Shafts for GT

[davjac]

Hi all hope you can help.

I have seen some posts regarding the use of whites shafts with the GT, some use carbon lower but others use lower middle and top.

Its spread over months of debate and I was trying to get the conclusion, Carbon lower into minelab straight upper or all whites.....or something else!

I know Neil was one contributor but there were other, help guys!

 

[Critterhunter]

Read the custom light weight GT thread. There are several ways you can go about it and they will all save you weight over the stock shaft. Some use the upper/mid Whites shafts and I think the stock lower Minelab coil rod. Others use the entire Whites shaft. The normal lower Whites rod is carbon fiber. I used the lower Whites tall man carbon fiber rod. Since it's the same one but roughly twice as long as the stock Whites one this equals max weight savings, as now you can also either cut down the length of the upper aluminum stock rod or use a lighter gauge aluminum, which is what I did since I was shooting for max weight savings. Of course carbon is lighter than aluminum, so why not use the longer lower Whites rod and then shorten either a stock Minelab or a Whites upper one.

The only deal with using a Whites lower rod is it's not as wide of a coil mount as a Minelab. No big deal. Either order 4 Whites rubber washers with it or head up to a home improvement store and look for a package of rubber or silicone washers meant to fix faucets. I found the right diameter but the hole in the center wasn't big enough. Just stick them in a vise and drill the center out bigger. I then took these four washers and glued them together with super glue in pairs. You don't have to do that but it makes things stiffer and also less hassle trying to put the coil on.

About the only thing I can do to lighten the shaft more on mine would be to use a carbon fiber upper shaft and a carbon fiber bike end bar for a grip. Better yet, you could order a one piece carbon tube for the entire shaft so long as you are the only one hunting with it and so it doesn't need to be two pieces you can adjust.

As for camlocks, you don't need those. Just drill out two holes for the adjustment snap pins that come with the stock shaft and you are good to go. The Whites rods also come with this snap pin, and if you buy an Unger window cleaning pole to use the inner rod for your upper shaft (very light gauge aluminum) they also come with these.

 

[JHM]

I'm not sure what you're asking, but here's one I just got done with. The upper and middle section is whites. The lower is a sovereign shaft. I had to drill a hole in the end at 90 degrees and move the spring clip. The hardest thing is building the bracket to mount the control box. I use a push on push off button for the pinpoint switch

 

[crazyman]

Here is some different setups with my Minelabs. One is a custom Whites 2 piece straight rod with Minelab lower shaft. Then there is a Minelab 2 piece blue straight shaft that came off a Minelab SD gold detector and then a custom 2 piece Whites S-rod that I use for hip mounting my GT next to the Elite with the Standard Minelab S-rod.

 

[Ron from Michigan]

I think Crazyman's hybrid straight rod asm is a better setup when not hip mounted.I think the Minelab lower rod asm is less weight 79g/m vs 99g/m,more strength 72kp vs 70kp and stiffness or deflection 39mm vs 45mm over the Whites.Asm I write this I'm making a comparison between my White's TDI lower asm and the Sovereign the Minelab gets the nod

 

[crazyman]

Ron, I use the Minelab lower rods on all of my setups. I just drill out new holes for the spring clips to fit the Whites rods. The S-rod I use with my hip mount set up is actually a Whites upper rod, a Troy Shadow middle rod and then the Minelab lower rod. I also have the GT straight shaft but the Whites S-rod setup just feels better when hip mounting to me.

 

[Neil]

2 notes on the lower rods.

if your building your straight rod using the whites upper rods and ordering a new lower rod, order the excal lower rod as it already has the push botton on the side to match the whites rod.

I just weighed two lower rods:

whites tall man, no washers or bolt = 113.5 grams

minelab sov lower rod, no washers or bolt = 130.6

 

[Critterhunter]

Yea, the Whites tall man rod is about twice the length of the stock GT lower rod yet it's lighter thanks to carbon fiber.

I think it was Neil who turned me on to an easy way to mode the box clip. I used the Whites "heavy duty" armp cup with strap that Whites sells for $10. You take the clip that the stock arm cup normaly holes in place for the GT/Elite control box and drill out the two rivets on it. It's a two piece part and you won't need the upper part that normally slides into the slots on the stock arm cup. Once that's done I took the Whites arm cup and lined it and the lower box clip part up on the shaft. Use one rivet to both hold the Whites arm cup and the clip in place on the shaft, putting it through the old rivet hole area on the clip. Then put another rivet in the other rivet hole on the clip and you're all set. Now need for bolts or anything through the sides of the Whites arm cup. It hugs the shaft so well that I can't imagine it being any stiffer. So far with heavy abuse and even some water hunting it has no play in it.

