Has the Equinox made all single vlf machines obsolete??

[calabash digger]

I will compare multi IQ tech to single freq vlf machines in this demo. I will use silver and gold in the demo and will use the AT GOLD , XP DEUS ,and EQUINOX 800 in this demo.https://youtu.be/VXTCHyYVNB8

 

[vlad]

Why not throw in a V3i (and the DFX predated it by a number of years too) as it has multi+ can break down the frequencies into 3 singles; and has been out originally as the V3 since, 2009?
You can go from a recovery speed that's Sovereign slow to multiple hits (fast) on one sweep.

 

[calabash digger]

I thought you had to have degree to fun a V3 I ? What does a V3 I cost these days? I know a beach hunter who is very good with a v3i and I'm gonna see if he might be interested in bring his machine to test it here..

 

[KyJoe]

https://youtu.be/GKkw3O2-iVE

Here's an elevated nail test with my Deus and HF 9" round coil at 14kHz. Wish I had a Nox to test or any other machine for that matter, I don't even have my Racer on hand. My results are so different from what I've seen I decided to make a quick video. I have a 1920's old school house on my farm that I've hunted for 15+ years. I've been getting skunked on coins for the last 4 years until the HF and a new program I'm running (not Calabash's). My last 3 hunts have turned up 12 coins including 2 silver.

 

[sprchng]

Define your connotation of "obsolete"

 

[vlad]

and an engineering degree might help some.
(Or maybe working in the Space Program like NASA Tom-cannot see him having much of a problem.....though its a mite confusing at times)
(wish that ML had expanded the EQ i.d. scale though-especially the lower end)
Bet Nel hits with a small loop sooner than ML too.

 

[Joedaddy276]

https://youtu.be/GKkw3O2-iVE

Here's an elevated nail test with my Deus and HF 9" round coil at 14kHz. Wish I had a Nox to test or any other machine for that matter, I don't even have my Racer on hand. My results are so different from what I've seen I decided to make a quick video. I have a 1920's old school house on my farm that I've hunted for 15+ years. I've been getting skunked on coins for the last 4 years until the HF and a new program I'm running (not Calabash's). My last 3 hunts have turned up 12 coins including 2 silver.

That's most definatly hitting it kyjoe

 

[vlad]

If I need 2, or 3 detectors to cover all the situations, so be it-I'm amazed at times with the prices some top end units are offered for. (and it seems about anything can be repaired regardless of age)
It like saying a Fender Stratocaster first made in 1954 is obsolete, but they are still made. Buddy Holly was the first to showcase one, up through George Harrison, John Lennon, Clapton, Hendrix
(I would not call them obsolete either) up through today's top musicians,
(Besides, my Tek Mk-1 works just fine-depth modded by Keith Wills-and plays beautiful music when it goes through the full tonal range.)

 

[dan b]

Has the Equinox made “Buy American” obsolete?

 

[calabash digger]

https://youtu.be/GKkw3O2-iVE

Here's an elevated nail test with my Deus and HF 9" round coil at 14kHz. Wish I had a Nox to test or any other machine for that matter, I don't even have my Racer on hand. My results are so different from what I've seen I decided to make a quick video. I have a 1920's old school house on my farm that I've hunted for 15+ years. I've been getting skunked on coins for the last 4 years until the HF and a new program I'm running (not Calabash's). My last 3 hunts have turned up 12 coins including 2 silver.

Nice video. The iron I'm using is from a 17OOs plantation site. If I pm you my address will you send me those 2 nails you were using or a couple like them or can I mail you a couple of these nails to try? I'm not getting results like that with the iron I'm using and that's all I can come up with. I wonder if its the type of nails I'm using? There is no way I can put the iron I'm using that close and still hit the target.

 

[vlad]

then add in the ground and results can change drastically.(I was testing units with new nails once; 2-3 10 penny finishing nails-none of the VLFS would pick them up in disc.
I tried all metal on a DMC-2 B in non motion- no sound. Perplexed was an understatement. Then I tried the pinpoint mode on a C$, CZ and Cointrax Baron-ZAP! Of course my PI whammed it)
I asked Eric Foster and he said it was the zinc coating and heat treatment that caused the reaction.
You learn new things everyday.

