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why do deep nails give such a good coin signal?
- Thread starter Goes4ever
- Start date
Wow, boy that is odd. Someone else can help you as I have not encountered this situation with the X-70 so I cannot give you advice on it BUT I can say turn sensitivity down to the teens like 15, in the C&T Mode block out all -(negative) numbers(probably won't help but this is where the nail is suppose to be, not at a good 38-40 from both directions?), and use the 10.5" MF DD or 9" LF (3kHz) Concentric.
1) The rust itself might have something to do with the problem OR maybe the nail is not totally made from 100% iron or steel? Some other alloy metal mixed in with it?
2)How does the rusty nail air test on the X-70?
3) Did you air test this nail with another metal detector like a Tesoro, Fisher, Whites, or a Sovereign-Explorer?
4) Also try air testing a non-rusty nail as tell us if you get the same result?
If you can, please try the tests and answer these questions above to help us figure out the mystery.
1) The rust itself might have something to do with the problem OR maybe the nail is not totally made from 100% iron or steel? Some other alloy metal mixed in with it?
2)How does the rusty nail air test on the X-70?
3) Did you air test this nail with another metal detector like a Tesoro, Fisher, Whites, or a Sovereign-Explorer?
4) Also try air testing a non-rusty nail as tell us if you get the same result?
If you can, please try the tests and answer these questions above to help us figure out the mystery.
FooserPaul
New member
Goes4ever,
Hey, great job... you've been tearing it up with great finds this year!
Nails... I'm with you... It ways seems to be off the tip or end of the nail/bolt/screw... Its a great dime/qtr... deeper silver sounding signal... dig down... and I've got a nail in the side wall... I assumed its a halo off the tip and that somehow caused a great soulding signal... kinda the way and bent piece of thicker wire does...
Back to the nail... it does not seem to give the same audible sound as a real dime/qtr... its not a crisp clean sound... I dig them to eliminate that there would be two objects and or to remove the iron to clean up the area for other targets... but it does seem that I have dug LOTS and LOTS of them already this season... Perhaps we all get fooled on these... or is it just us two
I NC / GB and normally hunt with SENS at 19 in most spots... I hunt in AM mode...I try to scan those targets from 3 directions... but some do seems spot on and I'm sure there is silver... Well is rusty nails/bolts = silver YA-FREEKING-WHO as I have a bunch this year
Paul
Hey, great job... you've been tearing it up with great finds this year!
Nails... I'm with you... It ways seems to be off the tip or end of the nail/bolt/screw... Its a great dime/qtr... deeper silver sounding signal... dig down... and I've got a nail in the side wall... I assumed its a halo off the tip and that somehow caused a great soulding signal... kinda the way and bent piece of thicker wire does...
Back to the nail... it does not seem to give the same audible sound as a real dime/qtr... its not a crisp clean sound... I dig them to eliminate that there would be two objects and or to remove the iron to clean up the area for other targets... but it does seem that I have dug LOTS and LOTS of them already this season... Perhaps we all get fooled on these... or is it just us two
I NC / GB and normally hunt with SENS at 19 in most spots... I hunt in AM mode...I try to scan those targets from 3 directions... but some do seems spot on and I'm sure there is silver... Well is rusty nails/bolts = silver YA-FREEKING-WHO as I have a bunch this year
Paul
Regardless of the detector or the user, sometimes we end up with a nail in the hole. But with my X-70, the majority of times I can determine a deep nail by implementing several things. I typically use the 3 kHz coil, where harmonic tones are more prevalent on iron and other high ferrous targets. I cross over the target from multiple directions (not just an X), listening and watching for the 3 consistencies. Once an exact location is determined, I wiggle the coil over the target while backing off the coil, and listen carefully to the tone as the target leaves the detection field of the coil. And I use Prospecting mode to help determine the target size and shape. As I said, we can all be fooled on occassion. But these are some things I do to minimize those times. JMHO HH Randy
They Rust in the ground, your detector sees it as a steel item.......and it's on the fringe of being discriminated out.
A few detectors round up for your advantage when signal, or no signal is the issue..
Not all detectors see them the same..Fishers are really bad with nails and most of the xterras see them....Whites takes most out. Your detector and many others signals much further in the ground than they discriminate.So you , me, and most of us will hit some nails
A few detectors round up for your advantage when signal, or no signal is the issue..
Not all detectors see them the same..Fishers are really bad with nails and most of the xterras see them....Whites takes most out. Your detector and many others signals much further in the ground than they discriminate.So you , me, and most of us will hit some nails
ok I hunt in all metal...ALWAYS
I use two tones, I went across it in several directions, not just an X
sensitivity was at 23, my normal, the nail was pretty deep both times, they were definately all iron theyt were the old square nails. After it was out of the hole it registered as iron giving me a negative number, I was using the stock coil, med freq
I use two tones, I went across it in several directions, not just an X
sensitivity was at 23, my normal, the nail was pretty deep both times, they were definately all iron theyt were the old square nails. After it was out of the hole it registered as iron giving me a negative number, I was using the stock coil, med freq
If you were to use multiple tones, you would have four different tones for ferrous targets instead of just one. So if a ferrous target is a bit unstable (?due to oxidation?) , you will hear it. I've found that many iron targets will produce a harmonic tone, blending one or more together. JMHO HH Randy
I started out using 2 tones till I went to the cotton field where I relic hunt.
