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Disappearing Signals ???

DaytonaGold

Member
This is happening way to often for me lately and I do not know how to approach this problem...I primarily hunt beaches and sometimes the ctx will detect a target and it will be a strong target, however after taking a scoop of sand or two from the beach and placing it next to the hole I discover that the signal is gone, totally gone.

I will stand there for ever moving earth only to never get the signal again, combing over the piles of sand and hole. Could someone please tell me what the hell is going on? It doesn't happen all the time however but lately the ctx seems to be doing this more and more. I use the "beach mode" with "seawater" on, I manually set my sensitivity to a stable higher number.

How could a signal just disappear? I also notice I that when the coil is swung to the far left or right I sometimes get a false signal as well. This ctx was sent in once to Minelab and they say there is nothing wrong with it...hmmmm?
 
False signal will happen when you swing to far to the left or right because you are most likely lifting the coil up at the end of the swing. Sounds like you need a pinpointer. You could be chasing after a falsing iron signal, and once you get down to the item and disturb the "halo", the CTX then recognizes it as iron and discriminates it out.
 
nolanation said:
False signal will happen when you swing to far to the left or right because you are most likely lifting the coil up at the end of the swing. Sounds like you need a pinpointer. You could be chasing after a falsing iron signal, and once you get down to the item and disturb the "halo", the CTX then recognizes it as iron and discriminates it out.

Thanks, I have a pinpointer. It's only natural that the detector coil lifts up at the end of a swing, yes? I don't think the ctx should be doing this, it makes you think you may be missing a target only to find out there's nothing there. Not only is that frustrating but it messes up your pace of detecting, stopping everytime a false signal appears. I think I expected a lot more from this machine for the price like something a bit more more stabile, I had it since Oct. 2012 and go out atleast 3 times a week and thought I would have learned a bit about this ctx by now...I guess not.
 
No, it is not normal for the coil to lift, you are suppose to rotate your wrist to keep the coil level. Page 63 of your manual shows the proper and improper ways to swing the coil.

A good signal does not disappear so if you experience falsing again, try lowering the sensitivity and if falsing persists, just move on when you can not pinpoint a false target.
 
I dont know about the 'go on when you cant pin point' idea. A lot of the time tossing out a scoop of sand the coin gets tossed out of the immediate removed sand area and I just dont get the coin back over it. 'Falsing' on iron with all the other information the CTX gives, for me, is pretty easy to identify.

Quite often I get a coin out of the dirt, sand, gumbo, whatever and for a few sweeps the CTX will NOT find it! It's like it says to me "Hey stupid it is on the surface!" and for a couple of sweeps or until I move the dirt around a bit, will not give me a signal! Maybe it's because it is simply an 'air test' type thing. Heck, I dont know but I get several of these a day on house demos. Almost every time the coin is on the surface or the edge of the removed dirt and I get NO signal for a couple of sweeps, then it will regroup and sound off.
 
Larry (IL) said:
No, it is not normal for the coil to lift, you are suppose to rotate your wrist to keep the coil level. Page 63 of your manual shows the proper and improper ways to swing the coil.

A good signal does not disappear so if you experience falsing again, try lowering the sensitivity and if falsing persists, just move on when you can not pinpoint a false target.

I sweep slowly and keep the coil level, it should NOT give me the amount of false signals as it does. I have a goCam and plan on making a short video regarding these issues.
 
Try some air tests if it happens in controlled conditions then it could b a coil issue or a loose wire.
 
I got my CTX about 3 months ago... completely new to MDing ...... only had time to use it in the back yard several times. I had a stong signal in one part of my yard... did not dig it and for two seperate days it remained in the same spot. The third day (a week later) I had some time and went out to actually dig up the target... The CTX found it easily as I had the last two times in the same exact spot. I started digging and at about 7 inches the target "disappeared" ... not in the hole...not in surrounding dug up dirt ... nothing.... it was no where! I filled the hole and detected again however nothing...not a peep! what is that???? So.. .I understand exactly what you mean.

Fred
NJ
 
Does your beach have any black sand? If so, I'm wondering if your detector is finding a concentrated pocket of black sand, but when you crack it open an spread it out there isn't enough concentrated black sand to give a signal any more.


DaytonaGold said:
This is happening way to often for me lately and I do not know how to approach this problem...I primarily hunt beaches and sometimes the ctx will detect a target and it will be a strong target, however after taking a scoop of sand or two from the beach and placing it next to the hole I discover that the signal is gone, totally gone.

I will stand there for ever moving earth only to never get the signal again, combing over the piles of sand and hole. Could someone please tell me what the hell is going on? It doesn't happen all the time however but lately the ctx seems to be doing this more and more. I use the "beach mode" with "seawater" on, I manually set my sensitivity to a stable higher number.

How could a signal just disappear? I also notice I that when the coil is swung to the far left or right I sometimes get a false signal as well. This ctx was sent in once to Minelab and they say there is nothing wrong with it...hmmmm?
 