 

[calabash digger]

I'm still waiting for the OP to produce a definition of "obsolete" that doesn't make his question look like a stupid one.

Ok people are bent out of shape about the Equinox test vids. When I first came to this forum it was the deus videos that everybody got ticked off about. You can look up the word obsolete... Heres a fact.. a detector locked at lets say 14 kh cannot see small gold as good or even if can see as a detector that's running 54 kh. That not my opinion that's a fact. Why do gold machines run high kh? Okay then a detector locked at 54 kh on the flip side cant see silver as well as a detector say in 7 kh. If it has any depth to it at all in might NOT even see it. So as with deus you have to set it up one way or the other, either for low conducters or higher conducter and targets might be missed. Hence sliver if your in a gold freq and gold if your in a silver freq. I'm just using those 2 metals as example as there on the high and low end of the spectrum. The machine that is locked at the single freq should be self explanatory. Targets on the conductive scale will go outside what its freq is able to hit. if your machine is 14 kh its not gonna be hot on gold as a 50 kh machine and its not gonna be as hot on silver as a 5 kh machine. Minelab has developed a machine that can hit on the low scale and high scale and everything in between at the same time. where as the deus has to be tweaked for one or the other to obtain the best performance. If your using a single vlf that cant change freqs your just out of luck.... The deus with the hf coil is a bad machine but what it can do with that coil with different tweaks and changes the minelab can do it ALL at the same time... Theres your definition of obsolete..... Why do you think companies have been going to those multi freq coils? Deus was forerunner and now minelab has went a step farther...bottom line

 

[KyJoe]

Calabash, PM sent.

I have alot of other nails I'll try also and see if it makes a difference. I'll also try some different programs, I just wanted to keep the video as short as possible. I'll have a new replacement coil for my Racer tomorrow and I'll see how it does. Usually I have atleast 4 detectors in the stable but only have 2 at the moment.

I would like to go on the record and say I take all these tests with a grain of salt. We simply can't duplicate in ground conditions and probably shouldn't attempt to draw definitive conclusions based on their results, but atleast we have "something" to measure it against and I find it very interesting to say the least.

I would buy a Nox tomorrow if I could. I think with the speed of todays processors the multi freq approach is working better than in the past. My Explorer and CTX didn't work good for me in my iron infested ground because of slow recovery speeds due to analyzing multiple frequencies.
There's a lot to be said for single frequency machines super analyzing one frequency at great speed the way Deus, Kruzer and many others do. (Tejon, Vistas, and my favorite F19 and so many others)

Based on what I've seen and the definition of the word "obsolete" (no longer useful) the Nox hasn't obsoleted anything. There are machines that equal or even beat it in some niche areas, but if you look at it as a whole things are different. If you could only have one machine it may be the ticket.

I'm on a waiting list for an 800. sigh

 

[vlad]

The Compass X-200 was the first to allow selecting between 2 frequencies.
Troy told me years ago he added a circuit that made the X-5 hit high conductors as far out as low ones on the 19kHz unit---and tests bear it out, but he kept quiet on how the circuit worked.
Love to see a Fisher multi freq TR from the '70's, but must be a rare bird because they are not around.

 

[#1Leatherneck]

Why not throw in a V3i (and the DFX predated it by a number of years too) as it has multi+ can break down the frequencies into 3 singles; and has been out originally as the V3 since, 2009?
You can go from a recovery speed that's Sovereign slow to multiple hits (fast) on one sweep.

As of now, I am still awaiting a comparison of the V3i, which is still undoubtedly the most configurability? ? ?

There are many that are very knowledgeable of the V3i?

Once it is mastered how does it compare to the Equinox 800? ? ?

