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Stock 9.5" or SEF 6x8 Coil - M6
- Thread starter Hotdawg
- Start date
opinionated answers might still leave you wondering. 
Most of the time I hunt places that are trashy, and that calls for a smaller-size coil. Many of the sites have a lot of iron junk, and that calls for a smaller coil that handles iron well with a good detector Discrimination circuitry. Quite a few places are also very brushy with a lot of short, stuff brush to deal with and that means I like to use a smaller-size coil that is solid and not open which could hang-up and snag.
To ME, my opinion is neither are better than what I prefer to use, but if forced to pick the better of the two, it would be the 950. I believe that's the coil you're asking about. The stock coil on an M6 is the 950 Concentric but it measures a bit over 9½" in diameter. For hunting a beach or a large open park or field, the 950 works okay. My preference, however, is the newer 'spoked' 9" Concentric which actually measures just a fraction under 9¼" in diameter. Why do I like it better? It looks better, but more importantly the rod-mount point is just a little closer to the center of the coil and that makes it 'feel' or 'balance' better than the 950.
The open spoked design can cause some hang-ups in brushier places, but if too brushy I have the solid 6½" coil mounted on my MXT All-Pro or MX5. I use the 9" spider coil for more open areas that are both sparse target sites and more open without snaggy brush.
The 950, or the 9" spider, are Concentric designed search coils and the 6X8 SEF is a Double-D design, so they are different physical sizes and different internal winding designed coils.
1.. They are a little larger than the SEF coil.
2.. They are Concentric coils which, as has been proven in many test comparisons, can provide a little better depth of detection than a similar-size Double-D coil.
The one thing I caught in your question was not just "which goes deeper" but a reference to older coins. That implies that older coins are deeper and shallower coins aren't. While generally correct, most older coins are not usually all that deep unless there has been some fill material brought in, a build-up of mowed grass and/or leafage, or some ground altering event that caused them to be repositioned from a 'normal' lace of rest.
Okay, I agree that there are some older coins that might be a little 'deeper,' but depth is an arguable point in itself. I find 'deep' coins every year of the five decades I have been at this great hobby, and most of them I find when using a 6½" or 7" Concentric coil because those are what are usually mounted on the detectors that I use the most. But I also know that location is a big key in determining just how 'deep' coins and trade tokens and buttons and other smaller sized artifacts are typically found.
There is one particular old ghost town that I have enjoyed hunting since May 4th of '69, but concentrated on more after we got decent ghost town hunting detectors in mid-'83. One old site, and I can guarantee you I haven't been the only one hunting it as it is in a hand-to-get-to location and it has had individuals, groups of 'hunting buddies' and even metal detecting club outing out to it, but it still produced a lot of coins to make me satisfied. Hundreds, such that I would card them in 2X2's and filled four binders.
There were a few, just a few, that were what I would call 'deep' such as the 6"-6½" deep 1836 Capped Bust Half-Dime, or an 1858 Flying Eagle Cent that was deep, but wouldn't have been located if I hadn't already gone down 5" or so to get the Seated Liberty Quarter and then re-checked the hole. A faint signal and another 4" or so to the Flying Eagle Penny. I guess in all those years I could have gone down to a ±6" depth 3 or 4 more times, but that's about it. Most older coins, 1851 Large Cents, a few 2¢ Pieces, Seated Liberty Half-Dimes, Dimes, Quarters and halves, and the Barber coins, and Shield and 'V' Nickels, Indian Head Cents, just all the rest were located from surface to the 3"-4" 'depth' range.
The same holds true for other ghost towns and stage stops and encampment sites I have hunted in Utah, Wyoming, Idaho, Arizona, California, New Mexico, Nevada and Oregon, and other older-use locations. Coins are generally not all that deep. I acknowledge that in some places, and for understandable reasons, some can be found deeper, but most aren't. But if I am searching for any older coins and artifacts that might be a bit deeper, and if I want some of the best visual VDI info I can get at the better depth attainable, I am going to make sure I have a Concentric coil mounted because they can produce that information better, and deeper.
But if you mainly hunt schools and a few parks, and if they are older and have the potential to still be hiding a few older coins, and if the areas are not too trashy, then I suggest using the 9" spider or 950 Concentric coils. Master the best sweep speed and search coil presentation for the detector you're using, and keep the Discrimination as low as you can tolerate. Use the VDI to your advantage, and when after deeper coins I'd use it to help classify possible iron trash, but not to correctly ID any older coins with a 'proper' VDI number reference. TID and VDI read-outs do not work as well as the audio circuitry on deeper targets. Also, deeper coins have more ground mineral signal to process, and that can often result in an up-scale VDI which would be incorrect.
