gold signals

[bdecriscio]

I know dig everything is a good answer but my back doesn't allow this anymore so my question is, to not miss opportunities for gold jewelery, what signals (numberwise) might be best. I have an ace 400 and when I test with gold rings I get many different nubers, 40 or 52 or 62 and of course these numbers are often other things in the field. If this is not the way to look, maybe signal streanth or something else might help. I usually search for coins primarily but hate to think I'm missing potential gold jewellry. Thanks

 

[jim tn]

As you've already determined yourself, gold can read about any where from the foil numbers up into the coin range. I dig all nickel range readings that don't jump around all that much and typically recover 3-4 gold rings annually on average that way. Also digging zinc and other cent readings usually get me on average per year another 2-3. Usually bigger gold like class rings. Still a bunch of digging, however. Good luck! HH jim tn

 

[bdecriscio]

As you've already determined yourself, gold can read about any where from the foil numbers up into the coin range. I dig all nickel range readings that don't jump around all that much and typically recover 3-4 gold rings annually on average that way. Also digging zinc and other cent readings usually get me on average per year another 2-3. Usually bigger gold like class rings. Still a bunch of digging, however. Good luck! HH jim tn

Thank you for your response Jim, interesting about the lower cent readings because I've noticed that this detector loves pennies especially newer ones.

 

[Monte]

I know dig everything is a good answer but my back doesn't allow this anymore ...

That is generally correct ... recover everything that produces a smaller-size, narrow response since the gold jewelry isn't going to be larger-size. My back and other body parts I still have definitely limit the amount of bending and stooping I do. Has since an on-the-job back injury in '87, and I was given a cane by my doctor to help me be able to get around back in March of '93. The last five to ten years is really become a struggle ... BUT, I enjoy finding good gold and silver jewelry along with all the coins, trade tokens and other keepers out there. The first suggestion, since you're mainly hunting urban types of Coin Hunting environments and hoping for gold jewelry, is to probably ignore all Iron, ferrous range, signals. Just do not reject anything above the ferrous/non-ferrous break-point.

so my question is, to not miss opportunities for gold jewelery, what signals (numberwise) might be best.

The 'numbers' will depend on those used by the particular detector you have in-hand. The blanket gold jewelry range suggestion is the 'numbers' can range anywhere from very low foil, just above the ferrous break-point, on up through old and new Pull-Tabs and Pry-tabs and into the Screw Cap range. But that's for most gold jewelry. You can find some better gold at higher VDI read-outs, such as a couple of 24 k, pure gold rings I found that locked-on as a US Penny/Dime, and a few very high k-rated rings or pendants that reached into the modern Zinc Cent VDI range.

I have an ace 400 and when I test with gold rings I get many different nubers, 40 or 52 or 62 ...

You need to find a wider variety of gold jewelry to test sample. Small, thin baby or child's rings, tiny pinky-finger rings and some toe rings will fall in the lower-end of the non-ferrous scale. So will thin gold chins for a wrist, ankle or to hold a neck charm. Then you have a medium range of gold chains to larger, heavier and thicker gold chains. Odd-shaped gold reads differently can due to the shape and orientation in the ground and to the search coil. Chains that are balled up vs chains that are more strung-out. Off-shaped pendants and broaches or religious pieces.

If searching a low-trash locations, such as in a sand-filled volleyball court, etc., the trash is generally much lower than coins and rings and such, so you simply recover all you can. If hunting a popular-use locations, such as around a picnic bowery where there is a lot of common discarded junk, you can 'try' to identify the mosr common trash read-outs and ignore them ..... but any avid detectorist will tell you that doing so, you are very likely to bypass a nice gold jewelry item. So, ignore iron and go after anything out there.

and of course these numbers are often other things in the field. If this is not the way to look, maybe signal streanth or something else might help. I usually search for coins primarily but hate to think I'm missing potential gold jewellry. Thanks

Signal strength isn't really going to matter because that can vary based ups the object's depth, orientation to the search coil, and the search coil presentation. I've found, with over five decades of very avid detecting, that while good gold and silver jewelry can be lost anywhere, my odds greatly increase be hard-hunting the most likely places for it to be worn and lost. Location is definitely the key. I live in a very small town with one park playground and it is very, very seldom used. The playground or the park. A ball diamond that might be made use of for some casual neighborhood' type get-together games six or fewer times a year.

But when I lived in the Portland Oregon metro area, there was an abundance of parks, schools, sports fields and picnic gathering areas that saw very frequent use. There I had ample 'locations' with good jewelry potential, and while there's a lot of costume jewelry out there, my silver jewelry was usually 5 to 6 times what gold jewelry was recovered, and a typical year of detecting rewarded me with ±20 good gold rings plus some other jewelry items. Location is a key, then comes being patient, putting in the time, and making a lot of recoveries.