 

[calabash digger]

Seems the biggest advantage to multi IQ is iron ...To be fair KYJOE that was a dime and a ring which are not the toughest targets to hit. I used that thin piece of gold in my test on purpose.... That piece of gold was on a site with dig holes all round it for. The site has been hammered for 30 yrs its one the hardest hit sites ive ever seen. That gold piece was 2 inchs at the most...Why was it not found? The Deus was in 54 kh and it was in and around iron. Other lower freq machines just couldn't see it. I can prove that with test over and over again. Why would I want to ever use a single freq for relics, coin shooting, or beach hunting ever again ? I will show you why and my thinking on the matter. Let me give you a example. You got your Deus in 14 kh and I got the Nox and we are back on my colonial gold site few weeks back. I'm in park two on the Nox . My colonial gold piece is still in the ground. Ok you walk over the colonial gold piece in 14 kh . What happens the Deus will not make a peep. Oh yeah theres another guy there with a AT GOLD and he walks over it. What happens ? It doesn't make a peep? WHY? FREQS are not high enough for either machine to see it......can show it over and over in the test been doing. Of course its with the actual style nails found at site. Ok I walk by in park two on the Nox and what happens ? Bam got it. Switch the Deus to 54 kh and bam it hits it.. AT GOLD user is just out of luck,,,, (Think about the word obsolete in that scenario) Okay later on that day we get on another spot and your running your Deus in 54 kh because you saw that gold I found and you want to find some for yourself.. I get a DEEP faint signal around the iron and call you over to check OH YEAH at this point you Also changed your reactivity to 3 because the iron is machine gun iron. You sweep it and the Deus is a no go ... I dig it and it turns out to a mint 8 1/2 inch 1/2 mint reale.. Why was the Deus a no go???? 54 KH is the culprit and the reactivity of which killed your depth . Its one or the other with it. The AT GOLD user trys it and oh yeah hes using the 5 X 8 coil for separation and its a no go for him ... Why because the 5 x 8 coil will not see a small silver that deep. Would he have seen it with the stock coil maybe or maybe not but the gold earlier was still a no go. That's about the most realistic story I can make up to demonstrate the BENIFITS of multi IQ and how it runs the freqs at one time....It can hit the extremes of the conductivity scale from one end to the other without having to be tweaked... Do you see what I mean? So yes the word OBSOLETE does come into my mind and many others too.. A lot of people are saying what you just said its mediocore or might just be great all around machine. It will do all that the Deus does with a 9 inch coil and more.... It will separate with the Deus 9 inch coil too and its wearing a 11. You know I love my Deus but when I got a machine that will perform like it and it runs that range of freqs at one time well its a game changer. I would have to hunt a site in 7 kh , 11kh,14kh, 28kh, and yes 54kh or 74 kh to match what the equinox is doing the first time around .... so yes the word OBSOLETE comes back into my mind again. Why would I want to have to cover a site in all those freqs on the Deus when I can do it at the same time with the Equinox? As for that matter why would anyone want to do that? Which machine increases your odds the most if you could only hunt a site once? If your using a machine that has just one freq than your just out of luck.... Guys are going to take this Multi Freq machine back to there hammered sites and start pulling targets like theres no tomorrow... WHY? Because of the way it spans the freq range and IT will pick up a wide variety of conductive targets. BTW that multi IQ is doing something in the unmasking department too.. How could what I said above not be a great benefit to any relic hunter, coin hunter, or jewelry hunter?? You guys don't like the word obsolete... but check this short video out of in the field target checks...Some got so upset and even said his machine was defective His machine is in 7 kh BECAUSE the emi would not permit him to run anything else tried to switch to 17 kh and it was unusable.power lines close by.....notice my partners face .[video]https://youtu.be/lxUmya3S0fs[/video]

 

[#1Leatherneck]

