Racer didn't miss the train .... or hunting with zero disc

[Cal_Cobra]

Took the Racer and F75 out to a little spot I've worked over the years, I've hunted it with every machine I've owned multiple times over the years (Sovereign, Etrac, F70, F75, Omega, AT Pro, etc), it's a small spot, no larger then about 50'x75' but has yielded dozens of old silver coins, Indian heads, tokens, Victorian era jewelry, etc. I'd work hard to eek out a green wheatie or an Indian head, but I hadn't pulled a silver coin from there in several years.

That dry spell ended on the Racers maiden voyage where it bagged a merc and a silver war nickle and two green wheaties with the stock 11" DD. Mind you before I detected the spot, I went over it with the F75, 11" DD coil, similar settings, and got nothing, yet 5 minutes later the Racer is getting coins.

The next time I went to this spot, I used the 5" OOR coil, set the sensitivity to 98, ID filter/disc at 10, and 3 tones (I find for fringe/iffy coins that 3 tone audio conveys more info then the 2 tone audio on the Racer at least when looking for coins).

On this hunt I dug an unprecedented (for this site) nine old coins:


1911-S wheatback
1916-S wheatback
1917-S wheatback
1919-S wheatback
1907 V nickle
1910 V nickle
1917 buffalo nickle
1921 buffalo nickle
1943-S silver war nickle.


This morning I reached into my bag of tricks, and decided to try running the Racer at zero disc, sensitivity @ 98, and 3 tones. There's not a lot of trash here, a small amount of iron, mineralization lights up about half the Racer pie. I got a set of Pivothead Video glasses a few weeks ago, and I was planning to video the digs live, and do pick a couple of signals to compare the Racer and F75, using the same settings, and same 5" DD coil. Unfortunately most of the video didn't work out as planned. I will say that when I compared signals with the F75, it reported the targets as iron.


It's hot as heck out here, by 7am it was already 85F, and quickly heading to tripple digits.

My first signal was a classic Racer high tone bouncer, blipping between 82-84, with a lot of mid tones and iron grunts thrown in. I dug down, and got a deep 1900 V Nickle! Nice, great way to start off the day. BTW I'm noticing that this thing LOVES nickles, and I'll happily dig nickles all day long.

The next signal was another iffy one, little bit of high tone, lot of mid tone and some iron, but doing the slow wiggle on the coil I could work up a repeatable signal. Dug down and got a deep childs ring. Cool, I like finding stuff like that.

The next target was really, really iffy, dug down and got half of a shell casing. Hit it the hole again with the pinpointer again, and found the butt of the shell casing. OK, well not too exciting, but there was a non-ferrous target there as it reported and it was a good 7" deep.

My next signal, was mostly a mid tone, with some high tones. Dug down and though I had found a wheel weight. I rubbed some more dirt off, and looked at it again, and it turned out to be a 1930's Tootsie Toy California Zephyr Toy train. Very cool, love finding stuff like that.

Dug a few junk targets, a flat piece of rusted iron about the size of a harmonica reed, an old ring tab, and a wad of some kind of foil.

Next I got a high tone bouncer, it was right next to an old plug of mine I could see. Dug down, and at about 8" deep, I saw a flash of silver go by as I'm loosening the dirt. Probed the hole with the pin-pointer and found a small silver disc, with a wreath and "one dime" staring back at me....OK, it's either got to be a seated or a barber....flip it over and .... it's a 1907 Barber dime!!!

My last target was a 1941S wheatback.

While today's hunt wasn't quite as spectacular in the terms of numbers of coins found compared to the last hunt, I finally hit a personal goal. It's been years since I pulled a Barber dime from this site, but I wanted to pull out one more Barber dime from this site. Long gone are the days of digging 2-3 Barbers from here, but if really felt good to get one more

I'll try the spot again tomorrow morning and again see if I can do a Racer vs F75 comparison....hopefully I can pull up a few more signals

Happy 4th of July!!

 

[squirrel1]

Some good info. Nice hunt with finds.

