Water machine

[gabbyhayes]

I'm thinking about adding another machine to my collection and am considering a water machine.
Any comments or suggestions?
PI vs VLF?
I'll be doing mostly fresh water, but I could be on the west coast this summer so will the VLF work in the saltwater?
Thanx

 

[Blank Planet]

short answer salt PI, flesh VLF ( multi freq.)

BP

 

[Blank Planet]

Pi is going to be hard work on fresh water if there is iron around as it has no discrimination so it could prove very frustrating PI's will always get better depth IMHO than VLF type machines although minelabs BBS machines do pretty well on depth and have disc so if going in fresh and salt then a excal would prob be the ticket, fresh water the iron doesn't rust away salt it does so if just doing salt PI machine is the way to go IMHO and its what i use and wouldn't leave home without it.

BP

 

[Nauti]

Hi Gabby,one of the best water detectors on the market today for both fresh and saltwater is minelabs excalibur......it is an industry leader in this field.The downside of this detector is that it costs a lot of money.Minelabs sovereign is basically the same machine,it just is'nt capable of being submerged like the excaliber but it is a lot cheaper.It also has iron mask which helps on inland sites.I own the sovereign gt and i would not use anything else on the beach......it picks up any target on the wet salt sand that my friends p.i machine will with the added benefit of iron discrim that is second to none.
Best regards,Neil.

 

[Sailorman]

I'm leaning towards a CZ21 for myself. While a pi machine can be deeper some of our areas have too much trash so a little discrimination can save my messed up shoulder the pain of digging all of it.

 

[gabbyhayes]

I have read many of the posts but I guess I was looking more for personel preferences.
Like I had a Garrett but I didn't like the way the machine was balanced.
When I went to the website where you can read reviews, most people seem to praise the machine they bought.
As an example, I like my GTI2500, but its kinda heavy and I get tired if I have to swing it for more than a hour or two.
My V3i is a fantastic machine, but it does have a pretty steep learning curve.
I have never owned a water machine nor have I ever water hunted so I was looking for what people liked/disliked about their machines.
I'll be hunting probably 90% fresh water, though I will be going to the pacific ocean this summer on vacation so I will be in salt water occasionally.
I won't be scuba diving, just wading in.
I guess that brings another question to mind.
Is there a sweet spot for finding things when you just wade in the water?
And I guess I'm mostly refering to smaller lakes wher people swim. Would it be in 1,2,3 or more feet of water.
Thanks in advance for your comments.

 

[Critterhunter]

For the price you can't beat an AT Pro, and it's light enough (unlike the Excal) with full screen ID and such to also make a great land detector. In fresh water it should give decent performance.The Excal is deeper, though, especially in salt water or mineralized beaches. If you only want to wade waist deep then the Sovereign GT is a great land/water detector. Nothing I've owned goes as deep in my soil or on my fresh water beaches. You simply take the control box and mount it in a chest bag. I put a plastic bag around it for extra protection. Take the meter off and you're all set to water hunt. Throw the meter back on and the box back onto the shaft and now you've got a great deep silver/gold ring detector for finding stuff at hunted out parks. Best machine for that that I've ever owned. The Excal is the same machine but is a bit heavy without some mods to use on land IMHO.

Since I already have my GT to land and water hunt waist deep, I don't think I'd buy an Excal for water hunting. I'd probably buy an AT Pro and then have that for deeper water hunting and also land hunting when I'm in the mood for a faster machine. Even though the GT is a slow recovery speed machine it gets me coins in iron and such like no other thanks to the Iron Mask ON feature. Just today I dug a wheat 6 or 7" deep that had iron in the hole, yet the wheatie gave me a good signal from any direction.

 

[Smudge]

You are right to focus on a VLF for freshwater. Saltwater can be problematic as many single frequency VLF detectors do not work well in that environment.

I would not tend to recommend a PI detector for fresh water as there is no salt to break down junk targets over time and you might find digging tiny pieces of junk metal in fresh water very aggrevating. Believe me, its often tough in salt water for the same reason. PI detectors are better used in cleaner environments, often limited to wet salt sand and the surf.

To come to the point, if you were looking for a detector that does both fresh and salt, your first choice might be the Exaclibur made by Minelab. It is a well tested, well established detector that is praised by most of its users. Out side of its weight and Minelabs poor record of customer service, you won;t find many criticisms of the Excalibur by its users. However, if you aren't into spending $1400 on a new detector, a second choice might be the Detectorpro Wader at a little under $600.00.

Some people are very critical of the Wader, and it did have some quality control issues in the past, but I have found it to be a decent detector giving reasonable depth (not as deep as the Minelab), though it is less sensitive to small gold jewelry. It can get wet, but do not take it diving or snorkeling.

The Wader has its virtues in my opinion. It is very lightweight and all the controls are in the headphones, so you can comfortably use it all day. I found its depth to be perfectly adequate and it worked well in the wet and dry sand and surf, though sometimes you will get noise if a wave washes over the coil.

But those would be my two choices. I did not include the AT Pro because 1) I have not used it and 2) the feedback I am getting on it in wet salt sand environments is mixed.

Good luck on your final choice. I hope you finds lots of good stuff!

 

[Critterhunter]

One other thing about the Sovereign...The coils on these machines have extra long length to them. It's meant that way so that you can chest mount the box while water hunting. Many other land machines don't have enough coil cable length to use as a chest mounted water machine.

