Simultaneus Multi-Frequency

[Tony (Michigan)]

I just saw a video where the tester said the new detector has simultaneous multi-frequency technology.
So the detector has freqs of 5,10,15,20 and 40 kHz. So does these mean all these frequencies are simultaneous or all at the same time?
That's how I take "simultaneous" to mean.

 

[Dan(NM)]

Time will tell, or not, we may never know what Minelab considers multi-frequency. At this point it's all speculation.

 

[sgoss66]

I am not sure exactly what frequency combinations will be used in the "multi-frequency" mode.

BUT, I am nearly certain that yes, at least SOME of the frequencies will be able to be run "simultaneously." I think it's been made pretty clear that you can run the Equinox in a "single frequency" mode, or in a "multi-frequency" mode; there is also some video out there which IMPLIES that there will be a "different" multi-frequency mode available for the different detecting modes. In other words, if you are in "park" mode, you can choose either 5, 10, or 15 kHz SINGLE frequency, or you can choose MULTI-frequency, in that mode. Then, in beach mode, if you choose multi-frequency, it seems to be implied that this will be a little bit "different" of a "multi-frequency" mode than that used in "park" mode.

Obviously, the details are sketchy at this point, but I definitely do believe, from what I can glean from all sources, that the machine can be run in one of several SINGLE frequencies, OR, in a multi-frequency mode that will include at least a couple of different frequencies running simultaneously.

Steve

 

[Architex]

I am not sure exactly what frequency combinations will be used in the "multi-frequency" mode.

BUT, I am nearly certain that yes, at least SOME of the frequencies will be able to be run "simultaneously." I think it's been made pretty clear that you can run the Equinox in a "single frequency" mode, or in a "multi-frequency" mode; there is also some video out there which IMPLIES that there will be a "different" multi-frequency mode available for the different detecting modes. In other words, if you are in "park" mode, you can choose either 5, 10, or 15 kHz SINGLE frequency, or you can choose MULTI-frequency, in that mode. Then, in beach mode, if you choose multi-frequency, it seems to be implied that this will be a little bit "different" of a "multi-frequency" mode than that used in "park" mode.

Obviously, the details are sketchy at this point, but I definitely do believe, from what I can glean from all sources, that the machine can be run in one of several SINGLE frequencies, OR, in a multi-frequency mode that will include at least a couple of different frequencies running simultaneously.

Steve

I think all that is reasonable. My question is, for however many freq's run simultaneously, will you see the info provided by each freq like the V3i does. If it does that then here's my money.

 

[sgoss66]

OH, Ok. I misunderstood, Architex. I see what you are saying. You are wondering if you can display the output of each frequency separately, while running multi-frequency, or just combined together "behind the scenes," algorithmically, and the you see one output from the algorithm.

Gotcha. I haven't seen anything that says that there will be "separate" readouts for each simultaneous frequency that is running, but who knows.

Steve

 

[Flintstone]

I think the controller is to small to show what you are talking about. I might be wrong, but the V3i and even the DFX has a larger control box. If it dose show all, it will be very small and hard to see. It would be nice if it did. flintstone

 

[Architex]

You're probably right but new technology.............?

 

[tcornel]

Does this machine actually run multi frequencies OR does the second channel search for the best single frequency and switch as conditions change? Basically a single frequency machine with auto noise cancel running?

