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Question for Mr Bill ( IDX mods. )
- Thread starter moseky
- Start date
Hey Monte and Bill,
I guess I should not have deleted my post to Mr. Bill, but after doing some reading on the modification forum, I realized I could get in touch with him just about anytime. Also, I apologize for my ignorance on the IDX having a VCO. I Have a friend with an IDX that has been modified by Mr. Bill and I really like It. I've been thinking about buying one when I can find the funds for an extra detector or I might even get rid of the CZ3D I recently purchased from Michaelnc. I could always ask Mr Bill to help me out with those mods later on. Anyway, my apologies to all. Regards
I guess I should not have deleted my post to Mr. Bill, but after doing some reading on the modification forum, I realized I could get in touch with him just about anytime. Also, I apologize for my ignorance on the IDX having a VCO. I Have a friend with an IDX that has been modified by Mr. Bill and I really like It. I've been thinking about buying one when I can find the funds for an extra detector or I might even get rid of the CZ3D I recently purchased from Michaelnc. I could always ask Mr Bill to help me out with those mods later on. Anyway, my apologies to all. Regards
Hey Monte,
Your response does seem biased, but I understand where you're coming from with it. We all have that in us whether we want to admit it or not.
I have been thinking about purchasing an IDX after using my friends that had been modified by Mr.Bill. It has impresssed me a lot with its depth and discriminating ability. I especially like the way it helps to ID those iron targets in the pinpoint mode. I don't dig near as much iron with the CZ, as I used to, but it will still get me every once in a while if I let my guard down.
I mentioned in my last post to you that I would like to have a good non-motion all metal mode. I really like the trigger pinpoint on the IDX, but there is something about that mode in this detector that I don't like. Is it the auto-tuning that is causing it to act the way it does? Could this be changed and also would it be possible to slow down the auto re-tune so you could hunt in the all-metal mode if I wanted to?
I appreciate any advice, and by the way I like White's detectors.
Regards,
Your response does seem biased, but I understand where you're coming from with it. We all have that in us whether we want to admit it or not.
I have been thinking about purchasing an IDX after using my friends that had been modified by Mr.Bill. It has impresssed me a lot with its depth and discriminating ability. I especially like the way it helps to ID those iron targets in the pinpoint mode. I don't dig near as much iron with the CZ, as I used to, but it will still get me every once in a while if I let my guard down.
I mentioned in my last post to you that I would like to have a good non-motion all metal mode. I really like the trigger pinpoint on the IDX, but there is something about that mode in this detector that I don't like. Is it the auto-tuning that is causing it to act the way it does? Could this be changed and also would it be possible to slow down the auto re-tune so you could hunt in the all-metal mode if I wanted to?
I appreciate any advice, and by the way I like White's detectors.
Regards,
BuckeyeBrad
New member
PM me your answer if you choose. 
BuckeyeBrad
New member
since I've read a lot of your posts over the years and they always seem quite complete with no loose ends. This one seems to be different. I see nowhere that you mention about using the salt/enhanced mode switch for it's intended purpose as well as just to check ID's especially since you were having so much trouble. You've also mentioned over the years that when you get a detector that doesn't seem to perform up to expectations, you usually try another (several) example(s) of the same model to see if there is any variation from the first "problematic" example. And last but not least, I can't understand why you wouldn't have checked with the service dept. and did whatever necessary to confirm the particular unit in question was operating to spec (or not). Please don't hear this as ragging you as that's not my intent at all. It just appears (given the info from your post) that you very well likely got a unit that wasn't operating properly and you assumed it was. BTW, my personal experience with the 3-D was significantly different than what you had. 
"This one seems to be different."... Yes, it was as I looked back on it. I was pressed for time and tried to shorten my reply, but I guess it might have been a little 'out-of-character' for me. Sorry.
"I see nowhere that you mention about using the salt/enhanced mode switch for it's intended purpose as well as just to check ID's especially since you were having so much trouble."... I didn't mention it, I guess, because I had stated that I was trying to see if the CZ-3D's new extra ID slot and audio might help me, especially for finding older nickels and such. Perhaps I just presumed that others would know I was trying out the Enhanced mode.
I did, as you note, forget to add my results with the Salt mode. I naturally tried the Salt Mode with the CZ-3D and side-by-side with the CZ-5. I found the CZ-5 in Salt mode to have slightly less sensitivity, but otherwise provided similar ID and audio as in the normal function. But with the CZ-3D I owned, the Salt mode produced different results from the Enhanced mode ... HOWEVER, it NEVER gave me proper performance ... NOR did it work similar to the CZ-5 as was suggested that it would.
"You've also mentioned over the years that when you get a detector that doesn't seem to perform up to expectations, you usually try another (several) example(s) of the same model to see if there is any variation from the first "problematic" example."... I only owned the one, but I did compare it with one at a dealer's shop and their seemed to be similar. Since that time, the dealer quit handling Fishers. There are not a lot of Fisher users or dealers around these parts and I can only afford to buy/sell/trade within reason to check things out.