Now, if we could get rid of the cold weather that blew in, the snow and icy conditions it brought, and hurry up through winter into spring-time weather, I sure would be happy and be able to get out after newer coins, older coins, shallower coins and deeper coins.
Best of success in your decision making, and it would be good if you could get with a dealer or a local person with both coils so you could compare. I have on a few occasions, and that's why I use what I have chosen.
Monte
This one is going to get a totally 'like/don't like' opinion, and for me .... I don't like either of those coils for most of the hunting I do.Hotdawg said:
Most of the time I hunt places that are trashy, and that calls for a smaller-size coil. Many of the sites have a lot of iron junk, and that calls for a smaller coil that handles iron well with a good detector Discrimination circuitry. Quite a few places are also very brushy with a lot of short, stuff brush to deal with and that means I like to use a smaller-size coil that is solid and not open which could hang-up and snag.
To ME, my opinion is neither are better than what I prefer to use, but if forced to pick the better of the two, it would be the 950. I believe that's the coil you're asking about. The stock coil on an M6 is the 950 Concentric but it measures a bit over 9½" in diameter. For hunting a beach or a large open park or field, the 950 works okay. My preference, however, is the newer 'spoked' 9" Concentric which actually measures just a fraction under 9¼" in diameter. Why do I like it better? It looks better, but more importantly the rod-mount point is just a little closer to the center of the coil and that makes it 'feel' or 'balance' better than the 950.
The open spoked design can cause some hang-ups in brushier places, but if too brushy I have the solid 6½" coil mounted on my MXT All-Pro or MX5. I use the 9" spider coil for more open areas that are both sparse target sites and more open without snaggy brush.
The 950, or the 9" spider, are Concentric designed search coils and the 6X8 SEF is a Double-D design, so they are different physical sizes and different internal winding designed coils.
Yes, the advantage would be to the 9" spoked or 950 Concentric coils because:Hotdawg said:
1.. They are a little larger than the SEF coil.
2.. They are Concentric coils which, as has been proven in many test comparisons, can provide a little better depth of detection than a similar-size Double-D coil.
The one thing I caught in your question was not just "which goes deeper" but a reference to older coins. That implies that older coins are deeper and shallower coins aren't. While generally correct, most older coins are not usually all that deep unless there has been some fill material brought in, a build-up of mowed grass and/or leafage, or some ground altering event that caused them to be repositioned from a 'normal' lace of rest.
Okay, I agree that there are some older coins that might be a little 'deeper,' but depth is an arguable point in itself. I find 'deep' coins every year of the five decades I have been at this great hobby, and most of them I find when using a 6½" or 7" Concentric coil because those are what are usually mounted on the detectors that I use the most. But I also know that location is a big key in determining just how 'deep' coins and trade tokens and buttons and other smaller sized artifacts are typically found.
There is one particular old ghost town that I have enjoyed hunting since May 4th of '69, but concentrated on more after we got decent ghost town hunting detectors in mid-'83. One old site, and I can guarantee you I haven't been the only one hunting it as it is in a hand-to-get-to location and it has had individuals, groups of 'hunting buddies' and even metal detecting club outing out to it, but it still produced a lot of coins to make me satisfied. Hundreds, such that I would card them in 2X2's and filled four binders.
There were a few, just a few, that were what I would call 'deep' such as the 6"-6½" deep 1836 Capped Bust Half-Dime, or an 1858 Flying Eagle Cent that was deep, but wouldn't have been located if I hadn't already gone down 5" or so to get the Seated Liberty Quarter and then re-checked the hole. A faint signal and another 4" or so to the Flying Eagle Penny. I guess in all those years I could have gone down to a ±6" depth 3 or 4 more times, but that's about it. Most older coins, 1851 Large Cents, a few 2¢ Pieces, Seated Liberty Half-Dimes, Dimes, Quarters and halves, and the Barber coins, and Shield and 'V' Nickels, Indian Head Cents, just all the rest were located from surface to the 3"-4" 'depth' range.
The same holds true for other ghost towns and stage stops and encampment sites I have hunted in Utah, Wyoming, Idaho, Arizona, California, New Mexico, Nevada and Oregon, and other older-use locations. Coins are generally not all that deep. I acknowledge that in some places, and for understandable reasons, some can be found deeper, but most aren't. But if I am searching for any older coins and artifacts that might be a bit deeper, and if I want some of the best visual VDI info I can get at the better depth attainable, I am going to make sure I have a Concentric coil mounted because they can produce that information better, and deeper.
