And just
"Who are the 'Good Guys?" There are two groups that fit that category. They are the more Avid Detectorists, like you and me, who use detectors often enough to truly enjoy them, to get to know them reasonably well, and they do what they can [size=small]
(such as respond on Forums)[/size] to try and help others. To share some knowledge and experiences.
So, who are the
'other' "Good Guys" I refer to? They are those manufacturers who seem to stay on top of things in the industry. The ones who appear to have a very good team of engineers to bring us new products in a timely manner. They tend to pay attention to the requests or demands, of consumers at both Hobbyist as well as Avid Detectorist levels. We can narrow it down even more to just include those manufacturers who are providing us products of quality in design and workmanship, functional adjustment features AND performance, and maintaining a reasonable and affordable MSRP.
It does NOT include manufacturers who get by for a long time with mediocre products, selling for a price that is well above current market value, especially when it is an older, more dated product and/or lacks newer innovative features.
Mike Hillis said:
Monte,
The new F75 models do have iron audio volume adjustment and many other modern day adjustment features.
Mike, between the F75 and Tek.'s T2 offerings, my personal preference is the T2. Probably because I started using a T2 when introduced on '06, and for me and my needs at the time, the T2 was a very good fit. Let it be clear that I am not "Brand Loyal' nor 'Brand Exclusive.' I never really have been. I used just own 1 home-built detector at a time from March of '65 until the summer of '68. At that time I went with factory-produced detectors, starting with a White's GhostTowner BFO, and I only had 1 detector at a time until mid-'71.
By later '71 and on until about mid-'83, I kept 2 to 4 detectors on-hand in my personal detector arsenal. Sometimes just two brands and at times I had up to four brands represented. Since mid-'83 I found myself outfitted with 4 to 8 different
models, and usually just USA manufacturers represented until I latched onto a Minelab as the only 'foreign-to-us' representative. Through the years since July of '83 I have kept 1 to 3 models just from Tesoro, and then a favored model or two from different other makers. The reasons were two-fold. One was I just happened to like their performance for different applications, and the other was because I liked their weight and balance, 'feel and comfort', and also because they had one or two search coils that fit my needs. And sometimes they just offered something 'different' than other models I had.
I enjoy many different makes and models for what they are and how they fit my needs. I don't like them particularly because of how they spell or pronounce their names, or due to their location of origin. I don't own today a Garrett detector [size=small]
(except for one pinpointer I acquired three months ago)[/size], and haven't had one for my personal use for a dozen or more years. But from Texas I do currently own a use a Teknetics model as well as a Fisher device. I also own and use a favorite White's, and I have my two favorite Tesoro models in my detector outfit. So four USA detector making companies are represented in my
Regular-Use Outfit, and for daily uses I also have two models from Nokta, and two months ago I added one from XP. So that's 6 different
brands I keep in my daily-use 'team' with a total of 13
individual models [size=small]
(I have duplicates of the Nokta CoRe and Relic, Fisher F44, and Tesoro Silver Sabre µMAX and Bandido II µMAX)[/size].
I'll trim some of my 'extras' out as I am also selling off a couple of other duplicate models I've had on-hand because I don't need all of them, and not all of the duplicate models, either. I will be adding another Nokta / Makro model, the coming Simplex +, but that will be an always-carry device and it will serve several things I need covered. It will always travel, even when I have to thin some of my carry gear such as when I go shopping or take my sister shopping. My always-ready trio will be a Simplex+, F44 and Bandido II µMAX, making my short-need travel-team all lighter weight and/or smaller-size models from Nokta / Makro and Fisher and Tesoro. These will all be more-or-less a daily, around-town 'travel team' should I want to make an impromptu hunt somewhere. Note, no 'brand loyalty.'
Mike Hillis said:
You know.....The F75 LTD DST models or the newer F75+ model still offer more bang for the buck, and feature set solutions to site conditions than most other detectors on the market today.
I am not going to argue, because there's no need to, the fact that the T2 and F75 offer more
"Bang-for-the-Buck', and have since they were introduced than most of the competitors have offered all this time. It's just been in more recent years that we have seen these makers and their competition step up and bring us more modern adjustment functions. As I stated earlier, I preferred the T2 over the F75's, and today I favor the T2+, even though it lacks some of the likeable adjustments I have enjoyed on other makes and models.
I really wish they would have been able to incorporate Iron Audio Volume on the T2+, and make it a more
'variable' or
'adjustable' Volume level. Yes, the F75 let's you opt for 2H or 2L as a Volume choice from 2F, but I didn't care for it. You have 2F which is simply a VCO enhanced pitch mode, like 1F, but in 2F you have [size=small]
(if memory serves me correctly)[/size] a VCO audio for the higher-conductive targets with a VCO/Pitch enhancement of a High Tone, and Iron is a processed [size=small]
(meaning Non-VCO)[/size] audio that is also at full audio Volume. It isn't VCO enhanced and therefore doesn't diminish in loudness like the High-Tone VCO does as the coil-to-target distance is increased.
