Whites classic 3 on salt water beach help please

[candcantiques]

I recently purchased an older Whites Classic 3 and have been detecting at Daytona Beach where I live. I am quite puzzled about something though and it has to do with the directions in the owners manual. They are...

"When using this model in wet salt water sand place the NORM toggle in the BLACK SAND position the GEB DISC toggle in the GEB DISC position, and using a low DISC setting ( somewhere around RING RANGE or below) performance will improve"

Well I have tried that and every half inch the machine tells me there is metal to dig. Anytime I put the switch on black sand the entire beach needs to be dug up unless I go up higher than the ring range to the coin range which the manual says defeats the purpose of the black sand switch. If I leave the norm toggle on norm and the disc on ring range and turn up the sensitivity all the way up it seems to work fine. I haven't found much yet though with it and I believe that to be because it has been cold windy and rainy down here and no one has been on the beaches, or does someone think that maybe I should be doing it the way the manual says, or maybe some other way. Any help to end my confusion would be appreciated.

I am using a Blue Max Deep Scan 950 10" coil.

 

[Tom Slick]

I hunted southern Florida east coast beaches (Jensen Beach & Stuart area) for a few years using both the IDX Pro and Classic III. With the Black Sand switch in the Black Sand position, you will get much better depth and the Disc control should be at about the 9:00 oclock position. If you're getting too many false signals then that's a sign that you have your sensitivity control set too high. Start with it set at max and then gradually lower it until the detector becomes stable. Try swinging the coil about an inch above the top of the sand. Don't bump it along the top of the the ripples in the sand. The detector will shine in the dry sand running it this way for recent drops. The Classic III is not really the machine for hunting the wet sand. The multi-frequency detectors from Minelab and the PI detectors from White's, HeadHunter, Garrett, and Tesoro are much better wet Salt Water beach detectors.
I Hope this Helps.
Tom

 

[candcantiques]

I sincerely appreciate the advise. I wish I had a better detector but that involves saving a few hundred dollars yet. Do you have any knowledge of the coil that I am using and if it is good or bad?
Thanks
Chris

 

[Monte]

I recently purchased an older Whites Classic 3 and have been detecting at Daytona Beach where I live.

First question is: What do you mean by "older" Classic 3? Is this an older style Classic III that requires 3-9V batteries?

Question #2.. If so, is it the Classic III or the Classic III Plus?

Question #3.. To clarify, if it isn't one of the above two then it is the Classic III SL that uses the slide-in 8-AA battery tray, correct?

I am quite puzzled about something though and it has to do with the directions in the owners manual. They are...

"When using this model in wet salt water sand place the NORM toggle in the BLACK SAND position the GEB DISC toggle in the GEB DISC position, and using a low DISC setting ( somewhere around RING RANGE or below) performance will improve"

The function of the NORM/BLACK SAND switch is to expand or enhance the lower end of the Discrimination adjustment range.

In very mineralized environments, such as I encounter on some fresh-water river beaches or even many parts of our coastal beaches here in Oregon, the benefit is this:

In NORM, you will reject a common iron nail at about the 9-o'clock Discriminate setting. Adjusting lower will accept some iron and other very low-conductive targets, but still have some ferrous rejection. By switching to BLACK SAND, it expands the lower-end of the Discriminate range such that a setting at minimum will result in an all-metal-accept condition. It will respond to both ferrous and non-ferrous targets. To reject a common iron nail it might require a setting somewhere around Ring Range. Thus, as you can see, this broader-range of adjustment will let you "fine-tune" the rejection setting.

Salty water, and wetted salty beach sand, can be a challenge because it is low-conductive and to deal with it you need to gently reject it. "Fine-tune" the rejection just to knock it out.

Well I have tried that and every half inch the machine tells me there is metal to dig. Anytime I put the switch on black sand the entire beach needs to be dug up unless I go up higher than the ring range to the coin range which the manual says defeats the purpose of the black sand switch. If I leave the norm toggle on norm and the disc on ring range and turn up the sensitivity all the way up it seems to work fine.

In Florida, you don't have to deal with iron mineralization mixed with the salt water like many other ocean beaches. You're fortunate! It might be that your unit will serve you better with a setting of Normal and a Disc. rejection level somewhere between 9-o'clock and Ring Range.