I'm still waiting for the OP to produce a definition of "obsolete" that doesn't make his question look like a stupid one.
Ok people are bent out of shape about the Equinox test vids. When I first came to this forum it was the deus videos that everybody got ticked off about. You can look up the word obsolete... Heres a fact.. a detector locked at lets say 14 kh cannot see small gold as good or even if can see as a detector that's running 54 kh. That not my opinion that's a fact. Why do gold machines run high kh? Okay then a detector locked at 54 kh on the flip side cant see silver as well as a detector say in 7 kh. If it has any depth to it at all in might NOT even see it. So as with deus you have to set it up one way or the other, either for low conducters or higher conducter and targets might be missed. Hence sliver if your in a gold freq and gold if your in a silver freq. I'm just using those 2 metals as example as there on the high and low end of the spectrum. The machine that is locked at the single freq should be self explanatory. Targets on the conductive scale will go outside what its freq is able to hit. if your machine is 14 kh its not gonna be hot on gold as a 50 kh machine and its not gonna be as hot on silver as a 5 kh machine. Minelab has developed a machine that can hit on the low scale and high scale and everything in between at the same time. where as the deus has to be tweaked for one or the other to obtain the best performance. If your using a single vlf that cant change freqs your just out of luck.... The deus with the hf coil is a bad machine but what it can do with that coil with different tweaks and changes the minelab can do it ALL at the same time... Theres your definition of obsolete..... Why do you think companies have been going to those multi freq coils? Deus was forerunner and now minelab has went a step farther...bottom line

This is a statement I have very good concept of , a metal detector is only capable of what it is designed to do? ? ?

 

[#1Leatherneck]

Seems the biggest advantage to multi IQ is iron ...To be fair KYJOE that was a dime and a ring which are not the toughest targets to hit. I used that thin piece of gold in my test on purpose.... That piece of gold was on a site with dig holes all round it for. The site has been hammered for 30 yrs its one the hardest hit sites ive ever seen. That gold piece was 2 inchs at the most...Why was it not found? The Deus was in 54 kh and it was in and around iron. Other lower freq machines just couldn't see it. I can prove that with test over and over again. Why would I want to ever use a single freq for relics, coin shooting, or beach hunting ever again ? I will show you why and my thinking on the matter. Let me give you a example. You got your Deus in 14 kh and I got the Nox and we are back on my colonial gold site few weeks back. I'm in park two on the Nox . My colonial gold piece is still in the ground. Ok you walk over the colonial gold piece in 14 kh . What happens the Deus will not make a peep. Oh yeah theres another guy there with a AT GOLD and he walks over it. What happens ? It doesn't make a peep? WHY? FREQS are not high enough for either machine to see it......can show it over and over in the test been doing. Of course its with the actual style nails found at site. Ok I walk by in park two on the Nox and what happens ? Bam got it. Switch the Deus to 54 kh and bam it hits it.. AT GOLD user is just out of luck,,,, (Think about the word obsolete in that scenario) Okay later on that day we get on another spot and your running your Deus in 54 kh because you saw that gold I found and you want to find some for yourself.. I get a DEEP faint signal around the iron and call you over to check OH YEAH at this point you Also changed your reactivity to 3 because the iron is machine gun iron. You sweep it and the Deus is a no go ... I dig it and it turns out to a mint 8 1/2 inch 1/2 mint reale.. Why was the Deus a no go???? 54 KH is the culprit and the reactivity of which killed your depth . Its one or the other with it. The AT GOLD user trys it and oh yeah hes using the 5 X 8 coil for separation and its a no go for him ... Why because the 5 x 8 coil will not see a small silver that deep. Would he have seen it with the stock coil maybe or maybe not but the gold earlier was still a no go. That's about the most realistic story I can make up to demonstrate the BENIFITS of multi IQ and how it runs the freqs at one time....It can hit the extremes of the conductivity scale from one end to the other without having to be tweaked... Do you see what I mean? So yes the word OBSOLETE does come into my mind and many others too.. A lot of people are saying what you just said its mediocore or might just be great all around machine. It will do all that the Deus does with a 9 inch coil and more.... It will separate with the Deus 9 inch coil too and its wearing a 11. You know I love my Deus but when I got a machine that will perform like it and it runs that range of freqs at one time well its a game changer. I would have to hunt a site in 7 kh , 11kh,14kh, 28kh, and yes 54kh or 74 kh to match what the equinox is doing the first time around .... so yes the word OBSOLETE comes back into my mind again. Why would I want to have to cover a site in all those freqs on the Deus when I can do it at the same time with the Equinox? As for that matter why would anyone want to do that? Which machine increases your odds the most if you could only hunt a site once? If your using a machine that has just one freq than your just out of luck.... Guys are going to take this Multi Freq machine back to there hammered sites and start pulling targets like theres no tomorrow... WHY? Because of the way it spans the freq range and IT will pick up a wide variety of conductive targets. BTW that multi IQ is doing something in the unmasking department too.. How could what I said above not be a great benefit to any relic hunter, coin hunter, or jewelry hunter?? You guys don't like the word obsolete... but check this short video out of in the field target checks...Some got so upset and even said his machine was defective His machine is in 7 kh BECAUSE the emi would not permit him to run anything else tried to switch to 17 kh and it was unusable.power lines close by.....notice my partners face .https://youtu.be/lxUmya3S0fs