Monte

 

[bdecriscio]

That is generally correct ... recover everything that produces a smaller-size, narrow response since the gold jewelry isn't going to be larger-size. My back and other body parts I still have definitely limit the amount of bending and stooping I do. Has since an on-the-job back injury in '87, and I was given a cane by my doctor to help me be able to get around back in March of '93. The last five to ten years is really become a struggle ... BUT, I enjoy finding good gold and silver jewelry along with all the coins, trade tokens and other keepers out there. The first suggestion, since you're mainly hunting urban types of Coin Hunting environments and hoping for gold jewelry, is to probably ignore all Iron, ferrous range, signals. Just do not reject anything above the ferrous/non-ferrous break-point.


The 'numbers' will depend on those used by the particular detector you have in-hand. The blanket gold jewelry range suggestion is the 'numbers' can range anywhere from very low foil, just above the ferrous break-point, on up through old and new Pull-Tabs and Pry-tabs and into the Screw Cap range. But that's for most gold jewelry. You can find some better gold at higher VDI read-outs, such as a couple of 24 k, pure gold rings I found that locked-on as a US Penny/Dime, and a few very high k-rated rings or pendants that reached into the modern Zinc Cent VDI range.


You need to find a wider variety of gold jewelry to test sample. Small, thin baby or child's rings, tiny pinky-finger rings and some toe rings will fall in the lower-end of the non-ferrous scale. So will thin gold chins for a wrist, ankle or to hold a neck charm. Then you have a medium range of gold chains to larger, heavier and thicker gold chains. Odd-shaped gold reads differently can due to the shape and orientation in the ground and to the search coil. Chains that are balled up vs chains that are more strung-out. Off-shaped pendants and broaches or religious pieces.

If searching a low-trash locations, such as in a sand-filled volleyball court, etc., the trash is generally much lower than coins and rings and such, so you simply recover all you can. If hunting a popular-use locations, such as around a picnic bowery where there is a lot of common discarded junk, you can 'try' to identify the mosr common trash read-outs and ignore them ..... but any avid detectorist will tell you that doing so, you are very likely to bypass a nice gold jewelry item. So, ignore iron and go after anything out there.


Signal strength isn't really going to matter because that can vary based ups the object's depth, orientation to the search coil, and the search coil presentation. I've found, with over five decades of very avid detecting, that while good gold and silver jewelry can be lost anywhere, my odds greatly increase be hard-hunting the most likely places for it to be worn and lost. Location is definitely the key. I live in a very small town with one park playground and it is very, very seldom used. The playground or the park. A ball diamond that might be made use of for some casual neighborhood' type get-together games six or fewer times a year.

But when I lived in the Portland Oregon metro area, there was an abundance of parks, schools, sports fields and picnic gathering areas that saw very frequent use. There I had ample 'locations' with good jewelry potential, and while there's a lot of costume jewelry out there, my silver jewelry was usually 5 to 6 times what gold jewelry was recovered, and a typical year of detecting rewarded me with ±20 good gold rings plus some other jewelry items. Location is a key, then comes being patient, putting in the time, and making a lot of recoveries.

Monte

 

[bdecriscio]

Thank you so much, Your explanation helps in why and where gold items might appear. I'm glad you can still get out, I also stuggle a bit but enjoy the activity immensly. Will also pay more attention to target size etc.

 

[John-Edmonton]

Different Karat ratings....10K, 14K, 18K, 22K have different amounts of elements mixed with them for color and strength. A 24K ring is too soft and not practical. So, you will get different readings. Also the mass and size of a ring will affect the reading. So, what now? If you get a nice, even sounding signal in all directions with the coil, it could be gold! Your biggest enemy are pull tabs. Square tabs read around 51, 52, 53 with the APEX. A square pull tab generally gives a double "bleep" in a certain direction. You can probably rule this one out. The beaver tail pull tab will generally give you a good signal in the low 50's, but it is generally a bit deeper, as they have not been used for many years.

So, you might want to leave the deeper signals in the ground along with the double "bleeps" to cut down on your digging. Have you considered speaking with a physio-therapist or occupational therapist? You may just get your back back to a much better condition through stretching and doing exercises. I work in a rehab unit, and have seen some wonderful examples of positive changes. In fact, metal detecting using proper body mechanics regularly, might strengthen your back altogether.

Stay safe!