 

[sgoss66]

tcornel --

I can't imagine it not running multiple DETECTING frequencies (as compared to one "detecting" frequency and one or more "ground cancel" frequencies). Reason I say this is, say you are running 5 kHz single frequency. If you then switch to multi, if all that means is that you are still DETECTING at 5 kHz, but you now are "compensating for the ground" with the other frequency or frequencies, then WHY WOULD YOU EVER NOT run in multi? In other words, if you offer me single frequency 5 kHz, OR 5 kHz BUT with a multi-frequency approach to more accurately with the ground signal (presumably to improve detecting depth/ID accuracy), then what would ever possess me to say "no, thank you; I think I want to run 5 kHz WITHOUT the more accurate ground compensation..." Seems like it would be a no-brainer to run multi, if what you suggest were actually what was going on in multi-frequency. When would anyone EVER choose "single," in that example, and why would the designer even bother to include "single" if that were the case. It would seem nothing short of "useless" to include single frequency options (if "multi" means single PLUS a ground compensation frequency)...as an analogy it would seem like a car maker saying "here's a car with automatic windows, but we have included a window crank knob too, just in case you want to switch off the power window option and use a crank instead..." It just wouldn't make sense in my mind to even OFFER the single freq. modes on the unit, if "multi" is simply "single plus ground compensation." Switching to multi HAS to mean more than just "adding ground compensation."

I would speculate that it is MORE likely that there is ALWAYS ground compensation going in the Equinox (with at least one frequency performing the ground compensation), and then, while that background ground compensation is occurring choosing single or multi, means choosing either one, or multiple, DETECTING frequencies. I'm not saying this IS true (I am only speculating,) but if I were designing a machine, and found a way to use multiple frequencies to compensate/adjust for ground mineralization -- and thus improve my ability to detect better/more accurately, WHY WOULD I ALSO INCLUDE IN THE MACHINE a "single frequency" option that would NOT utilize that ground-compensating circuit? It would seem like selling a Mercedes that -- if you wanted -- you could switch it into "Pinto" mode! I have to think that "multi" doesn't simply mean, "you still run one detecting frequency, but with the added benefit of "ground compensatation."

But who knows...

Steve

 

[Jason in Enid]

the analogy here is backward. The single freq is the speedster and the multi is a pinto, at least as far speed of processing is concerned.

 

[Wayfarer]

And what is this talk I see in other posts that multi might not even include 20 and 40 kHz? If that's true, then the 600 becomes much more attractive, especially to those of us who already have an effective single frequency gold detector. It would seem that the 20 and 40 kHz freqs on the 800 are just added on as a single frequency gold option to give those who don't already have a single purpose gold detector that capability..

 

[Jason in Enid]

And what is this talk I see in other posts that multi might not even include 20 and 40 kHz? If that's true, then the 600 becomes much more attractive, especially to those of us who already have an effective single frequency gold detector. It would seem that the 20 and 40 kHz freqs on the 800 are just added on as a single frequency gold option to give those who don't already have a single purpose gold detector that capability..

Why are you putting any faith in the ramblings of someone on a forum? NONE of us here but one has seen this thing in person and that person is being almost silent (likely because of none disclosure agreements).

Everything KNOWN is what Minelab stated in the official release, which you can read on their website. After that, we are all just guessing and trying to fill in the blanks.

 

[Wayfarer]

And what is this talk I see in other posts that multi might not even include 20 and 40 kHz? If that's true, then the 600 becomes much more attractive, especially to those of us who already have an effective single frequency gold detector. It would seem that the 20 and 40 kHz freqs on the 800 are just added on as a single frequency gold option to give those who don't already have a single purpose gold detector that capability..

Why are you putting any faith in the ramblings of someone on a forum? NONE of us here but one has seen this thing in person and that person is being almost silent (likely because of none disclosure agreements).

Everything KNOWN is what Minelab stated in the official release, which you can read on their website. After that, we are all just guessing and trying to fill in the blanks.

The Minelap rep says in one of the videos that the EQ will run only in single frequency in prospecting mode, which would mean 40 kHz and probably 20 kHz too. That's what got Steve H. and others thinking (they weren't sure, of course) along those lines over at the other forum. Won't matter to me, because if I take the plunge, I'm getting the 800, but it is an interesting question, especially with the rather big price difference between the 600 and the 800.

I'm just having fun trying to fill in the blanks like everybody else. The guessing game is half the fun as the true features are unveiled.

