What is the general consensus on the use of "relic shovels" at public sites???

[Ray-Mo.]

I realize that a very clean plug can be dug with the proper use of a sharp relic shovel and a very poor plug can be dug with a pocket knife by an uncaring detectorist.So what I am wondering is does the public perceptions of we detectorist carrying/using a relic type shovel matter if a proper/clean recovery is done otherwise verses a hand held digger/trowel ???? Public viewable detecting videos included.
PS A couple of examples of popular "relic shovels" pictured,Thanks for your feedback in advance

 

[fwcrawford]

I totally agree that a nice plug can be dug with a shovel while a sloppy plug can be dug with a hand digger.
My thoughts on this is that if folks see the shovel, then they assume you are digging large deep holes.. just more noticable than a hand digger which really can't be seen until you are you are actually using it.
Just my opinion,
Felix

 

[Larry (IL)]

Perception is far more powerful than reality.

That is why you will often see me carrying a screwdriver in my hand in public even though I use the Lesche digger far more often. Carrying a shovel while hunting in public view is asking for trouble.

 

[Critterhunter]

Watch it, I was called a Troll for having an anti-shovel view on this topic. Public perception is everything. I don't want to say anymore because I don't want to get in trouble. Read my signature below.

 

[plidn1]

If you got up tomorrow morning, looked out your window, and I was standing on your front lawn with one of those,

WHAT WOULD YOU THINK?

 

[Smudge]

Ray-Mo, I agree with the posters above.

Yes, you would be better served using that bigger digger. The hole would be cleaner and the retrieval more efficient.

However, ignorance being what it is, the public would be aghast when they see you digging a big plug and you would have to show them individually how what you are doing is a good thing.

Its a tough battle.

I'd like to own one to use in certain areas, but I would not risk using it in public areas.

It's silly and frustrating, but what can you do?

 

[mudpuppy]

Seriously, on public lands, parks, sports fields, etc...just a simple screwdriver. Targets 5" deep or less are quite easily retrieved quickly with a screwdriver. Your finds will go up, and nobody will say dink. If you happen to hit a deeper target, take a folding lock back serrated edge knife, cut a quick small plug large enough to get your fist into, probe the object with the screwdriver, retrieve, replace plug, and go.
Mud

 

[MNCoinhunter]

My Lesche Sampson cuts a nicer plug than my Lesche hand digger. But I still won't bring it to a park. Private property on the other hand, is another matter. As long as the owner has no issues with it, I will go with the Sampson. Anyways, I think public perception has more to do with how you leave it as opposed to what you are digging with. I chose the Sampson because it's overall length is only 31 inches, it is about as discreet as you can be with anything other than a hand trowel.

 

[RLOH]

Ray, we all know as experienced diggers that these shovels can probably dig a neater plug than a hand trowel. But, when the park workers see any thing resembling a shovel, they FREAK. Groomed parks are off limits to any sort of shovel. I have met a local guy several times and he carries a full size shovel and he is kicked out of EVERY place he goes. "Guys and girls take your time and dig the correct way or we will all be looking at our high priced detectors hanging in our basements. It is not worth the risk so please don't use shovels in public parks, schools, and etc.

 

[Jason in Enid]

Watch it, I was called a Troll for having an anti-shovel view on this topic. Public perception is everything. I don't want to say anymore because I don't want to get in trouble. Read my signature below.

No CH, I called you a troll for complaining about British muckers show using shovels in a river bottom, and you were doing it on at least a half dozen threads.

I agree that public perception is very powerful and I don't think detectorists should be using shovel style diggers in public places with manicured lawns. As was already mentioned above, the perception when seeing us with a shovel is that we are digging huge holes everywhere.

 

[MarkCZ]

Long handle digging tools is OUT for public parks, ball fields, ect...
I've made three of these diggers below and they cut perfect plugs, and I would like to use it in my local park, but it would draw to much attention!!
It cuts a PERFECT hole, and puts it back PERFECT! Sometimes there is a little transplant shock for the grass (light brown) for a couple of days, but nothing like what the piles of dog crap does!!

If, your seen digging with a long handle digger the police probably wouldn't bother you just because they seen you, but the calls they would get from people with cell phones would be cause for them to ask you to stop digging due to complaints!

Mark

 

[khouse]

I think eveeryone knows how I feel. I'm against long handled shovels in public parks.
http://www.findmall.com/read.php?20,1665641,1665774#msg-1665774

 

[Critterhunter]

A half dozen threads, eh? If I remember right it was two or three. I didn't see you complaining when there were at least that many threads in different forums about the bad image these TV shows are giving us. Those people were just as worried about our image to the general public. That's all I'm worried about as well. Public perception is EVERYTHING, and these shows look just as bad to the public as using shovels of any sort. On that TV show you refer to they were using shovels and pitch forks on PUBLIC land in the middle of a CITY where people could see their activities. Keep in mind this was also being broadcast on TV. If you don't think that there is an issue with public perception in this case then I honestly don't know what to say. Keep asserting your "rights" and see where that gets you. Try to explain your "rights" to a cop as he kicks you out of a public park for good.