I have had this happen often. Most of the time its a little piece of copper acting like a big guy. After a few not being found I sifted for them cause I knew I heard a good tone. I am guessing they became on edge and not heard due to that. The piece were every bit of a1/8th bit of copper/brass sheet, not even all metal found them. I have found that if you PP these prior to digging they lack strength in tone,as if the target doesn't ramp up as it did in discriminate. I will still dig and check but if the tone disappears I will kick the sand a couple of times and recheck. This somewhat assures me its not a coin/ring, I am looking for a chain at this point. If nothing I assume its was a tiny bit and move on. Time wasting practices of looking for every target will surely cause you to come home with 50 good targets as compaired to 150 during the same time!
BCNJ
 
I have found that targets on edge will be lost with this machine easily, like when you dig a hole and knock it on edge it will disappear. And as said above it will find very small items too!
 
DaytonaGold said:
I manually set my sensitivity to a stable higher number.

How could a signal just disappear? I also notice I that when the coil is swung to the far left or right I sometimes get a false signal as well.

If it is truly a "false signal", and not just a super small target that you are having problems finding, you may have answered your own question when you said you manually set your Sensitivity to a stable higher number. And, when you commented that it sometimes happens when you swing far left or right.
When you manually set your Sensitivity, odds are that the coil is not moving. Getting a stable Sensitivity number with the coil not moving is much easier than when the coil is in motion, analyzing (and adapting to) constant changes in the soil matrix. I know there are some who indicate they have better depth using manual Sensitivity. But recognizing the results I get by utilizing the three channel monitoring of Auto Sensitivity, vs one channel in manual, I opt for Auto Sensitivity. If I feel I need a bit more depth in my soil, I use Auto with a +2 or +3 offset, depending on the conditions. JMHO HH Randy
 
jas415 said:
I dont know about the 'go on when you cant pin point' idea. A lot of the time tossing out a scoop of sand the coin gets tossed out of the immediate removed sand area and I just dont get the coin back over it. 'Falsing' on iron with all the other information the CTX gives, for me, is pretty easy to identify.

Quite often I get a coin out of the dirt, sand, gumbo, whatever and for a few sweeps the CTX will NOT find it! It's like it says to me "Hey stupid it is on the surface!" and for a couple of sweeps or until I move the dirt around a bit, will not give me a signal! Maybe it's because it is simply an 'air test' type thing. Heck, I dont know but I get several of these a day on house demos. Almost every time the coin is on the surface or the edge of the removed dirt and I get NO signal for a couple of sweeps, then it will regroup and sound off.

The CTX in my experience over the last couple of weeks since I have got it has given me the sounds of targets that are right on the surface, but most of the time it does't give me any VID when the target is on the surface. When it doesn't give me a VID and blares the sound at me, I go into Target Trace then go over the target a few times. After going over the target a few times with Target Trace, it usually gives me a VID. Since you are having trouble finding the target all together, there is always the chance that when you dig the hole, the target then flies somewhere beyond where you would have expected it to go.

Since I hunt inland, I know there is a "Halo" effect in the ground that causes the CTX 3030 to false. These "Halos" can give off good signals until you disturb them. After disturbing them, the halo gets broken apart and no longer gives off as clear a signal or no signal at all. I don't know if halos are an issue in sand or not, but I know that they can be an issue in inland areas.
 
What you are experiencing is not restricted to the Ctx 3030, it does the same thing to my X-terra 705 and GPX 4000. I find it is from tiny ferrus junk that has a strong halo then when you dig you destroy that halo and the signal is not strong enough to pick up enough because it is very very tiny. I have this problem alot, but I eventually find the target, which is very tiny. Not a detector problem. But if you still think it is the detector, I will be happy to buy it from you. Lol I'm in the market for a CTX 3030. a coin or jewlery will not disappear like that. Iron will!
 
press the button with the search coil on it, and blank the screen. What probably happens is, when a target position changes it is discriminated; the angle at which you run over the target can effect the discrimination.

I've had this happen a few times, mainly at the beach.
 
I've experienced the same thing... Very good signal and once you dig it it disappears..
My suspicion was a halo effect... So often I will simply push my shovel in the ground and break the soil without taking any soil out and then rescan the target to see if I still get a signal..
JMO is it is caused as already mentioned, by a halo effect.. Not a malfunctioning machine/coil..
Not to say that's always the case..
Sonny
 
sonnydigs said:
I've experienced the same thing... Very good signal and once you dig it it disappears..
My suspicion was a halo effect... So often I will simply push my shovel in the ground and break the soil without taking any soil out and then rescan the target to see if I still get a signal..
JMO is it is caused as already mentioned, by a halo effect.. Not a malfunctioning machine/coil..
Not to say that's always the case..
Sonny
Halo or a tiny surface targets are often a culprit. In loose sand (beaches / tot lots) I learned to, before everything else, to swipe the surface with my foot and than re-scan. Any tiny objects on the surface get displaced. Sometimes they disappear and I don't bother looking for them. Strong signals that moved, pinpointer gets employed right away. Great time saver.
 
If you have target trace and target trace pinpoint turned on, it is usually pretty easy to see a halo effect, as you will usually see red, and orange splotches all over the display, and not a distinct red cursor.
 
JamesM said:
If you have target trace and target trace pinpoint turned on, it is usually pretty easy to see a halo effect, as you will usually see red, and orange splotches all over the display, and not a distinct red cursor.

Thanks, in my case they are turned on and haven't seen that occur.....
Sonny
 
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