 

[bdecriscio]

Different Karat ratings....10K, 14K, 18K, 22K have different amounts of elements mixed with them for color and strength. A 24K ring is too soft and not practical. So, you will get different readings. Also the mass and size of a ring will affect the reading. So, what now? If you get a nice, even sounding signal in all directions with the coil, it could be gold! Your biggest enemy are pull tabs. Square tabs read around 51, 52, 53 with the APEX. A square pull tab generally gives a double "bleep" in a certain direction. You can probably rule this one out. The beaver tail pull tab will generally give you a good signal in the low 50's, but it is generally a bit deeper, as they have not been used for many years.
g erratic signals
So, you might want to leave the deeper signals in the ground along with the double "bleeps" to cut down on your digging. Have you considered speaking with a physio-therapist or occupational therapist? You may just get your back back to a much better condition through stretching and doing exercises. I work in a rehab unit, and have seen some wonderful examples of positive changes. In fact, metal detecting using proper body mechanics regularly, might strengthen your back altogether.

Stay safe!

View attachment 8473

Thank you so much for your reply The information regarding the pull tabs is definently helpful as well as the reasons for such a wide range of gold signals. I do have a tendancy to dig erratic signals so that is something I can be aware of also. I have considered some back therapy(lower) but My mris show quite a bit of bone on bone vertibrae loss as well as stenosis as well. I am trying to lose a few pounds and strenthening my core a bit. And all in all I'm sure the detecting activity is helpful. Thanks again

 

[Ronstar]

Just so you dont think those numbers are proprietary to your detector...... my wife’s 14k white gold ring shows up in the foil range on both my Fisher F5 and F75 (and if you dont think that didnt cause a lot tense moments trying to explain that... !!! Lol). My 14k white gold band rings up in the nickel range. Most silver rings show in the dime or quarter range. The one big gold find I struck was a 14k, 20” x 1/4” necklace that was coiled up along side a gravel road in a sports field. And as they said that thing was a solid foil number with no wavering but so are the round drink seals. I almost passed on it but the solid number at any direction swept made me dig it. At the time it was valued at $1100 in scrap. Now that should motivate anyone to dig junk dont you think??? Just sayin....

 

[bdecriscio]

Just so you dont think those numbers are proprietary to your detector...... my wife’s 14k white gold ring shows up in the foil range on both my Fisher F5 and F75 (and if you dont think that didnt cause a lot tense moments trying to explain that... !!! Lol). My 14k white gold band rings up in the nickel range. Most silver rings show in the dime or quarter range. The one big gold find I struck was a 14k, 20” x 1/4” necklace that was coiled up along side a gravel road in a sports field. And as they said that thing was a solid foil number with no wavering but so are the round drink seals. I almost passed on it but the solid number at any direction swept made me dig it. At the time it was valued at $1100 in scrap. Now that should motivate anyone to dig junk dont you think??? Just sayin....

Great story, Will follow advice and try to dig more lol! Thanks

 

[Monte]

Just a few comments to add to the confusion:

Thank you so much for your reply The information regarding the pull tabs is definently helpful as well as the reasons for such a wide range of gold signals.

As John mentioned, there are a lot of different alloy mixes in jewelry, and just the 'k' rating are going to have a major impact on the VDI read-out. Also, as he related the size or mass, or thickness of the ring, as a whole, or with portions of it, such as the width of the band-portion or the top of a ring can make a difference. Also adding to the 'differences' in VDI read-outs will be the orientation, just like that of a coin or token or pull-tab or pry-tab or any other relatively flattish or roundish-ring-type object. Couple all those variables with the 'depth' or actually the 'distance' from the search coil as well as the search coil size and winding type, and you end up with the very wide-range of variables that will impact what you hear, and what you see in a display, of all the good jewelry rings and such that your search coil will encounter. .... continued

I do have a tendancy to dig erratic signals so that is something I can be aware of also.

If you want various good jewelry items, as well as any coins or tokens that are now out-of-sight, you're going to want to enhance your tendency to go after erratic signals. Why? Well, it's due to the detector design, the search coil design, the close-proximity of a target to the search coil, the orientation of the target in the ground, the direction of approach and coil-sweep of the unseen target .... and more. Here are a few explanations:

Detector Design: Some detectors, due to their operating frequency, might not be great on all three conductivity ranges: lower, medium and high. Also, some detector model designs have a wide-range of VDI read-out numbers which can therefore have one target item spread a read-out over a slightly wider-range of numbers while other designs produce a tighter read-out using fewer VDI numbers that might only reflect one or two or possibly three numbers for a target. However, that also means other targets, the non-desirable ones, might also fall in that tighter read-out.

Search Coil Design: For your VLF detectors you basically have two search coil types: Concentric or Double-D. Both types might work reasonably well, but it can depend on the overall search coil size, the individual Transmit and Receive winding size and shape, and placement or orientation of the Rx coil within the Tx coil. The same goes for the DD coils which might be rounder and more open on the outer portions of the windings, or a narrower elliptical shape and then it once again depends on hos much overlap there is of the Tx and Rx windings in the center of the coil (front-to-rear).

