when using either phone. I have a Vaquero and a Cortes.

 

[cmag]

Good post. I'm new to MDing and I struggle with the premise that one needs expensive headphones in order to detect nuances in the tone. I'm not an electronics engineer either, but my understanding is that the machine (single tone ones) either decides to beep or not. So how does one detect subtle differences in the tone if it is a yes/no response?

Now with just a few hours of experience, I've noticed my Tejon hesitates and chirps depending on the target. But the tone between two solid strong targets, say iron and lead, sound identical to me. Of course, the natural response to this is, "well you need high quality headphones to hear the difference".

I emailed Tesoro about headphones and the person that responded prefered $30 cheapo's.

 

[jabbo]

When I got my Vaquero last January I called Tesoro for headphone recommendations. A technician simply said " most people use Calrad". Thats all he said.

 

[JHM]

I bought a set of Ratphones and I have to say they are really good on my Explorer. I haven't tried them on the Vaquero yet.

 

[Dig'n in Va.]

The ones that fit comfortably, sound good to you, and work with the detector you are using...The name on these headphones will depend on who you are and what you prefer..The first and biggest difference you will notice is that the "high dollar" headphones are sound insulated from exterior noises. This will make it easier to concentrate on only the detector sounds.. In other words you cannot hear noises around you when you are hunting. This can be a problem when hunting in wild "creature" areas or not being able to hear someone talking to you, dogs barking, etc...I have used these type headphones with one side raised up over my ear, but you lose the advantage of the "enclosed" sound and you might as well be using the "cheaper" models. I use Calrads and Vanco's with most of my detectors and I have tested them on targets with my high dollar headphones and I have never found a target that I would have missed because of the type headphones I was using. As for the subtle differences in sounds of the single tone Tesoro's such as the Vaquero, Tejon , etc.. I can hear them just as good with my cheaper headphones. One of the best Tesoro's for giving good audio clues to the ID of targets is the Lobo Super Traq and with the cheaper headphones I could still tell an iron signal 90% of the time.. Like I said, it's up to each persons preference and I really don't think you'll know until you try a few different brands and models and decide for yourself..... Dave

 

[cmag]

Rick, I read your site and it is very informative but one thing I'm still unsure about is how ohms effects the sound. Are the higher ohm headphones just louder? I have a cheap 32 ohm model and it dang near blows my ears off sometimes. Why would I need an even higher ohm pair for my Tejon if the 32's are plenty loud?

 

[Goodrat]

I switched to my non advertising user name.
If for example you have a tesoro with 150 ohm output impedance. You hook up a speaker that is 150 ohms. The voltage you get to that speaker is half what is coming out of the machine. If the machine puts out 4 volts (open circuit with nothing connected) half the voltage is across the internal resistor in the machine, the other half is across the speaker. The power to the speaker is works out to 26.6mW.
If the speaker is a 300 ohm speaker, you get a little more voltage but less current due to more ohms. So the power works out to 23.7mW.
If the speaker is 75 ohms, you get a little more current, but your voltage is lower. The power works out to 23.7mW at the speaker again.
But other factors come into play like the efficiency of the speaker. High spl speakers will sound louder than low spl speakers even with less power. Then there is the clarity and frequency response. Even with single tone machines, a wide response speaker will give you more information.
If you apply a 1khz square wave to a narrow response speaker, you cannot reproduce the squareness of the wave. The edges get rounded. A square wave or rectangular wave is made up of many harmonics at many frequencies. If that were not true, a trumpet may sound like a flute. If they play the exact same frequency, they sound much different in real life because the shape of the wave is different.
But getting back to ohms, there is not a lot of power difference there. But you want to squeeze out as much as you can and stay efficient. Mostly the differences you hear are the speaker quality.
But you be surprised what headphones use the same exact speaker and the only difference is quality of the other components.

 

[Goodrat]

Headphones with 150 ohm speakers are actually 75 ohm heaphones.

 

[Goodrat]

Your right. There should be more discussion from the manufacturers.
It's like pulling teeth to ask them what their machine output is and you can get 5 different answers. Yeah most end up at first with low cost Calrads because they are so available due to price. Me included. Then I put on a pair of full cup phones with lots of isolation and the comfort was night and day.
Minlab is either tight lipped or they don't have a clue. Tesoro tells some customers 32 ohm. Now why would they say that is their machines are 150 ohm?
Then there is the fact that stereo phones are rated in oms PER SIDE. So if you get 32 ohm stereo phones (Calrads, Koss), you are at 16 when you hook them up to a mono machine.
So you are left with just having to try a few. Chances are, you will have to try a few brands.
I think the attitude is left over from when most would just connect the headphones they use for their home stereo and left it at that. But circuity in machines has changed a lot. Go for comfort and durability and wide range. The impedance above 100.

 

[Uncle Willy]

My $12.00 little phones sound as good as the big bucks phones and are a lot cooler. We're hearing a detector signal, not listening to a symphony in stereo.

Bill

 

[jbow]

Me too. I have a set of Sun Ray phones but hardly ever use them. I really don't hear a meaningful difference between the little on ear Radio Shack phones I use most of the time and you are right, they are so much cooler and so much more comfortable. Full cup phones not only get wet with sweat but they make the edges of my ears hurt after a while. I buy 10 dollar phones two or three at a time in case I break a set... if I break them I toss them.

[attachment 67483 pRS1C-2266325w345.jpg]

I plug them into a 4' extender with a volume control.

Someone tell me what I am missing... I cannot run them wide open, they are too loud. I don't get why I would need cupped phones but I am open to learn...

J