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Any coil scrubbers out there ? (funny looking experiment going on here):nerd:

T

tony (Orlando FL)

New member
Some of the recent topics about coils have me wondering how many folks actually can detect with their coil off the ground like the manual suggests and how many scrub the ground with each pass?

I am an old school type who scrubs the soil because its actually easier on the arms and mentally has me convinced that I will get more depth. Heck, even a coil cover which is maybe 1/16th of an inch thick has me a little concerned that I am losing at least that much depth by using a cover.

Over the weekend, I tried something that looks silly, but its pretty much kinda sorta trying to prove something to me.

I have an Ace250 which I have around for others to use if they ever want to detect and find I can NOT run the sens very high at all, maybe 4 bars MAX. I get all sorts of strange ground noise and the meter never really locks on. I have a new coil and the GB seems set properly.

Remember, I am a ground scrubber.

After taking a break while tecting, I had an empty Ice Tea bottle which I was about to toss in the recycler. Right there it hit me! I can use this bottle as a spacer to see IF there is any benefit to consistently keeping the coil off of the ground as I sweep the coil back and forth. I had some string and rigged up my test.

From being able to run a max of 4 bars with intermittent falsing, the Ace250 went to amazing stability. I was then able to raise the sens to one notch below MAX and it still ran very solid in the same area that was driving the unit and me nuts.

Please dont misunderstand what I am saying..... the solution was not the bottle or bottle paint etc etc..., it was thanks to the bottle RAISING the coil approx 2 inches above the ground during its entire sweep. It is simply being used as a spacer and was allowing me to still scrub the ground, but with the bottle in between the coil and ground.

When I got home, I swapped the bottle out for a piece of 3/4 inch pvc and retested the same spot I just checked before swapping the bottle out. The 3/4 inch pvc is seemingly NOT large enough. I put the bottle back as my coil spacer and it seemed to run very smooth again and target Id was not jumping all over the place trying to decide what to call the target,

I am going to include some pics which look like a joke BUT they arent, even though it does look pretty stupid. Perhaps someone that finds their ace or any other unit to be somewhat jumpy like mine can try something similar and report their findings.

If this does work out, meaning beneficial, perhaps a coil cover similar to a platform shoe sole may be a solution? You know, a cover that will actually allow you to scrub the soil while providing an approximate internal 2 inch air gap or "lift" off the ground for more stable operation.

Now that you are through laughing, do any of you also experience what I have described while scrubbing the soil with their coil? I really only experience this with the garrett models, yet thinking back, some of the multi freq units acted the same way BUT I never raised the coil like I am trying to do here and I dont have them around anymore to try this test. ALSO, the ground where I usually use the Ace at is LOADED with specks of iron which I always attributed to the erratic behavior.


comments?
 
Have you tried filling that bottle with some beer? Could serve a double purpose....coil height and a quick break for a cool one.
 
Tony,,
you might try a piece of 1.5" PVC pipe and a piece of 2" PVC pipe...
I will have to try that on my 2500..
I know I don't want to hunt all day with my 2500 coil 2" off the ground.

Would it help to paint the bottles with some kind of special paint ???
:thumbup: :thumbup:

HH...BJ
 
Could it be the owner's manual was right?
I ran into a local guy here one day while out detecting. We started talking detecting of course. He was using a GTI2500. He said he liked it but had had some coil going bad issues. I with my GTI 1500 said I had never had a problem. After we got through talking I watched him walk away swinging his detector and I must tell you he was a major scrubber, more like a pounder. I thought, no wonder he had coil trouble, he was beating it to death. But, according to him, he found a lot of good stuff.
 
Scooper - What metal ties? I used some string I had on hand. Maybe you are talking other 'ties' ?

This is not permanent by any means, this is only to determine if in fact there is some benefit to sweeping the coil above the ground as opposed to scrubbing it.

I will say its too early to tell for sure however it does appear to have reduced the jumpiness I was experiencing before.
 
Hi Neal, do you recall if the coil the ground pounder had was the white one or the newer Rhino coil?

BJ pointed something out via email which was interesting..... He reminded me that the WHITE imaging coil was somewhat raised on the inside, most likely meaning the receive winding of the coil. I remember the white coil on the 2500 and the 1500 being pretty stable. Again I figured it was my ground causing the jitters when I upgraded to the Rhino coil.

Perhaps too, its just my soil here in Florida, I dont know, but by lifting the coil, meaning swinging it approx 1-2 inches off the ground as the manual suggests seems to calm things down.

Hope this technique pans out and provides stable results on all sites.
 
I always try to swing with level overlapping swings an inch or two off the ground as the manual suggests with my 1500 with the older white coil and my ace 250
 
YeahTony I have mentioned many times on this forum and in field tests that Garrett's overly sensitive coils don't take to scrubbing too well and it can cause problems.