This statement, "Unfortunately most of the video didn't work out as planned. I will say that when I compared signals with the F75, it reported the targets as iron."

I've seen another make a similar comment when comparing signals between F75dst and Racer.

Cheers

 

[EtracTom-AdirondacksNY]

The Racer's frequency is I think 14 kHz and the F75 is 13 kHz so yes they like Nickels because of that. Nice finds and I'm trying the same things as you did with mine at a park I've hit for last 2 years with different detectors and larger coils.

 

[JimmyCT]

Great finds and report - Thank you.

 

[WestTn]

Your story was enough to convince me. My Makro Racer Pro Pack is coming next week.

 

[3RINGER]

Thx for the report Cal. Good luck on the next outing.

 

[Cal_Cobra]

The Racer's frequency is I think 14 kHz and the F75 is 13 kHz so yes they like Nickels because of that. Nice finds and I'm trying the same things as you did with mine at a park I've hit for last 2 years with different detectors and larger coils.

Oddly the F75 missed a ton of old V, buffalo and silver war nickels

Zero discrimination works amazingly well on the Racer

 

[Cal_Cobra]

Your story was enough to convince me. My Makro Racer Pro Pack is coming next week.

I think you're going to like it, just put the time in to learn it and stick with it and the finds will come. Also don't take it to the trashiest site you have right off the bat.

HH,
Brian

 

[kaolinwasher]

that sa great little coil, amazing finds.

 

[Low-Boy/LCPM]

Their is a skill level when hunting in iron and around iron. Some avoid it and hear the low buzz and move away. I slow down and try and get another higher tone. I like two tone because it jumps out at you. Then I switch to three tone to hear what the machine is telling me. Most of the time it gives a mid tone. When hunting for relics I want to dig almost everything. I have heard old rusty tops of cans give the same sound as a rusty gun or lock and I have found three guns and two locks last month. I love iron on the racer. I can get a tone in the 40s where on the deus it's in the 80-90 range. But I love for the iron I have been hunting the 5x10 coil. It is just the way to go for these sites and this fall I have heavy iron sites that I will take the 5" and the 5x10 with me.

 

[JimmyCT]

lowboy you seem to be having great success with the "new kid on the block." Amazing testimony with your finds. I see you have used some very fine detectors over the years on this very lot. What amazes me is seeing all the coins that all these detectors missed.

 

[EtracTom-AdirondacksNY]

Oddly the F75 missed a ton of old V, buffalo and silver war nickels

Cal_Cobra maybe the F75 had discrimination set like at 15 instead of 0 and maybe 3 or 4 tones instead of just one tone. When I use mine I found I prefer the single tone so I can hear all hits and the better hits are cleaner and stronger that way to me. I can run mine at 0 disc. and 99 sens that way. But I really like the feel and weight and options on this Racer so I'm leaving the small OOR coil on it for this reason and will go with stock coil on F-- for more ground coverage of large areas first.
Same for my Et--C and 11" coil and D--S withm 9" coil

 

[Cal_Cobra]

Oddly the F75 missed a ton of old V, buffalo and silver war nickels

Cal_Cobra maybe the F75 had discrimination set like at 15 instead of 0 and maybe 3 or 4 tones instead of just one tone. When I use mine I found I prefer the single tone so I can hear all hits and the better hits are cleaner and stronger that way to me. I can run mine at 0 disc. and 99 sens that way. But I really like the feel and weight and options on this Racer so I'm leaving the small OOR coil on it for this reason and will go with stock coil on F-- for more ground coverage of large areas first.
Same for my Et--C and 11" coil and D--S withm 9" coil

The F75 was running 0 disc on all three of the test hunts I posted about above. Both machines were set to 98 sens and 3-tones, so the test was apples to apples with the same sized coils.