 

[gabbyhayes]

Thanx for the info!
Anyone out there have a Garrett Sea Hunter Mark II.
I found a used one that looks very tempting.

 

[Jason in Enid]

You don't need a ID screen for a beach detector. On the beach there are 2 types of targets, iron and everything else you dig.

 

[Critterhunter]

That's why you can take the meter off a Sovereign while beach or water hunting. But on an AT Pro it's nice to have that meter on it, which makes it a great land detector too. It doesn't get Minelab depth but it's very respectable from what people say, and it's a fast machine which can be useful in certain situations on land. I've never really been a Garrett fan but have to admit they've got a winner just even based on the low price for a water machine. And a water machine that is light enough, has a LCD display, and so on....So that it's just as at home on land as it is in the water. All those features are just about unheard of in a water detector, especially at that price. However, if I was a salt water hunter and never planned to land hunt with the unit I'd opt for the Excal. It's just too heavy for land use unless you build a custom shaft and hip mount the control box on one. My Sovereign is my land detector, and as said I water hunt with it to about waist deep. I hunt freshwater beaches, so I may add an AT Pro to my lineup down the road for days when I want to go into deeper water. It would also be a good option when I feel like land hunting in an iron infested area due to it's fast recovery speed. Not that the Sovereign with it's Iron Mask feature won't find coins in iron. It does an amazing job Iron Mask abilities at finding me coins mixed with iron. Recovery speed isn't the only factor in unmasking, and a slow recovery speed can be compensated for by slowing down your sweep speed like you should do with a Sovereign anyway to get the best performance out of it. Still, there are days when I'd be in the mood to land hunt with a different beast like the AT Pro.

 

[Smudge]

The Sea Hunter is a good PI detector, but you can ignore the knob that says "discrimination". It has none.

 

[Bromly]

Seems like everyone has offered great advice.I have used all the machines mentioned in all of the replies.Plus a few more, I'm currently using a BHID 300. Yes it's not a very popular machine at my beach's.Usually all you see are the excals ,GTs and a few others.I wanted to try something different for the dry sand and wet slopes.The BHID is by far the most fun machine I've used.By this I mean I have to work it.It's not super deep in Disc mode, but in AM it will compete and beat alot of other machines, if you learn what it's telling you.Also the tell-tell lights work in AM mode.Red never dig, Yellow always dig"most gold turns on the yellow LED" and green is usually coins, but if the target is really deep, the green can change into a red LED as you get closer.Also you'll get a jump in the threshold but no LED, then you know it's a deep target, I'll usually just start kicking away 4"-6" of sand then I'll get a LED to turn on.I find it exciting when the yellow turns on when going after a deep target." I'm easy that way". It's even more fun when I'm hunting at night, the LED's really light up nicely.I'll be walking along the shore line, seeing red,,,red,,,red,,YELLOW,DIG!! " I said I'm easy to please". It hits my 1gram test ring at 8" np in AM, but wont turn on the LED til 7" It will also hit my 13gram ring at 12"-13" but again it wont turn on the LED til around 9". Yes other machines will also hit those numbers with no problems I know. For some reason I always have fun with this BHID, it really cracks me up with those LEDs You do have to manually GB it, but that's a piece of cake.It is water proof, it seems to get around 20plus hrs on 8AA's , it also has a12" coil for good coverage.I do find that I have to turn the sens down to the preset when on the wet slope.But I can max out the sens in the dry.It does operate on 2 freq. 3kHZ and 15kHZ. I find it to be VERY balanced, all the weight is under your ,or close to your elbow.I can swing it all day.
Just my opinion on another beach machine.

Good Luck and HH!

Ken

 

[gabbyhayes]

Thanx for your insights.
This was exactly the type of info I was looking for. An honest opinion about a detector you own, especially from someone who's had multiple detectors.
ALL detectors have pros and cons and it usually boils down to personal preferences. (Do ya drive a ford or a chevy?)
I often get annoyed by people that have a very biased opinion based on a brand and have never tried another companies detector.
If they own it it has to be the best detector in the world otherwise they would have never bought it.

 

[Smudge]

Ken,

The key is finding a detector you enjoy.

And if you're having fun with the BHID 300, then who cares what everyone else is using?

 

[D&P-OR]

Ya got that right Smudge.-----Enjoyment is "the name of the game"! -----------Del

Ken,

The key is finding a detector you enjoy.

And if you're having fun with the BHID 300, then who cares what everyone else is using?

 

[Jason in Enid]

I'm thinking about adding another machine to my collection and am considering a water machine.
Any comments or suggestions?
PI vs VLF?
I'll be doing mostly fresh water, but I could be on the west coast this summer so will the VLF work in the saltwater?
Thanx

Well, a lot of info has been put out already, and none of it is bad. When it comes to a freshwater beach, you have a lot more lee-way. The place where so many detectors start to fail is when you start getting wet salts in the conductive field.

I have been using an (older model) White's Surfmaster 2 for my freshwater hunts. It's a great detector and very sensitive to tiny gold. I also have a Surfmaster PI that I have been using in saltwater areas. If you don't have a lot of iron in your beach then a PI would be a great choice. I just picked up an Excal 800 (blue model) to try on my freshwater beach. I know a lot of people love them but I haven't had it out yet to offer any ideas on it.

 

[tumbleinn]

I have a surfmaster II and it seems to work great in fresh water