Thanks for the post! Together, with the video! Indisputably, the Equinox 800 has brought one thing to the table. 1.) There is 'very little' merit to the age old statement 'you get what you pay for'! The metal detector will now be compelled to implement technology into the detector to compliment the fact one must be extremely competitive. 2.) Metal detectors on the horizon will all (undoubtedly) be priced within the price of the Equinox 800? Thus, corroborating no longer will there be any merit to you get what you pay for! In all honesty considering the ability of a metal detector what will any detector priced higher than the Equinox 800 have to offer? ? ? Facts: Technology! What will the technology of tomorrow be? ? ? In my opinion we will soon see! Very soon, perhaps, by the end of the year!

 

[vlad]

it takes some time to learn--but there are many people with custom programs available.
The problem is that most people are never confident that their configuration has the most depth--so many things to change that seem minor but may have a big effect.
The recovery can be set to match any detector's speed-slow, to making a pass at a high recovery rate and it sounds like a machinegun (and the faster the less depth.)
I have a program set up where I vary the frequency method, recovery, and notch accept/reject.
But frankly, with a 9.5 concentric or a Nel Thunder or 10X12 SEF, the depth for open areas is not there (setup for single freq deep silver.) It cannot get the depth of an SE Pro or a CZ
I think its better suited for separation, beach, and say a dime at about 8-9" MAX (low bandpass filter in very mild ground.) Its better with EMI than a DFX.
Its little brother the VX3 has less options in setup--and is cheaper.
The EQ seems from results (posted) a best buy for performance and money. (why they compressed the TID range when they could have expanded it is a mystery.)
What's your MOS, Mac? (my primaries are 11B/11F, Scout/Recondo-Pathfinder...and a mess of other schools)

 

[sprchng]

I'm still waiting for the OP to produce a definition of "obsolete" that doesn't make his question look like a stupid one.
Ok people are bent out of shape about the Equinox test vids. When I first came to this forum it was the deus videos that everybody got ticked off about. You can look up the word obsolete... Heres a fact.. a detector locked at lets say 14 kh cannot see small gold as good or even if can see as a detector that's running 54 kh. That not my opinion that's a fact. Why do gold machines run high kh? Okay then a detector locked at 54 kh on the flip side cant see silver as well as a detector say in 7 kh. If it has any depth to it at all in might NOT even see it. So as with deus you have to set it up one way or the other, either for low conducters or higher conducter and targets might be missed. Hence sliver if your in a gold freq and gold if your in a silver freq. I'm just using those 2 metals as example as there on the high and low end of the spectrum. The machine that is locked at the single freq should be self explanatory. Targets on the conductive scale will go outside what its freq is able to hit. if your machine is 14 kh its not gonna be hot on gold as a 50 kh machine and its not gonna be as hot on silver as a 5 kh machine. Minelab has developed a machine that can hit on the low scale and high scale and everything in between at the same time. where as the deus has to be tweaked for one or the other to obtain the best performance. If your using a single vlf that cant change freqs your just out of luck.... The deus with the hf coil is a bad machine but what it can do with that coil with different tweaks and changes the minelab can do it ALL at the same time... Theres your definition of obsolete..... Why do you think companies have been going to those multi freq coils? Deus was forerunner and now minelab has went a step farther...bottom line

Okay , I see now , an outcome based definition for obsolete , similar to environmental climate science and amateur detector testing.