The biggest different in VDI read-outs is most often seen when using a DD coil because the approach and departure of the coil when sweeping a target is presenting the Tx outer field first and departing with the Rx outer-winding, and then the reverse on the opposite-direction sweep. Keep that in mind when using any DD coil.

Target / Coil Proximity: This is one that we most often see being an issue based upon the search coil size and type, coupled with the frequency and the Tx power being generated, as well as the receive gain and effect on the Electro-Magnetic Field, or EMF. Also factored in the the particular detector's circuitry design and how they react to or handle 'Overload' or Near-Proximity targets'. Naturally, target size becomes an issue here as well.

Too often I note that people believe the EMF is only a downward projection from the search coil, but it isn't. The EMF is radiating out about the search coil top-and-bottom and then out to the sides, and if the unit has a high gain level and ample power, the search coil should be operated at least 1" off the dirt/rock/sand/whatever or up to possibly 2". This is required to help reduce or eliminate the ground mineral compression of the near-proximity EMF which can impair detection depth, and sometimes also cause an 'overload' effect. Also, if a target is too close to some search coils, even within ±1", you might not notice any difference in target response or detector behavior. But .... with most of the more modern and higher-gain detectors, there is most often going to be a chance for an 'overload' condition if too close to a bigger target, such as a soda can, or even a smaller-size target like a larger coin or bigger jewelry item. The 'overload' might be handled by an audio buzzing tone or a quick, repetitious beeping sound, and some makes and models simply shut-down and you hear no response at all from a good target that is too close to the coil.

Target Orientation: This is one that many people are slow to learn, if they do, because they lay a target on the ground or floor and sweep over it to learn an audio response, and audio tone, or a VDI read-out. Unfortunately, not all lost objects are nice and flat to the coil. They might be odd-shaped, like some larger rings with a narrow, thin band but a wider-shaped top-piece that hold a stone or something. Worse yet, a good target might be in a canted-position or even 'on-edge' and that can cause difficulties in a few ways.

Using a coin or a uniform-shaped ring you can position it 'on-edge' and sweep the coil across it 'cross-ways' with the coil about 3" over the ring or coin. Most of the time you will hear a double-beep. Turn 90° and re-sweep that on-edge object going 'lengthwise' and one or two things will happen. 1.. If you get a good target response it will likely be a single-tone in the proper center-axis of the search coil, and 2.. The audio target response will most often be much weaker than a flat-positioned target .... if you get a hearable response at all in that direction.

And that is checking out a target with a proper center-coil sweep. Now angle the ring or coin or whatever in various canted orientations to the coil and you can get errant reading with the strongest 'hit' being a bit off-center, and in all of the not-so-perfect target orientations you're likely to get a much different audio response, different audio Tone ID, and for sure some wider-range read-outs of a numeric VDI response.

Coil Sweep or Approach Direction: As described, check out all of the above test scenarios from different approach directions and things just might be different. Just as you might see if you use a too-brisk or too-slow sweep speed.

► In the end, as you continue to study and enjoy this great outdoor sport, you will learn that it is far from perfect and predictable. It will require more patience, consume more time learning, and result in a lot more enjoyment when you feel more confident about your knowledge and learned skills and results afield.

I have considered some back therapy(lower) but My mris show quite a bit of bone on bone vertibrae loss as well as stenosis as well. I am trying to lose a few pounds and strenthening my core a bit. And all in all I'm sure the detecting activity is helpful.

Therapy, if you can handle it, can be helpful. Just don't over-do. The bone-on-bone would be the vertebrae, the bone, contacting each other more due to misalignment, bone spurs, or most often due to degenerative disk disease of the disks that should be healthy and full of fluid and fill the space between the vertebrae. Trust me, I know about having a terrible bad back, tip-to-tail, and have lived with it since back injury in '87 and again in June of '10. I have had back surgeries and some fusing since July of '95 and the last in August of '18 in my cervical-spine.

Losing weight is a struggle for this bad diabetic, especially since my mobility stinks and it's difficult to move and exercise with a cane and other helpful devices. I do need to lose weight and I wish you the best achieving that. But one 'exercise' I refuse to give up on is getting out whenever I can to put in whatever amount of metal detecting time I can. The getty-down and getty-up part is a struggle, but when I'm finding stuff it gets my mind off of some of the discomfort.

Great story, Will follow advice and try to dig more lol! Thanks

And after all this rambling I see you've decided to do what's right .... Dig More! No, not every target, but as times goes by you'll learn how to ignore a few more annoying response, and your recovery skills and techniques will improve and that will be a good thing. Also, at some point, you might move up to a little more 'advanced' detector than the Ace 400, and for serious Gold and Silver Jewelry Hunting the right pick can work to your advantage.

Monte