Now in this field are many old house sites (where there is no sign of a structure) and tried 2 tones and the nails were eating my lunch.
This site is tough with any detector I have tried there, mainly because there is so much iron there.
Since the field gets plowed from time to time, broken nails are everywhere and those that are 3/4 to 1 1/2" long, were falsing like crazy, not only with the 70 but other detectors I have taken there, except the Explorer which does very good.
Anyway, I went from using 2 tones to 4 tones and now I can do fairly well there with the 70, only occasionally getting fooled.
What you have to listen for is the percentage of the time you are getting the highest tone, if it is really brief, more than likely it is a nail.
Another thing to watch is if the high reading is above 42, say 46 or 48 and the numbers will not lock, jumping over to the negative side.
On the audio, using 4 tones, if the high tone false is a faint whisper and reading 46 or 48, you can just about bet it will be a nail about 4 to 6" down, it is hitting on one end of the nail.
Remember any mixture with the high tone and a low tone will place the signal in a more iffy category.
If you use prospecting mode to size up the object, it will be a dead give-away when you scan the signal and there is a quick zip, this tells you the object is small, such as a nail.
There are a couple of falses that still fool me however, those deep big nails, on a angle in the ground sometimes will hit like a quarter but thank goodness it doesn't happen often.
The other false that fools me sometimes is when 2 nails are under the coil at the same time and the signal is a combination of the 2, somewhere between them, sometimes I can coerce a good quarter reading and fool myself myself and dig it up
.
Now when you are going for high coin readings that are deep and iffy and at the same time in a place where there is a bed of nails, you will have a lot of fun.
Now in this field are many old house sites (where there is no sign of a structure) and tried 2 tones and the nails were eating my lunch.
This site is tough with any detector I have tried there, mainly because there is so much iron there.
Since the field gets plowed from time to time, broken nails are everywhere and those that are 3/4 to 1 1/2" long, were falsing like crazy, not only with the 70 but other detectors I have taken there, except the Explorer which does very good.
Anyway, I went from using 2 tones to 4 tones and now I can do fairly well there with the 70, only occasionally getting fooled.
What you have to listen for is the percentage of the time you are getting the highest tone, if it is really brief, more than likely it is a nail.
Another thing to watch is if the high reading is above 42, say 46 or 48 and the numbers will not lock, jumping over to the negative side.
On the audio, using 4 tones, if the high tone false is a faint whisper and reading 46 or 48, you can just about bet it will be a nail about 4 to 6" down, it is hitting on one end of the nail.
Remember any mixture with the high tone and a low tone will place the signal in a more iffy category.
If you use prospecting mode to size up the object, it will be a dead give-away when you scan the signal and there is a quick zip, this tells you the object is small, such as a nail.
There are a couple of falses that still fool me however, those deep big nails, on a angle in the ground sometimes will hit like a quarter but thank goodness it doesn't happen often.
The other false that fools me sometimes is when 2 nails are under the coil at the same time and the signal is a combination of the 2, somewhere between them, sometimes I can coerce a good quarter reading and fool myself myself and dig it up
.Now when you are going for high coin readings that are deep and iffy and at the same time in a place where there is a bed of nails, you will have a lot of fun
.So if I use 4 tones you think it will help? I have been using the x-70 since last august and have not had a nail give me a coin signal from all directions till yesterday, but the ground here is very VERY moist right now and I know iron will read much better in wet conditons. Today I went back to the same property and I used my 10" DD coil I just got and I did not hit any deep nails. I think it definately separates targets better, I was able to pull some wheats out from the iron that I missed with my stock coil.
Good thing it is the exception and not the rule with nails.
Steve(MS) wrote: "except the Explorer which does very good." I was told by Minelab that the Sovereign GT has a stronger discriminator than the X-70. The Explorer also being a multi-frequency unit. What I am trying to say is: So maybe the BBS and FBS machines are better discriminators than VLF's to knock out iron or rusty iron!?
Read what Dick wrote:
"If you don
Steve(MS) wrote: "except the Explorer which does very good." I was told by Minelab that the Sovereign GT has a stronger discriminator than the X-70. The Explorer also being a multi-frequency unit. What I am trying to say is: So maybe the BBS and FBS machines are better discriminators than VLF's to knock out iron or rusty iron!?
Read what Dick wrote:
"If you don
that the Prospecting mode of the X-70 has a weaker discriminator than the Sovereign. I say that for a couple reasons. 1. The Prospecting mode only has the Iron Mask discrimination feature. 2. The C/T discrimination is notch. As such, you can notch out everything except iron, if you want to. So by Dick saying "the first thing a discriminator wants to eliminate is junk iron" would only hold true for the X-70 in the Prospecting mode. JMHO HH Randy
Bavaria Mike
New member
That has happened to me as well with nails, usually when they are very wet. I did dig two targets this week, one had a lead seal within 1" of a nail at about 6" and the other was a musket ball again with a nail very close. The XT70 hit on both targets in the hole. Did you recheck the hole after you found the nail? I run in all metal with sens up high. HH, Mike