You've got many options. You can use your own lighter gauge aluminum for the upper shaft. You can use the stock upper shaft from the GT. You can then use the normal Whites lower rod or the Tall Man rod and cut down the upper shaft. You can use a new upper shaft and the stock lower one. Endless possibilities. The lightest setup would be a lighter gauge aluminum for the upper shaft, cut down to match the Whites Tall Man rod. They only need to overlap a few inches for rigidity. Well, the lightest setup would be an upper carbon fiber shaft too or even an entire one piece shaft with no adjustability.

 

[Critterhunter]

Forgot to mention, the other motivation in using a Whites Tall Man or the normal lower shaft besides weight is cost. At $20 it's still cheaper than the lower Minelab fiberglass (heavy) stock shaft. In fact, you can buy the Whites lower shaft for $20 and the Whites "heavy duty" (looks like the regular one to me) arm cup for $10 and still spend less than buying the lower Minelab rod alone. For those reasons (cost/weight) why would anybody want to buy the lower Minelab shaft? The only reason I'd ever do that is if I was building a shaft for water hunting, in which case there is nothing more rigid, though the Whites works fine in the water. Since I obviously had the stock upper/lower shafts and arm cup from my GT laying around I put that back together to make my water rig. Perfectly logical choice I think. Regardless of what people use in the water make darn sure you drill a couple of holes just about the coil mount so the water drains out. I stuck a measuring tape inside the shaft until it bumped up against the coil mount inside there. That way I could precisely drill right above that thing to insure complete water drainage. One hole at the back of the shaft (facing you) would probably do and drilled here it will drain as you naturally hold the detector in hunting position, but just to be safe I drilled all the way through the shaft in this spot so a second drain hole is at the front as well, just to insure against one getting plugged. All the same, holes or not, when water hunting if the box is on the shaft be careful when laying the machine down. I've seen water run up the shaft and pour out over the control box. This is a particular problem with Whites machines.

 

[davjac]

I like the look of the Whites straight shaft and stock lower. Is that better balanced and lighter than stock? And I will get a whites arm cup.

 

[Critterhunter]

Pretty much any shaft including the Whites will be lighter than the stock Minelab shaft. Same deal with the lower shafts. Minelab uses fiberglass for the lower which is heavy, and they also use a heavier upper aluminum gage than pretty much any other manufacturer on the market. The inner extending window cleaning pole I used for my upper shaft is a much lighter gauge than even the Whites upper shafts, so I've maxed out my weight savings that way.

One important thing about building a shaft is getting everything straight. I'd drill the snap pin holes and hitch the lower shaft up to the upper one before drilling anything up top for the box clip/arm cup or sitting the hang grip in place. Throw the coil on the lower shaft and then with the upper shaft also on rest the control box, clip, or arm cup on the upper shaft where you want it and then drill for those. By eye it's easier to see that things are straight when the coil is on. Obviously if you are using an already built upper shaft like something stock then that's all together, so now you are trying to line up the lower shaft/coil. Mount the coil on the lower shaft and then slide it up into the upper shaft. Then mark the two snap pin holes to drill out that way.

 

[gear box]

So, Crazyman you said the White's "S" rod just feels better for you when hip mounting. I also hip mount mine but with the stock straight shaft. Would the minelab "S" rod be acceptable to you? I only hunt 3-5 hour's per trip but I'm not a spring chicken anymore and I begin to feel it in my shoulder and elbow. The "S" rod alway's comes to mind when I begin to get sore and frankly it just look's more comfortable. Most people seem to dislike the "S" rod and are more in favor of the straight shaft. Anybody got any thought's on this?
HH Gary

 

[crazyman]

Gary, I actually use the Minelab S-rod more than I do the Whites. I have the S-8 coil on the Minelab S-rod and that is the coil I use most. I have the 10 inch coil on the Whites S-rod which I don't use much. I use the same 2 rod setups with the GT that is in the picture below but without the Elite. The S-rod just feels better to me when hip mounting.

 

[Critterhunter]

Remember too when comparing the weight of the Whites tall man lower rod to the stock GT rod that the Whites is twice as long roughly, and further weight savings will be had if you cut down the now unneeded excessive length of the upper shaft.

 

[gear box]

Thank's Crazyman, I think I may give one a try. I'll look for one this winter.
HH Gary