Bill
 
I think that you may be able to find a sweet spot on the Sensitivity where you can run your machine WITHOUT the bottle and acheive the same results ...... I think that by raising the coil up so high , you you are compensating by having the Sensitivity higher .....If your coil is lower , turn your sensitiviy lower ....... You are achieving the same thing... You can then do away with your bottle ....If your ground does not allow for a higher sensitivity due to high mineralization , than that's what you have to deal with ..... Try turning your sensitiviy down most of the way WITHOUT the bottle ....>Do a few swings .....Slowly bring your Sensitivity up until it's too noisy for you to deal with , and back it down until you can run your machine without too much noise .....This will be your "sweet spot " for the sensitivity adjustment for the ground you are dealing with .......A smaller coil will also help in an area like this because you are not hitting the ground with that much area with the smaller coil .....YOu will actually be able to run your machine with a higher Sensitivity adjustment ......Try it !!....What do you have to loose ? .......Good Luck , Jim
 
Morning synthnut,

I truly am one that has always run low sens on most units. If it were up to me, Sens would have been renamed to Stability because that is how I use it.
Many folks run their units wound tight as a banjo with regard to sens, I sure dont.

As for turning the sens down, my experience is that while it silences the unit down, it is still erratic in the area of target id. The display on the Ace is all over the place even when a real target is not hit (I run all metal by the way) and then when a real one is hit, the meter jumps like crazy and the sound beeps and bongs as if out of control. (I have had a couple Ace and they all acted the same way btw) (that is why I simply figured the cause is simply MY tecting areas)

What prompted this experiment is that I know some folks do intentionally swing the coil well above the ground. I just cant do it. Then, I recently read perhaps on this forum where when the coil was on the ground scrubbing it, the coin in the test garden sounded off but ID'd as iron UNTIL the coil was lifted approx 2 inches.

Then there is the recent coil paint chatter going on which got me thinking a little more about how the coil interacts with the soil and how folks mention the sensitivity of the newer coils etc etc.

I figured I would try what the Garrett manual suggests however I am not into swinging the coil above the ground and dont think my habit of scrubbing the ground can be broken. Hence the 'spacer' idea to help me keep the coil off the ground at a fixed height throughout the swing while I think I am scrubbing the ground..

At this point, I only have limited testing accomplished, but I will be sure to try it some more before making any definite conclusions which only really matter to me, but willing to share in case someone else is having similar results. It seems to help alot, there is a reason why its suggested in the manual, so forth and so on.

It is embarrassing to think I might be seen swinging this bottled up coil, but its all in the name of better tecting, even if I am the only one falling for the results.

If someone has a different way of keeping the coil off the ground consistently, please share your ideas. BJ mentioned he was thinking of using wheels which sounds kinda clever to me.

I told ya's this was a funny looking experiment!

Tony
 
I wonder if pcs of styrofoam with
double sided tape or electrical tape
would work? they could be cut to maybe an Inch
if thats the height you wanted ..just a suggextionb
on a cold day in the Burgh !!!


HH

Ron

Rangers Lead The Way :usaflag::usaa:
 
Hey Ron,

Thats a good idea, thanks. I had thought of wood, but styro is a lot lighter. Not sure how long it would last, maybe it can be encased in something IF this all pans out. Its just an experiment at this point.
 
Tony
Thanks for your reply .....So you're saying that there is STILL too much noise , even if you turn your sensitivity down ? .... I do understand your coil scrubbing habit , which is not a bad habit to have ....I have a habit of moving too fast and when getting frustrated at an area , my coil tends to get a bit high off of the soil ......So YOUR habit is one I would love to have !!....LOL !!.... You mention hunting in A.M. .....What about Discriminating ? ......Folks have told me that the AT Pro does not loose depth while discriminating ........Perhaps you could find the offending frequencies and notch them out .....Of course if they are in the range that you are hunting in for your targets , that would not work , but maybe , and ESPECIALLY with the EXCELLENT iron range of discrimination ( 40 settings ) you can hit some of the lower end iron which in most cases is the offending iron frequencies that mess with us ........I NEVER laugh at another mans invention .....If I wore a bowl of fruit on my head , and that's how I found more gold , laugh at me all you want ..... If this bottle works for you , by all means carry on buddy !!.... I'll try to think of something for you ...... A smaller coil will do you some good as I mentioned earlier .... If the soil is THAT bad , you're not going to go THAT deep in it anyway ....Your coil is just going to reflect off of the minerals in the soil and bounce back atcha ..... This is why a smaller coil will work better for you ....They have a smaller area and can punch thru stuff like you're dealing with easier .....Jim
 
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