That Low-Tone Iron Audio sound might be too much volume [size=small]
(too loud)[/size] for some and you can select 2H or 2L to reduce the loudness. 2H assigns Iron Audio with a Lower Volume level, and if that's not quite right 2L provides a Very-Low Volume. So those two volume choices other than full volume might help some folks, but not me, and not some others I know. Impaired hearing can be a factor, or nearby noise can be a distraction. Even a change in headphones can result in a different Volume Level on those two other choices.
To me that isn't a sufficient loudness choice to make Iron Audio Volume adjustment really all that useful. Even Teknetics and Fisher models, like the first one the Euro-Tek Pro, and the newer F19 and G2+ and F44 and others, feature their more adjustable variable Volume setting. '10' is No Iron Audio response but Full Volume for all Non-Ferrous responding targets. Then Non-Ferrous targets remain at Full Volume but Iron Audio Volume adjusts for Iron-range targets with progressive settings from '11' to '12' to '13' to '14' and so on to '19', and then at '20' ALL targets, both Ferrous and Non-Ferrous, are at maximum Volume or Loudness. Definitely a much more 'functional' and therefore a better and more useful Iron Audio Volume control to better fit all hearing abilities and adjustment to work well in difficult noisy environment or with different headphones.
The F75 still falls short in that Iron Audio Volume control because it is ONLY [size=small]
(unless I'm wrong again)[/size] a function in the Two-Tone audio choice. It is NOT an adjustment feature on my Nokta Relic for ONLY the 2-Tone mode but carries over to also function in the 3-Tone mode. I've been using that models since January of 2016 so that's 3½= years now with a feature I
haven't had available on a T2 or F75 series device. It was also an adjustment feature on the Makro Racer 2 that year, then Nokta Impact in 2017 and since then on the Nokta / Makro Kruzer series, Anfibio series last year, and is a function in ALL of the multi [size=small]
(2 or more)[/size] Tone ID modes.
They are going to introduce the new Simplex + within a month and then we'll know what the Iron Audio Volume will provide. It might not be a more adjustable adjustment function like the models just mentioned, and only be a Low-Medium-High choice, like the F75 offers. And there are other brands with I.A.V. control, like the XP Deus. The White's MX Sport and MX-7 also have their concept of Iron Volume using their Reject Volume Control with Off or a 10% and up to 70% of full volume adjustment range. So my main point describing the T2 and F75 not having Iron Volume control was that the F75 is a very limiting, two-level reduction, and only in the 2-Tone mode.
Other than that one topic point, I didn't point out other specific difference. I could, such as some models having a variable adjustment call Reactivity or Recovery speed. The T2 doesn't but the F75 kind of does have a Back-Lighted display, but again, it doesn't function as well or as brightly as that on the White's MX series, the Nokta / Makro models, or Fisher & Teknetics own F19 / G2+ or F44.
Mike Hillis said:
For one thing you can mix and match the audio modes to the process selection which cannot be done with your Turkish buddies, and the F75 has such a low noise floor that there is no need for a 19 or 20 kHz frequency selection.
Really? That that means a Fisher or Teknetics consumer doesn't need to shop for a Gold Bug Pro or G2, and F19 or G2+? Pardon me, but there are better reasons to select one of those 19 kHz models, or a 19 kHz or 20 kHz Turkish model, or anyone else's higher-frequency offering from Tesoro or Deep Tech or White's or other competitors. The 19-20 kHz frequency does more than possibly counter a "noise floor."
And let me call you attention to locations where I hunt that present a noisy environment for many makes and models, to include causing the ±13 kHz T2's and F75's, to be bothersome. To the point, I maintain a detector outfit with an assortment of models from different makers because I not only like them individually, but that way I have more than one detector to select from that provides me a much quieter-performing device based on the environment's challenge. There have been times I had to park a T2+ or an F75 back in my rig this last fall and grab something else that worked quieter. To the point, I have had to grab either a Fisher F44 w/7" Concentric or 5" DD, or maybe my Tesoro Bandido II µMAX w/6" Concentric because they were very silent when my T2+ and Nokta CoRe or MX-7 were all chattery. No detector's perfect so I like to have options to be prepared.
Mike Hillis said:
Fisher's 11" Biaxial coil is a work of art and can hunt in most locations, even high trash locations just fine if you understand it. For one thing, the higher the trash level, the higher you raise the sensitivity. That coil and detector likes 99 sensitivity settings in trash. Paradoxical I know but true.
I totally agree with you that such a high Sensitivity setting can still work wonders at times, and that has been my preferred start-up approach for decades with most detectors. Most are 'saved' at maximum Sensitivity or very close to that, or I turn them on and manually adjust just as high as I can tolerate it. Right at the fringe of EMI as high as it will go.