 

[Tom_in_CA]

To pad on to Jason's reply: When you ask: " why WOULDN'T someone always run in multi ?" Because there are tasks where that is not the optimum. I can imagine that in ghost-townsy situations, where the task becomes seeing through and around iron (and TID and depth become secondary objectives). In cases like that, a wimpy Tesoro silver sabre, or bandito will far exceed a "multi" machine like an Explorer, for instance.

 

[sgoss66]

Tom_in_CA --

I agree with you on utility of single frequencies at times, but I think you missed my point. YES, I can see some scenarios where someone would want to hunt single-frequency, versus multi-frequency. What I was saying was this -- I was responding to a poster who wondered if the Equinox's "multi-frequency mode" was going to feature multiple DETECTING frequencies -- i.e. more than one frequency reading the target and deciphering target ID info, OR, if it would be a mode where you still only had one single DETECTING frequency looking at/deciphering the TARGET, but the other frequency or frequencies limited to only working on ground compensation. My point was that I thought the multi-frequency mode HAD to be MORE than just single frequency for target, other frequency or frequencies for ground compensation BECAUSE, if the only thing that choosing multi-frequency mode did was use additional frequencies for ground compensation, but while still really using only a single "detecting" frequency, then in THAT scenario, I could not envision a reason for EVER choosing the single frequency mode that DID NOT include the "ground compensation." You would always choose single frequency WITH ground compensation, instead of single frequency WITHOUT ground compensation, right?

Stated more simply, if you give me a single frequency option, and then a single frequency option PLUS other frequencies performing "ground compensation," in what hunting scenario would I EVER find myself wanting to choose the single frequency mode without the more accurate ground compensation?

And thus -- it only makes sense, to me, to assume that the Equinox's "Multi-IQ" technology is a mode that is using multiple frequencies to simultaneously evaluate/interrogate the target itself (while possibly ALSO performing ground compensation), as opposed to ONLY assigning the extra frequencies exclusively, specifically, and entirely for ground compensation and nothing else.

Again, pure speculation; just trying to figure things out given the absence of info coming directly from Mr. Lawrie/Minelab.

Interesting that I saw a video where Mr. Lawrie was SPECIFICALLY asked by someone about the multi-frequency mode, if it was a few, several, etc. running at the same time. Mr. Lawrie got a sheepish smile, turned away, and mumbled that "we aren't releasing that information yet..."

So, that leaves us to simply speculate...and given that it's such an important part of this machine (in my opinion), I hope testers/initial users evaluate this multi-frequency technology THOROUGHLY, as it would seem to me to be THE KEY to pushing this machine "over the top," as opposed to being merely a machine that is "another good option" to consider when compared to a Deus, etc. Nothing wrong with being "as good as" a Deus, but if it wants to be BETTER, that will HAVE to come from the multi-frequency mode's performance, from my perspective. THAT is KEY.

Steve

 

[Tom_in_CA]

Steve, thanx for the explanation. But it's going to take me time to digest all that !

Or perhaps we both do what played out with yesteryear's great md'ing tech leaps: You'll know when your buddies start kicking your b@tt. And showing you flagged signals that you honestly have to admit that you wouldn't have heard.

 

[sgoss66]

Tom,

I know. I am trying to tease out a subtle nuance, and explaining it with too many words. Sorry about that. Pithiness has never been a strong suit of mine!

I am with you -- two experienced guys hunting together, one flagging targets with one machine and letting his buddy listen to them with HIS unit, that's the kind of testing I hope to see. No better way to learn that I know of, than comparing signals. That exact scenario, repeated consistently over several hunts with my E-Trac-swinging partner, is precisely what caused me to decide to sell my previous detector 6 1/2 years ago, and move whole-heartedly to the Minelab FBS "dark side!"

I hope we get this type of honest feedback on the forum, once a few of these units get into experienced detectorists' hands...

Steve