To me, the biggest 'problem' with a unit like the CZ-3D, or any of the CZ series, is that they rely way too much on the internal calibration to establish the parameters for each of the notch segments. Too much internal calibration and not enough external operator control, at least that's my opinion.
"And last but not least, I can't understand why you wouldn't have checked with the service dept. and did whatever necessary to confirm the particular unit in question was operating to spec (or not)."...It was brand new right out of the box. I used it afield enough to evaluate, and it functioned almost exactly like another brand new one out of the box a dealer had. At the time, that was enough for me.
"Please don't hear this as ragging you as that's not my intent at all. It just appears (given the info from your post) that you very well likely got a unit that wasn't operating properly and you assumed it was. BTW, my personal experience with the 3-D was significantly different than what you had."... I did feel that it wasn't operating up-to-spec. At leas , it wasn't operating nearly as well as the CZ-5, which is the model I had entertained getting at the time because I had enjoyed ample success with earlier CZ-5's.
No, I didn't assume it was operating properly. I knew that, from the half-dozen people I had been in touch with around the country and personal CZ experience, what I had was a detector that might have been rushed onto the marker by a company that needed to get something new and exciting out there. It's all part of business.
Of those I communicated with from various parts of the US and one in Europe, all had a fair amount of experience with the CZ-5. Only one said that the CZ-3D seemed to work as well as the CZ-5, or maybe slightly better on nickels. The other five people all complained about the same things I was experiencing.
As I understood it, two had sought to have their units serviced, and the returned units worked about like the did when sent back. Only one of those half-dozen people told me they figured they were satisfied enough to keep the 3D. The other five were either going to get another CZ-5, or get a competitor's models.
I got feeling like I was being too negative in that post and I often do not do that. Oh, I know I do on occasion because I state my honest opinions. In this case, I just got in a hurry and omitted some things I should have included.
By the way,, I have since heard from a couple of people who have had reasonably good success for the CZ-3D, and to them (and you) I say congratulations! It's always good to have a detector in your arsenal that works and provides the performance you would like to haver.
All the best to you,
Monte
"I see nowhere that you mention about using the salt/enhanced mode switch for it's intended purpose as well as just to check ID's especially since you were having so much trouble."... I didn't mention it, I guess, because I had stated that I was trying to see if the CZ-3D's new extra ID slot and audio might help me, especially for finding older nickels and such. Perhaps I just presumed that others would know I was trying out the Enhanced mode.
I did, as you note, forget to add my results with the Salt mode. I naturally tried the Salt Mode with the CZ-3D and side-by-side with the CZ-5. I found the CZ-5 in Salt mode to have slightly less sensitivity, but otherwise provided similar ID and audio as in the normal function. But with the CZ-3D I owned, the Salt mode produced different results from the Enhanced mode ... HOWEVER, it NEVER gave me proper performance ... NOR did it work similar to the CZ-5 as was suggested that it would.
"You've also mentioned over the years that when you get a detector that doesn't seem to perform up to expectations, you usually try another (several) example(s) of the same model to see if there is any variation from the first "problematic" example."... I only owned the one, but I did compare it with one at a dealer's shop and their seemed to be similar. Since that time, the dealer quit handling Fishers. There are not a lot of Fisher users or dealers around these parts and I can only afford to buy/sell/trade within reason to check things out.
To me, the biggest 'problem' with a unit like the CZ-3D, or any of the CZ series, is that they rely way too much on the internal calibration to establish the parameters for each of the notch segments. Too much internal calibration and not enough external operator control, at least that's my opinion.
"And last but not least, I can't understand why you wouldn't have checked with the service dept. and did whatever necessary to confirm the particular unit in question was operating to spec (or not)."...It was brand new right out of the box. I used it afield enough to evaluate, and it functioned almost exactly like another brand new one out of the box a dealer had. At the time, that was enough for me.
"Please don't hear this as ragging you as that's not my intent at all. It just appears (given the info from your post) that you very well likely got a unit that wasn't operating properly and you assumed it was. BTW, my personal experience with the 3-D was significantly different than what you had."... I did feel that it wasn't operating up-to-spec. At leas , it wasn't operating nearly as well as the CZ-5, which is the model I had entertained getting at the time because I had enjoyed ample success with earlier CZ-5's.
No, I didn't assume it was operating properly. I knew that, from the half-dozen people I had been in touch with around the country and personal CZ experience, what I had was a detector that might have been rushed onto the marker by a company that needed to get something new and exciting out there. It's all part of business.
Of those I communicated with from various parts of the US and one in Europe, all had a fair amount of experience with the CZ-5. Only one said that the CZ-3D seemed to work as well as the CZ-5, or maybe slightly better on nickels. The other five people all complained about the same things I was experiencing.
As I understood it, two had sought to have their units serviced, and the returned units worked about like the did when sent back. Only one of those half-dozen people told me they figured they were satisfied enough to keep the 3D. The other five were either going to get another CZ-5, or get a competitor's models.
I got feeling like I was being too negative in that post and I often do not do that. Oh, I know I do on occasion because I state my honest opinions. In this case, I just got in a hurry and omitted some things I should have included.
