A fine gentleman from another forum ask to see what depth I could get a trace at holding the coil above the target something I overlooked here are the results . ferrous coin would hit at 3 inches on a east west hit and 7 inches on a north south hit. High trash would only see it at 1 1/2 inches on a east west hit and 7 inches on a north south hit the north south hits all gave audio as you know so it would appear that the trace is tied to the audio yet at the same time the east west hits have no audio . So I still don't know why the trace is working on the east west hit without audio which would make it appear that the trace would be separate from the audio ?. I guess some more testing is in the works in the (dirt) . Well at least I found that this can be done in high trash to but it's not as deep as ferrous coin .One other thing is maybe when in ferrous coin the trace is seeing it north south and giving no audio because of the ground covering it . That would explain why I could of dug these signals down to 7 inches in real dirt . I guess I will have to wait for the snow to go away before more testing . sube