I believe we should have the right to use shovels on public land. However, I live in the real world...And that means that public perception is EVERYTHING when it comes to what kind of behaviours we should have. We are a very tiny and small percentage of the population. Most people don't think we should be digging up their public parks. Lugging a big long handled digger or a shovel into the park is only going to bring quicker what we most fear. Like it or not, that's the truth. If you are unable to bend down and dig a hole then do the right thing by this hobby and either move on or find some private land to hunt.

Again, I don't agree with bans on detecting or even that I shouldn't be able to use whatever I want to dig on public land that my tax dollars have paid for. On the other hand, I live in the real world where I have to deal with what concepts of reality and "rights" the public will tolerate. That's the reason why I would never take a shovel of any sort, even a long handle digger, into a public area. I have a bad back off and on and at times I can't hunt due to it locking up on me. When that happens (usually when I'm hunting) I put the detector away and watch my friends hunt. I'm not going to spoil it for the rest of this hobby by bringing a shovel to a public area.

And although I promised myself that I wouldn't be drawn into this kind of discussion again, it appears I have. I'm sorry, but I strongly feel that the lack of common sense from fellow hunters will kill this hobby faster than anything else. We have to be discrete and try to stay out of the face of the general public as much as possible. That means not hunting in the middle of a park or beach on a busy day, using a shovel on public lands to dig, and so on. Again, as right as I may feel about our rights being Americans, I also know that the uniformed majority will win any battles we try to fight with them.

 

[JOE in MD]

It's simple for me. NO RELIC SHOVELS IN PUBLIC AREAS. Leave the shovels for the woods!!!!!!!! JMO

 

[ZOFCHAK]

I guess I'm in the minority in that I will sometimes use a relic shovel on public property. I'd never consider using one in an open groomed area, but I use them in unmaintained wooded areas, construction sites and drained/lowered lakes. Normally these hunts are in the Winter off season when I'm just about the only person around, so there are not many spectators on which I can leave a bad impression.

 

[therover]

A sharp shovel that can make a clean plug is more beneficial to the turf than mucking it up with a small digging tool.

However, most people will think a shovel equates to big holes, and even though the blade may be 4 inches in width, to them a shovel is a shovel.

I leave my shovel at home whenever I am in a public place.

 

[MarkCZ]

I guess I'm in the minority in that I will sometimes use a relic shovel on public property. I'd never consider using one in an open groomed area, but I use them in unmaintained wooded areas, construction sites and drained/lowered lakes. Normally these hunts are in the Winter off season when I'm just about the only person around, so there are not many spectators on which I can leave a bad impression.

I've seen these threads come up on the forum before and its always the same and most of the times its 99% of the votes are "No Long Handled or Large Digging Tools In Public Parks"

The same point comes out every time,
Its not that its better,
Worse,
Easier, or
Faster,
It gets down to to many problems have been encountered by to many people that metal detect, to many signs has been posted due to to many irresponsible people.
That leaves the people that really loves the hobby with the fear of being forced out of the hobby by state and or Federal laws that just flat out BAN metal detecting!
So, in all that it comes down to not detecting in a way that draws ANY bad attention.
So, the ones that just go off and do whatever they want,
anywhere they want,
with anything they want,
don't fair well in forum topics like this.

As for me,
Those Long handled relic shovels are made to make Bigger, deeper holes,
Cut larger roots,
Pry out larger rocks,
and to do so in area's where it doesn't make any difference, in public parks and area's like them the relic digging tool is just a bad idea for about 99% (maybe 98%) of the people that love the hobby.

Mark

 

[Critterhunter]

Here's a simple and straight forward way to think about it. Nobody usually minds people playing music on a radio in the park. That is until they turn up the volume high enough to where it is "in the face" of other people there. By the same token, most people will tolerate us metal detecting in a park if we are carrying a small digger on our belt and a screwdriver for the shallow stuff. But if you start lugging around a long handled digger or shovel it's "turning up the volume" so to speak, and there will then be people who simply can't tolerate seeing you use one of those things in "their" park. Simple as that.

I also try to stay away from parks or beaches when they are real busy, and instead show up on days or at times when there are very few people there. The less people present, the less chance there will be one of "those" people in the crowd that want to cause trouble. My other thing is to always try to keep my back to people when I bend down and dig a hole. I don't want for them to have to see that act. Not until the hole has been repaired. Same deal with keeping my back to public roads when I'm digging. You never know who is driving by, like a bored cop who is looking for something to throw his weight around on.

Somebody in another thread also had a good point about this...If you are using a shovel or long handled diggeer you still have to bend down to recover the target and to properly repair the hole and brush any loose dirt into the hole before doing so. If you are getting down to do that you might as well get down to dig the plug in the first place.

 

[Critterhunter]

There's a thread on this very topic in the Views forum where somebody was using a long handled digger in a park on YouTube. We might want to take the conversation there as I don't think the moderators enjoy having it discussed here. I know they already moved to the views forum or shut down numerous threads on these topics in the past...

http://www.findmall.com/read.php?20,1665641

 

[Boomer1]

I use my Lesche digger in "public". Though I seldom visit parks and tot lots. I'm more into relics in older locations and at those places, my entrenching tool get's little notice.

I have gotten strange looks from the sheeple at parks while using my Lesche, some people actually have turned away like I was some kind of slasher or something.