I turn on the T2+ right to '99' and I did the same for the F75 and Omega 8000, and my variable knob-adjusted Tesoro's too. My F44's are 'saved' at the maximum '20' Sensitivity, and my Nokta CoRe and Relic have 3-Tone mode saved to start out at '99' sensitivity, and the other modes, all 2-Tone audio, are saved at '95' and I can tweak them up if needed. Too many people, out of habit or just not learning their detectors, start out at a much lower Sensitivity level and never question their setting and learn how high they might go until they get to any point of instability. Since way back in the '70s I always run my units as hot as I can and reduce the Sensitivity only if there is EMI and I have to reduce them, just enough, to get them
"on the -ragged-edge.'
Very seldom do I have to reduce a Sensitivity level on any of my Nokta or Makro devices, or F44, or T2's or F75's. On any of these I might have to drop it down, slightly, perhaps once out of every 25-30 hunts. Now, the Omega 8000's were something else as they were still good performers, but often quite chattery and unstable in an urban environment and needed a lower Sensitivity setting quite often..
As for the 11" BiAxial coil [size=small]
(measuring 7¼X11⅜ w/o a coil cover compared with the 7X11 open-frame coils from Nokta and Makro, measuring 7X11 w/coil cover)[/size] came on all of my T2's and F75, and also with two of the Omega 8000's I had and an F44 I acquired last fall, and other than checking them out when I got the new-to-me detectors, I put them back in the box or in my Accessory Coil Tote for two good reasons. I prefer a smaller-size to mid-size coil for almost any site I hunt due to trash or other confinements, and also because they didn't work well when it came to having a better 'lock-on' when Coin Hunting urban locations. Heck, FTP's Omega 8000's locked-on better than the T2 and F75 when I took them afield for side-by-side comparisons. At mid-depth to deeper, the Omega 8000's beat both those higher-dollar models in that comparison of TID.. That's why I used the 5" DD's almost exclusively on those two units.
Mike Hillis said:
Anyway....go peddle your Turkish wares somewhere else.
Mike, I only commented here because I was expressing my thoughts regarding the
"Not much left behind." statement in the above post. I used to rely on the T2's w/5" DD coil because, at the time, I also felt I had nabbed quite a few 'keepers' that others had missed and I knew how well the T2/5" served my needs in very littered places
at that time. But I am also alert to any make or model that provides me an 'edge', and I know that when it comes to detectors and detector performance ...
times can change! I've owned quite a few T2's and F75's and am aware of what they can do. I like them, and can give a round of applause to the T2+ I currently own for performance and other things.
However, I have other detectors, from both USA and foreign manufacturers, that can, and do, out-perform those FTP models with a 5" DD or other coil when it comes to working very well in a dense iron nail contaminated site and unmasking those partially-hidden targets. Thus my comments. And I didn't point out any particular brand or model in doing so. If any detector that I own and generally keep in my vehicle for regular, day-to-day use, at any type of site environment [size=small]
(and I have a CoRe, Relic, Omega 8000, F44, XLT, Bandido II µMAX and ORX loaded in there now)[/size], can excel, then I just
might relate to one or more specific models that I happen to favor in a response. I was not, and I do not, 'peddle' any particular brand regardless of where they are located. Perhaps you expected that and jumped to a conclusion, and were incorrect.
Now, for a change and in case you haven't seen me make similar comments on other posts I've made it the past, here are some positive comments about FTP model offerings:
• One of the reasons I have liked the Omega 8000 since I bought my first in March, nine years ago, was because of the ergonomics. It is light weight, very well balanced, and even has a better search coil selection than either the T2 or F75 from the manufacturer. I'm considering standard-size and all the smaller-sized coils. It is also very simple to adjust, and I like 'simple', and has the excellent T2 grip design.
• The biggest attraction for me to the T2, four years before the Omega, was the best physically-designed package I had seen in a long time. One that rivaled all the important detector makers at the time. The key to that was also the fact it is so well balanced, with a comfortable weight and 'feel,' and has a very good arm cup shape and size that works well together with the 'simple' yet efficient adjustment set that's perched atop the excellently shaped grip.
• The Fisher F75 mimics the excellent physical package of the T2 ... mostly. I personally don't care for the F75's display when compared with the T2. Personal choice.
• There are some limits in the circuitry designs of the T2 and F75, but for the most part they are very functional for the bulk of the typical day-to-day hunting most Hobbyists and many Avid detectorists do.
[size=x-large]→[/size][size=large]→[/size]→[size=small]→[/size] My wish: Knowing that FTP needs to come out with a newer, updated or advanced model as a new entry, PLEASE design it to continue using the physical package shared by the T2 and F75. Change the the display housing shape, have new visual display information and functions with a bit more adjustment range, get fancy with colorful names and decals, just make them more adjustable, more functional so we have enhanced performance .... but you can't get any better than the physical package used for the T2 & F75. Hang on to and use that design, if you will.
Mike Hillis said:
'Thank You' and I wish you HSH on your next trips out detecting.
Monte
[size=small]
That HSH is for Happy and Successful Hunting.[/size]
however, in the midst of the avalanche of words I still see you are promoting the Turkish manufacture on the F series Fisher Forum. 