Mineralized. Another interesting topic of discussion. I live in Oregon, and for about 53+ of my over 65 years it was in NW Oregon where we encounter a rather high iron mineralized environment. I travel to and hunt tougher locations, and that includes my favorite ghost town which has more iron mineral ground than most places around here in 'bad ground' Oregon. I tell you that because I have hunted a lot of Double-D coils of various types and sizes and pitted them against an assortment of Concentric coils. Not every time, but for the brands I prefer and models I choose to use, the Concentric coils work the best, and still get the same or better depth of detection.Hotdawg said:
But if you mainly hunt schools and a few parks, and if they are older and have the potential to still be hiding a few older coins, and if the areas are not too trashy, then I suggest using the 9" spider or 950 Concentric coils. Master the best sweep speed and search coil presentation for the detector you're using, and keep the Discrimination as low as you can tolerate. Use the VDI to your advantage, and when after deeper coins I'd use it to help classify possible iron trash, but not to correctly ID any older coins with a 'proper' VDI number reference. TID and VDI read-outs do not work as well as the audio circuitry on deeper targets. Also, deeper coins have more ground mineral signal to process, and that can often result in an up-scale VDI which would be incorrect.
Now, if we could get rid of the cold weather that blew in, the snow and icy conditions it brought, and hurry up through winter into spring-time weather, I sure would be happy and be able to get out after newer coins, older coins, shallower coins and deeper coins.
Best of success in your decision making, and it would be good if you could get with a dealer or a local person with both coils so you could compare. I have on a few occasions, and that's why I use what I have chosen.
Monte
You are new to detecting ( do your research) don't let old Monte scare you away from the SEF 6X8 coil he has always had a bias towards any type of DD coils and yes he has many years of detecting experience. He does make some good points also concerning coils over all that I can not fault. I can tell you my experiences differs from his with the DD coils and the SEF 6X8 coil. So with that being said the SEF 6X8 coil is an excellent coil with good depth it pin points well and gets fair ground coverage. In general or in most ground conditions I tend to prefer it to the stock 950 coil on the M6. Many people rave about it on the MXT & M6 detectors. More rave about it for sure than dislike it. I have had really good performance with it on my M6. I also had one on an MXT for several years with the same kind of results. The SEF 6x8 will pick up a dime under a mineralized brick in a test I have done and have seen others do that the Whites 6x10 DD coil the stock 950 concentric and the 5.5" or 6" Whites Eclipse coil did not see. This made a believer out of me concerning the 6X8 SEF coil and it's ability to work in mineralized ground. The balance is great with the M6 and the SEF 6X8 coil.
You did mention your ground is not mineralized so another coil that works great on the M6 is the Whites 5.5" or 6" eclipse coil ( a little less coverage good in trash) as mentioned by Monte this coil is a concentric coil and does a sweet job as well but will suffer more in mineralized ground (not a concern for your ground conditions) compared to the SEF 6X8 coil but a lot of elements play into coil performance the ground type and the detector being used as well as the operators abilities.
Best Of Luck,
Bill G
You did mention your ground is not mineralized so another coil that works great on the M6 is the Whites 5.5" or 6" eclipse coil ( a little less coverage good in trash) as mentioned by Monte this coil is a concentric coil and does a sweet job as well but will suffer more in mineralized ground (not a concern for your ground conditions) compared to the SEF 6X8 coil but a lot of elements play into coil performance the ground type and the detector being used as well as the operators abilities.
Best Of Luck,
Bill G
Larry (IL)
Well-known member
The DD/SEF coils works best in mineralized ground and the concentric works best in mild ground. If your ground is not very mineralized you gain depth with a concentric and gain again with the larger coil. BUT, if you are hunting in an area that you need separation, a small coil and a DD/SEF type will give you better results.
Every coil type has it's advantages and disadvantages depending on your needs.
Every coil type has it's advantages and disadvantages depending on your needs.
to try and check any search coil out for the hunting environment you pick to search. I know both Bill G and I have done that, and we are satisfied with the performance we get from our selections ... and that is what counts.
Yes, I have a bias against a lot of Double-D coils, from a detector manufacturer or aftermarket, because for ME and the sites I tend to hunt, Concentric coils work a little better with improved Discrimination [size=small](especially in iron)[/size] and a little better depth, plus a little tighter VDI read-out. I had a 6X8 SEF and I have used several of them and other sizes and designs of Double-D coils. That includes White's own 4X6 Shooter, 6X10 Eclipse and the 10" D2 DD.