Another test I did on Saturday at an old abandoned house that I've hunted once before (it was very stingy, got one merc, a couple of wheaties, and some clad). I tested the machines on various targets in the wild, leaving the Racer on 3-tones, 98 sens, and 0 disc (ID filter). The F75 started in 3H tones, 0 disc and 98 sens, both units running the 5" coil. When I'd get a target on one machine, I'd compare notes on the other machine, switching machines to be the lead machine to find the next target. After the first dozen target comparisons, I switched the F75 to 2F tones testing in both BP and DE modes. Unless the target was shallow (less then a few inches) I always found the Racer had better audio and TID. At this site, both machines correctly found and ID'd all targets dug, but the F75 was frequently jumpy on TID whereas the Racer locked on. Nothing was extremely deep, except for one oddball nail that BOTH machines ID'd as a dime signal, and it turned out to be an 8" deep nail (like a 1.5" long horse shoe nail).

To be honest, I feel that the F75 has more raw power, but the Racer has more finesse. At this point I feel that if I'm going for ultimate depth, I'm going to grab my F75. If I'm noodling around in trash and iron, I'm going to go with the Racer and 5" coil. In iron and trash sites, when you can work up a repeatable high tone on the Racer it's typically a good target, many times one that other machines can't even see. I need to get my hands on the 5x10 coil for fall/winter relic hunting.

HH,
Brian

 

[Low-Boy/LCPM]

get the 5x10 and you get the best of both worlds and don't be afraid to lower your gain to about 50-59 in two tone the deep targets will have a softer tone. I have tried the racer in heavy iron with a gain of 39 and found targets it's not about depth so much in heavy iron

 

[EtracTom-AdirondacksNY]

Cal_Cobra I went out yesterday and rehit a very small maybe 10'x10' spot I did the other day in disc.10 and 2 tone beach mode by accident meant to be in 3 tones mode but must have bumped it. This time I ran 3 tones mode with 0 disc. and went to 95 sensitivity and I found a 1955 wheatie I missed. I'm finding that if the tone when you center over it and sweep isn't clean and it has a bit of a buzz sound to it at the ends of the sweep it's junk or crunched can pieces or deep iron nails etc.
So now when I think I've got a fair hit I pinpoint it to find the center spot then resweep over that with the OOR coil in normal 3 tone mode and if the signal is buzzy and not clear and clean it's not a good target. I have dug just about every hit I've gotten in that small area to prove this out to myself and haven't been wrong yet. I went over this spot from a couple different directions too so no masking misses going slightly fast sweep speed and really slow sweep speed.

I also noted before that in either 2 or 3 tone and probably beach mode as well when I ran the factory 70 sens. and 10 disc. sometimes I got a deep faint good sounding hit with a bit of a buzz but no ID on the screen just those 2 dashed lines acrossed it. So I would turn up the gain/sensitivity to 90+ and then I would get an ID on the target and it was bouncing around in the 50's and was a fairly deep nickel maybe 7-8".
So running high gain/sens. like 90+ even though the disc is at 10 will uncover good targets then you could go back over that area from different directions and lower or no disc and see if anything was missed.

 

[Cal_Cobra]

EtracTom-AdirondacksNY - I've found that for me the biggest thing isn't even so much the buzz sound, it's if I can get the TID and audio into the coin range, because there could be other junk next to the coin that's giving that buzzy mixed metal audio. Most of the old coins I've dug at the spot I've been posting the Racer/F75 tests at were not great signals, but I was able to get a (mostly) repeatable high tone audio signal and TID into the 80's with slow concentrated coil sweeps. This is a spot I'm trying to clean out, so I've been hard core about digging iffy/fringe signals. I do have some mid tones left to tackle, I suspect they'll be trash, but who knows, perhaps a gold coin or ring is hiding out
I also suspect if we ever get any rain around here, that it'll light up some additional targets as has been the case in the past, but right now the ground there is bone dry.

