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Will we have metal detecting in 2020?

I copied this article from our club newsletter written by Dick Stout from Washington state. Good reading and it can apply to all of our states if we all work together to try and preserve this great hobby not only for us, but for our kids and their kids for many years to come.

Eddie


Article copied from Dick Stout
 
Dick is certainly one of our finest and writes a good book and articles on the hobby.

Indeed many more hunters, those who leave holes , landowners insurance obligations and misc. lawsuits and liability of landowners along with an uninformed public all are detrimental to the hobby...do ask permission, be neat and courteous to help promote an excellent hobby...
 
good post. I am just getting started so I hope the laws don't get out of hand by 2020.
 
Ironically, it's scary ominous pieces like this, which merely serve to produce the very thing, we're told to be worried about.

The vicious cycle works like this: Skittish people read about bootings, solidarities we must form to fight laws, potential arrests & confiscations, etc.... Sounds logical to "sound the alarm", right? But here's what ends up happening: People hear/read about these horrible dangers, so what's the next thing they logically do? Run down to their local city hall, or county offices, or wherever and ask "can I detect at the park or school?" Afterall, they certainly don't want to be arrested as the stories they've just read suggest, right? Afterall, you "can't be too safe", right? Afterall, the code of ethics tells us to "be aware of all laws" (implying to ask if you are uncertain), right? What this ends up doing, IMHO, is getting bureaucrats, who perhaps never gave the matter thought before, in whatever podunk little town or county you are in, to simply make rules, to "address this pressing issue". I've seen this happen over and over, where no rules existed, and perhaps, no one really even cared (detecting had always simply gone on, and it never occured to anyone that there was even anything wrong with it). But then someone takes it upon themselves to waltz into the police dept, or city or county hall, and they get a "no"?? What's up with that? Someone there morphs something else to apply (cultural heritage stuff, or vegetation stuff, or whatever), and hands down a "no". So guess what will happen when that same deskbound bureucrat sees an md'r in the park (whom he previously perhaps would never have paid mind to or noticed)? He'll think "aha, there's one of them", and start booting others, pass memo's to the rank and file in the field, etc...

Thus the vicious cycle: the bootings from the above scenario cause more articles for us to be "up in arms" get written (afterall, you don't want to be booted do you?) thus only causing more alarm, and more people grovelling to get their "no's" wherever they're at. Sheesk people! Sometimes we can be our own worst enemy. Sure there be rules, in some places, now, but you have to ask yourself: "How did that start?" Quite often by this very vicious circle spelled out here.
 
and vote in those who seek to shrink the government, both in size and power!
 
Tom,

Not sure what the laws are in Calf and my posting that article written by Dick Stout was not to ruffle any ones feathers. We all know that we have rules that detectorists should be following and we all know that there are the jerks out there that don't follow them and make the rest of us look bad. We all have to work together and if you belong to a club then it should be imperative that you and your club work with the politicians who rule your state, county and city governments and keep butting heads with them to keep our metal detecting hobby alive and keep parks and open areas open for all of us. In my state of Washington we are working with the people at our state capital getting more acres open to detecting and although it's not an easy task, it is working and we have succeeded in getting more areas open especially in our state park areas. We should be up in arms and when the day comes and God forbid that thought when metal detecting maybe outlawed everywhere maybe then you will look back and say, gee...........is there something that I could have done to help preserve this great hobby?

Eddie
 
Eddie, you merely cite more laws, more ominous future laws, more "up in arms", etc...., etc... And again, I ask you, to ask yourself "how did this all start?"

Yes, it started, and yes it's here in some places, and yes perhaps it's going to spread, but continue to ask yourself "WHY?" Because of the very thing these stories promote! Fear that we need permission, where perhaps it's not even (specifically) prohibited. Yes I know it's a catch-22. Because once someone gets ruffled up in a remote city, somewhere else, why SHOULDN'T our wonderful solidarities "sound the alarm", right? Afterall, we don't want to "give the hobby a black eye", right? We don't want to face waht that other person faced, right? So therefore well-meaning people run off and ask permission (just to be safe, mind you, in-lieu of the scary stories they're reading). And presto, they get a "no" (good thing they asked, eh?) where perhaps no one ever cared before. Thus, the cycle. Do you see?