I can tell you this about DD coils. I own two non-discriminating Compass TR's that have their stock round DD coils. Teknetics doesn't make a Concentric coil smaller than the 8" so I have a round 5" Double-D coil for the Omega or other models that accept that coil connector. In the White's accessory coil line, I personally do not like any of them. In the White's after-market coil offerings there are two DD coils that I do like. Those are the 5" DD Excelerator and the 6X8 SEF DD.
If I didn't have, or if White's didn't make, their 6½" diameter Concentric coil, then I would munt up a 6X8 SEF and use it ..... until somebody made a smaller-size Concentric coil.
I hunt with these search coils in a wide-range of mineralization without any issues or impaired performance. But, I like to use what works for me.
As to the main part of the question Hotdawg asked, the 950 should hunt a little deeper than the 6X8 SEF, and that's what I answered, even though I like the 9" Concentric better for balance and feel, and good looks.
Monte
Yes, research is very important, so don't let old Bill G dupe you into that funny-looking "butterfly" coil.Bill G said:
Yes, I have a bias against a lot of Double-D coils, from a detector manufacturer or aftermarket, because for ME and the sites I tend to hunt, Concentric coils work a little better with improved Discrimination [size=small](especially in iron)[/size] and a little better depth, plus a little tighter VDI read-out. I had a 6X8 SEF and I have used several of them and other sizes and designs of Double-D coils. That includes White's own 4X6 Shooter, 6X10 Eclipse and the 10" D2 DD.
I can tell you this about DD coils. I own two non-discriminating Compass TR's that have their stock round DD coils. Teknetics doesn't make a Concentric coil smaller than the 8" so I have a round 5" Double-D coil for the Omega or other models that accept that coil connector. In the White's accessory coil line, I personally do not like any of them. In the White's after-market coil offerings there are two DD coils that I do like. Those are the 5" DD Excelerator and the 6X8 SEF DD.
If I didn't have, or if White's didn't make, their 6½" diameter Concentric coil, then I would munt up a 6X8 SEF and use it ..... until somebody made a smaller-size Concentric coil.
I will agree, generally, and it does pinpoint better than most DD's, but that's partly because most are larger-sized. The main point I agree with is that Bill G is satisfied and comfortable with the 6X8 SEF coil, and that translates to confidence, and that leads to a more relaxed and confident attitude and from that success and enjoyment follow. The same goes for me and my preferred coil.Bill G said:
I prefer the 6½" Concentric and my 9" spider Concentric to the 950, but again, those are just personal preferences.Bill G said:
The White's search coils that are labeled Blue Max 600, 5.3 Black Max and 5,3 BulsEye [size=small](for the XLT, Classic's and other compatible 6.59 kHz models)[/size] and the 5.3 Eclipse [size=small](for the MX5, M6, MXT All-Pro and VX3 & V3i)[/size] are all in the same 6½" diameter housing and are all Concentric type search coils.Bill G said:
I hunt with these search coils in a wide-range of mineralization without any issues or impaired performance. But, I like to use what works for me.
As to the main part of the question Hotdawg asked, the 950 should hunt a little deeper than the 6X8 SEF, and that's what I answered, even though I like the 9" Concentric better for balance and feel, and good looks.
Monte
dirt doctor
Well-known member
n/t
dirt doctor
Well-known member
Bill G said:Southwind said:
I bet counting all those My & I was not short and simple...Lol.
That is some serious counting !!
OregonGregg
Well-known member
Well given that you are just hunting some schools and parks and asking about the 950 vs 8x6, save your money and use the 950 coil that came on your machine. The 8x6 will give you no advantage other then it might look a little more "cool" hanging off the end of your M6 <--- by the way a great machine 
In most park hunting situations I have found the SEF 6X8 coil will cut through the trash in the parks better than the stock 950 coil do to its size being smaller than the stock 950 coil more like a 7" or 8" coil in size while still getting good solid depth on targets while maintaining decent ground coverage. Also the narrow pattern of the SEF DD coil will sniff out the targets between the trash a little better than the stock 950 concentric coils funnel pattern. This has been the case with the coils mentioned performance differences when used on my M6. If a guy wants even better trash separations than the SEF 6X8 coil he could use the 6" Eclipse (great coil) or the 4X6 DD shooter coil (great little coil as well) or similar sized after market coils such as the 5" or 6" round SEF coils that are available for the M6.
Also the 6X8 SEF coil does look pretty cool that's just a bonus though.. Lol
Happy Hunting,
Bill G
Also the 6X8 SEF coil does look pretty cool that's just a bonus though.. Lol
Happy Hunting,
Bill G