Another consideration could be a Ground Balance that is 'Off'. If you have an improper GB setting then you're going to get a lot more falsing issues. A Classic III SL has an easy-to-access GB trimmer and you can make the adjustment to bring it into better performance. If you have questions on how to do it, shoot me an E-mail: MonteVB@comcast.net

The other things to remember are these:

Search with the coil about 1"-2" off the surface, especially in some wet areas.

Don't bump the search coil on the ground or sand 'ridges'.

I am using a Blue Max Deep Scan 950 10" coil.

If you've got the Classic III Plus or Classic III SL, then this is the coil that came standard and I usually used the 950 on my Classic III's and IDX Pro's when beach hunting. It is a very good coil for most open-area searches, and even some of the "local" regulars at a couple of Oregon beaches with their Fisher CZ's couldn't match the performance I got.

Running in BLACK SAND usually benefits me the most when I work very mineralized sites where the nasty iron mineral cuts in on performance. On the salty coastal beaches, even with some black sand mix in them, I might use the BLACK SAND setting and a very low Disc. setting in the DRY sand, but in the wet-zone I probably leave it in NORM most of the time and adjust the Disc. level somewhere just below Ring Range. I make sure my units have a good, functional GB, too.

Monte

 

[candcantiques]

It uses the 3 - 9 volt batteries and it does not say "plus" anywhere on the detector. The information that you provided helped alot. I greatly appreciate it.

 

[Monte]

Well, that now narrows some of the problem you have to the search coil. The basic, 'original' Classic III that you have (if not a PLUS) uses the older 6B series of search coils and DOES NOT use the 950 or most of the other "Blue Max" series of coils. That's most likely the problem you're having, and not only will it not function properly, but the Ground Balance is probably off. Possibly way off! So, before you can really get any decent performance out of it you'd have to acquire one of the original 8" coils it came with, which would NOT include the Royal 800, the Pro Scan 800, or any of the Blue Max 8" coils. The original coil was in a white-colored housing.

Monte

 

[candcantiques]

Am I to assume that if it were a plus that it would say so somewhere on the machine? I have found plenty of change and even a sterling ring in the dry sand and it seemed to have performed great. As long as I leave the NORM/BLACK SAND toggle in NORM position it does find dime sized pieces of heavy iron in the wet but it has always been a broken signal as stated in the manual it would be. Change and the ring were solid unbroken loud and clear signals.
One other thing that might be good or bad, I don't know, I cannot get within 7 or 8 feet of my buddy and his Ace 250 or his machine goes nuts. I know that I could readjust the frequency just haven't done so yet as we normally don't get that close anyway. There is a section in the owners manual on how to ground balance the machine but I haven't tried to do that yet. I am also assuming that I should do that before going back to the beach.

 

[candcantiques]

before you can really get any decent performance out of it you'd have to acquire one of the original 8" coils it came with
Monte

Does that mean that I wouldnt get much search depth?

 

[Monte]

Does that mean that I wouldnt get much search depth?

You might not get good depth, you probably won't get good discriminate mode performance, and you're most likely not to have a good GB setting.

Also, make sure the Frequency Shift control is set at the factory preset marker. This is especially true if you are going to tweak the GB trimmer, set it at the preset. Use of the Frequency Shift will alter the GB and it is best left alone unless you have an external manual GB control.

Monte

 

[candcantiques]

Boy were you right. Went to the beach to hunt this morning and buried some gold in the wet sand. At 3" the Whites couldnt find it. It was both a nice heavy chain and a mans ring at the same time. I was shocked to find that my Ace found it at 5". Later on my Ace shocked me again by finding a penny in the wet sand at 8" !!!! And then again a dime at 6". I guess I am going to have to get the proper coil for the Whites and sell the Blue Max then figure out how to do the ground ballance properly. Thanks for all the input and help.

 

[candcantiques]

Took the whites out again at 4PM to try one more time. Turned the discrimination all the way down and the Whites started finding all kinds of stuff, and DEEP too. I had been going by what it says in the manual to keep the discrimination set at " RING " and thats why I couldn't find the gold. However I did still find that in the wet sand I got alot of false signals. Strong ones too. In the dry sand I was finding stuff at 14" which I really liked. For my budget though it seems more cost effective to get the excelotator coil for my Ace 250, then I could get depths of 14" in the dry and still be able to search the wet sand ( I hope). If anyone should be interested in this Whites I am going to sell it. It seems as if it would be a great inland ( dirt ) detector or dry sand only detector. The way its built its just not going to work in the wet. Thanks all