The better way is for people to stop shooting themselves in the arm like that, and if it's not specifically disallowed, then stop thinking you need permission.
 
Tom, respectfully I have to completely disagree with you. The laws are already in place and getting worse every day. Being quite is NOT working anymore. This will not go away, but detecting will.
 
Further the real source of the problem is the misguided archeological lobby who see us as destroyers of culture and a threat to their livelihoods. They are in the capital pushing laws while we "hide"
 
To research it, find out there are already fed and state laws against it, and start putting up no detecting signs in the parks. Dick like me is in TX where detecting all public land is already illegal
 
Bell, you say: "The laws are already in place...." But you've got to ask yourself "how did it start?" Yes, some could start via archies. But I've also seen, again and again, where it "started" by people asking, where it was not previously cared about, and got a "no". Oh sure, the REASON given for the "no" might be archaeological cultural heritage reasons, but don't you see that the only reason this decision was even handed down (the reason they search for a "reason" to tell you "no") is because ..... doh ...... someone asked! I can give you multiple examples of this, if you doubt me.

And since when is all public land in texas off-limits? Please cite for me where that is written. If something is written on the state level, then that only applies to state land (state parks, etc...), not county or city level, which has their own rules for their parks, schools, etc...
 
Yes, often time cities and countys model their rules after state level rules, when doing any sort of updates, clarifications, etc..... A big reason for this, is that it's simply so easy, when city's go to make a charter, they simply borrow each other's existing phrasing and terminology. And if you stump them with something where there appears to be silence on an issue, they will often look to neighboring towns, counties, or the state, to see how it's addressed on that level, and simply use that, word for word. Sort of how, when a city wants to go see how much the police and officials in their town should be paid, they merely look to neighboring cities of similar size, or merely look at other govt. job positions, and simply match those pay scales. So too is it with laws. It's so easy and simple to copy what's already been drafted elsewhere and already passes legal muster elsewhere. That's why even the terminology can sound word-for-word alike, from state to state, county to county, etc....

Thus, let's not give states, counties, and cities, which have no rules on the issue of md'ing (ie.: it's silent on the issue) ANY reason to need to clarify it. If their rules are silent on the issue of md'ing, then SO BE IT. And no, I don't consider vandalism, defacement, and destruction clauses to apply to us. If you and I know we'll leave no trace of our presense, then to me, that's good enough. Odds are, no one really cares, unless you ask. Or unless you're being some sort of nuisance in some other way.
 
Tom, seems you always have this response to any type of potential legal problems we might face. Your take is that it's better to keep quiet, and let things take their natural ebb and flow. I disagree. Better to be forewarned, and to take steps to avoid problems, then to look for answers after the fact. JMO. Kinda like the current current conversations about the government's bank bailouts. Many say we should have let them all fail, and no big deal. Unfortunately most financial experts will tell you that would have led to another depression, perhaps even worse than the one we experienced in the 30's.

Certainly you are welcome to your opinion. Guess we just have to agree to disagree on this one....

Dick Stout
www.StoutStandards.com
 
2012 Nov. it's time to take the trash out, and then their Dec. 21 2012 the end of the Mayan Calendar Dooms Day. I am going to keep hunting as long as my health is going to allow me too, I plan that way past 2020, I will be easy to spot hunting with a couple of those helium filled balloons tied to my shaft so I can swing it. One balloon will have Home, and the other will have Less printed on it. Nobody ever messes with the Homeless, even if your drinking a beer walking down the street, cops and people leave then alone.
 
n/t
 
and the archies actually rob graves and call it research... amazing.

We really, really need to try and get a system here like they have in England, however... due to the size and scope of the USA and the tendency of anyone with any sort of authority in the US to let it go to their head... I wonder if it could actually work here. My fear would be that such a move would create at least three new departments of ____, 100s of new beurocrats, and 1000s of enforcement officers, none of whom would understand the actual rules... or care.

So... nevermind.

J
 
perhaps ya'll could get them to grant permission with some sort of permit... then they could make the state a little money and it might appeal to them... you need friends in the Texas legislature.

Good luck with it... in GA most state lands are off limits but not county or city, in most cases.

J
 
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