By the way,, I have since heard from a couple of people who have had reasonably good success for the CZ-3D, and to them (and you) I say congratulations! It's always good to have a detector in your arsenal that works and provides the performance you would like to haver.
All the best to you,
Monte
BuckeyeBrad
New member
n/t
BuckeyeBrad
New member
You saved me from having to type a nearly identical "wrap up".
A
Anonymous
Guest
as hes trashed the 3D every oppurtunity he get probably to make all his freebie x-terrables look better. my 3D work great is covered for life + does every thing its supposed to.
later.Hondo
later.Hondo
Honestly! Nothing can be more frustrating that to have a detector that doesn't work well, except maybe to have some advertising and associated hype that suggests it is a superb detector with unbeatable performance. ANY detector is 'beatable' in some application because there isn't a perfect detector made.
As for the CZ-3D, I haven't said that every unit is crap, just the one I had, and the ones a dealer friend had we compared. I have heard from a few CZ-3D users, very few mind you, who like what it does, but I have heard from far more Fisher loyalists who have used several of the CZ models, got and tried a CZ-3D, and then went back to a CZ-5, if they stayed with Fisher.
As for the Minelab X-Terra, I addressed th am as I would any other make or model. I have had free detectors from about a half dozen manufacturers, and in ever case I called them as they were.
I believe I was the first to really complain about the way too-long lower rod with the X-Terra's. I also complained that they did the GB numeric referencing backwards to what would be normal thinking. If I wasn't the first, I have been one of the more vocal all along that they erred by not complimenting a new-release multi-purpose detector with a smaller coil. I feel that was their worst mistake! Oh, and let's not forget that I pointed out that the X-Terra 30 just doesn't work worth a hoot in my area or in most of the higher mineralized sites, and that's due to a too-negative factory-designed GB reference.
I'm pointed out that the open coils are tough to use in many sites with short, stiff weeds, and the same goes for the Fishers and Tesoro's and others with the spoked-type coil.
One issue with the CZ-3D for me and many others, as well as the other CZ's is that they could be lightened up and better balanced, and that is one thing I will give Minelab credit for accomplishing with the X-Terra series.
As I have stated, however, most of my hunting this year has been with my modified White's Classic III SL and IDX Pro, an XL Pro, now a Matrix M6, and my Shadow X5. Why? Because they DO have a smaller coil that is necessary for 90+% of the hunting I do, and I have stated that in a few posts on mine lab-related Forums.
If the 3D works for you, great. It didn't for me, but it didn't for me. I am sure that the problem was related to poor calibration, and I don't give much attention to a Lifetime warranty if all that means is I am going to have to pay for shipping to and fro for life until they get it right. It should have been right out of the box.
Monte
As for the CZ-3D, I haven't said that every unit is crap, just the one I had, and the ones a dealer friend had we compared. I have heard from a few CZ-3D users, very few mind you, who like what it does, but I have heard from far more Fisher loyalists who have used several of the CZ models, got and tried a CZ-3D, and then went back to a CZ-5, if they stayed with Fisher.
As for the Minelab X-Terra, I addressed th am as I would any other make or model. I have had free detectors from about a half dozen manufacturers, and in ever case I called them as they were.
I believe I was the first to really complain about the way too-long lower rod with the X-Terra's. I also complained that they did the GB numeric referencing backwards to what would be normal thinking. If I wasn't the first, I have been one of the more vocal all along that they erred by not complimenting a new-release multi-purpose detector with a smaller coil. I feel that was their worst mistake! Oh, and let's not forget that I pointed out that the X-Terra 30 just doesn't work worth a hoot in my area or in most of the higher mineralized sites, and that's due to a too-negative factory-designed GB reference.
I'm pointed out that the open coils are tough to use in many sites with short, stiff weeds, and the same goes for the Fishers and Tesoro's and others with the spoked-type coil.
One issue with the CZ-3D for me and many others, as well as the other CZ's is that they could be lightened up and better balanced, and that is one thing I will give Minelab credit for accomplishing with the X-Terra series.
As I have stated, however, most of my hunting this year has been with my modified White's Classic III SL and IDX Pro, an XL Pro, now a Matrix M6, and my Shadow X5. Why? Because they DO have a smaller coil that is necessary for 90+% of the hunting I do, and I have stated that in a few posts on mine lab-related Forums.
If the 3D works for you, great. It didn't for me, but it didn't for me. I am sure that the problem was related to poor calibration, and I don't give much attention to a Lifetime warranty if all that means is I am going to have to pay for shipping to and fro for life until they get it right. It should have been right out of the box.
Monte
Mike in Tn
New member
Monte, I agree 100%. I bought a brand new CZ-3D and was very frustrated with it from the start. I was very disappointed with the unit and I went back to the CZ-5. Which in my opinion is a much better machine. Deeper and more sensitive. Another thing about the 3D was the audio. My ears are very sensitive to certain frequencies. And, I found after about 20 to 30 minutes with the audio frequencies of the 3D. I had to put it away and go with another unit. It wasn't just uncomfortable to my ears. It literally was very painful to me. As for Hondo, if it works for you great but, for my own personal experience. I would not recommend the 3D to anyone.