HH,
Brian

 

[Low-Boy/LCPM]

For me the two tones tells me more and I don't worry about the iron buzz mixed in...that is part of how the reacer works..now I'm not a coin hunter but I love to find them and won't pass up any tone when relic hunting less it's a full buzz. I have switched to three tone on my video that I'm editing and then go back to two tone so you can hear what I hear. But the main thing is what works for you. I always switch to three tone just to hear what that tells me. A find the two tone tells me more. I like the buzz and mix of iron found more locks and guns in the last three weeks this way

 

[EtracTom-AdirondacksNY]

Low-Boy I will also dig relics when I uncover them but I'm mainly a coin hunter.
In 3 tone there is a bit of a buzz on the swing over a target if the target isn't good like a coin. I'll have to try it in 2 tone and see in VCO if it's the same.
I first used the machine in 2 tone VCO mode and liked it but have since given 3 tone mode a try and now that I know to listen to the hit for a clear clean high or mid tone sound it makes it easier to tell if the target is a good coin or not.

Yesterday I got a hit and the number was jumpy high 40's to low 60's but hit 54-56 a couple of times so I pinpointed and realized 2 targets extremely close together almost on top of each other so with a small 1"-2" sweep isolated the good sound from the buzzy sound and dug it and it was a nickel. Then I dug the other target and it was a small piece of a soda or beer can wadded up less that pinkie fingernail sized. Earlier that day I'd dug dozens of these targets and the buzz was there everytime but the nickel and wheatie hits were crisp clear and clean on a very narrow sweep over them amongst the trash.

Being you dig relics and some are iron I can see where you will get the buzz added with the hit signal but if you get a clean signal with no added slight buzz sound it may be a coin or spoon or jewelry or such an item.

 

[Cal_Cobra]

For me the two tones tells me more and I don't worry about the iron buzz mixed in...that is part of how the reacer works..now I'm not a coin hunter but I love to find them and won't pass up any tone when relic hunting less it's a full buzz. I have switched to three tone on my video that I'm editing and then go back to two tone so you can hear what I hear. But the main thing is what works for you. I always switch to three tone just to hear what that tells me. A find the two tone tells me more. I like the buzz and mix of iron found more locks and guns in the last three weeks this way

Lawrenzo two tone may be great for relic hunting, but for the little spot I've been testing the Racer at the 3-tone is working far, far better then 2-tone. I've tested both, and the three tone is where it's at for deep coin hunting. The buzz I'm referring to isn't iron, it's a raspy signal, not iron grunts, but an audio that indicates there's a non-pure non-ferrous target in the hole (usually co-located next to a coin). This site isn't really that iron infested, although it does have some iron and other junk, but it's not like some of the old carpet of nail sites I detect in the winter. Those sites will be really interesting to see how the Racer performs, and I suspect, given what I've seen thus far, that the Racer with the 5" coil is going to bring these sites to life

Because the site I've been trying to clean out isn't iron infested, nor too trashy, the Racer with the 5" coil, a high gain and zero disc has worked magic there, whereas lower gain settings and 2-tone have been non-performers there. At my carpet of nail sites, it may be a completely different story, but it's great to know I have the ability to lower the gain to get better see through, and perhaps 2-tone will out perform 3-tone at these sites, but personally I like that 3-tone audio grabs your attention when there's a high conductor, whereas (at least for me) 2-tone tends to get monotonous. That's not to say if it lights up my old sites I won't use it.

As well as the Racer is working out, I'm pretty excited to see what new machines that Makro will be releasing in the future. It's great they take their customer feedback to heart, and we see this feedback shine in their products.

HH,
Brian

 

[JFlynn]

Absolutely some great descriptions on what bad targets sound like. You R in the zone! It only gets better from here. A lot of people have used the machines and never even realized what you described and I've tried to several times then they sold it per they didn't learn it. If you dig EVERY hit just about with one of these machines you are going to dig a hole to china. They see so much more stuff than the other machines and let you decide what to dig or not. 3 tone is crazy good for coin and jewelry hunting and buttons too. Don't dismiss lead i 3 tone it'll nail it every time. 2 tone probably in a lot less trashy place would be good but in heavy trash it tells ya to investigate besting them all imo.