Question for Monte.

[D&P-OR]

Monte-----I meant to ask you this question when you came to visit but somehow didn't do it.-----Sooo, I'll ask it now---who knows---maybe some other members will benefit from your answer also.-------As I understand it, the Outlaw was built off of the Bandito 2 micromax platform.-------What is the reason you choose to keep the Bandito 2 micromax in your arsenal instead of the Outlaw?------What do you see in performance difference(s) in these two detectors?-------Patsy & I so much enjoyed you & Rikkis visit to our home, had a great visit.-----BTW, to those that don't know---Rikki is Montes sweetheart dog---she's a doll & SO WELL behaved! ----------Del

 

[Monte]

Monte-----I meant to ask you this question when you came to visit but somehow didn't do it.-----Sooo, I'll ask it now---who knows---maybe some other members will benefit from your answer also.-------As I understand it, the Outlaw was built off of the Bandito 2 micromax platform.

That's correct as I understand it as well, reading a comment that Vince Gifford said it was based on the Bandido II µMAX with only a few changes.

What is the reason you choose to keep the Bandito 2 micromax in your arsenal instead of the Outlaw?

Possibly because I spent a lot of time with the entire Bandido series and felt very comfortable with the Bandido II µMAX, and, for me, I like the Bandido II µMAX, or even the first two Bandido series models, much more because of the audio tone for my impaired hearing. I also prefer the 'original' Bandido's slow auto-tune, but still prefer the toggle-selected Normal [size=small](manual re-tune)[/size] or fast Auto-Tune selectors of the other Bandido's to the pushbutton selector of the Outlaw. I had two Outlaws and didn't like the first one as I had problems with the push-button's dual-function action, just as I did on two that I have sampled since the Outlaw's first release.

There are a couple of very noteworthy things about the Outlaw that I do like. One is that it uses English, which I consider to be the USA's native language, for a title. I like that, just as they have used on many models in their line-up [size=small](Cutlass, Cutlass II, µMAX Cutlass, Cutlass II µMAX, Deep Search IV, Deep Search VI, Deep Search VII, Euro Sabre, Golden Sabre, Golden Sabre Plus, Golden Sabre II, Golden µMAX, Outlaw, Piranha, Royal Sabre, Sand Shark, Sidewinder, µMAX Sidewinder, Silver Sabre, Silver Sabre Plus, Silver Sabre II, Silver Sabre µMAX, Silver µMAX, Stingray, Stingray II, Tigar Shark ... and I might have missed a few)[/size]. Many more than a lot of people think, presuming most have an Hispanic title. Wrong.

Additionally, another thing I really like about the Outlaw is that is doesn't use the µMAX label, and isn't referred to as a [size=small]micro[/size]MAX model, even though it is in that same small housing. There are several terms used in many manufacturer's labels/names that annoys me, such as an over-use of the term 'PRO' or 'Professional', the term 'Plus,' and especially the 'µ' in MAX which is a symbol for '[size=small]micro[/size]' and has been all too often typed as a lower or upper case 'u' or 'U', and pronounced YOU instead of 'micro.' Jack Gifford had a nice idea when first used, but too many people never learned what it is or how to say it. Annoying!

So I was pleased they used an American English name and dropped the [size=small]micro[/size]MAX term in the name. A nice move on Tesoro's part.

What do you see in performance difference(s) in these two detectors?

Performance difference? Well, they are essentially the same, if the audio tone is hearable by the operator and if they are also comfortable with the push-button and re-tune/auto-tune functions. There is the subtle operating frequency difference, but it doesn't seem to matter much.

Both of them have a Threshold-based All Metal mode and use the ED-120 range Discriminate circuitry so, from a performance perspective, they will work about the same.

Patsy & I so much enjoyed you & Rikkis visit to our home, had a great visit.-----BTW, to those that don't know---Rikki is Montes sweetheart dog---she's a doll & SO WELL behaved! ----------Del

Yes, Miss Rikki is one of the best dogs anyone could hope to own. She just turned 1½ so she's essentially still in that 'puppy' stage, but other than getting excited to see people and critters, she is definitely a 'keeper!.'

Thanks for the visits, the input on the detector I left for you to check out, and also not happening to stumble upon those two choice Tesoro's I nabbed last month there in Baker City. The best $400 investment I have made in practically un-used detectors, ever!

Monte

 

[Hombre]

Hi Del...

..I'll make it short and to the point, I did the field test on the Outlaw for Tesoro. Rusty loaned me one out of his inventory because he didn't want a biased field test. I want to emphasize this point, I did not get a free metal detector for doing the field test for them. I liked the Outlaw so much that a year later I bought a new one from Rusty.

...About the RETUNE button, I tried as much as I could to make it malfunction, it just did not happen to the one I had. I had read about the problems some had with it, so I made a point to use it often. I played with it every time I got out with the Outlaw, there are a few tricks you can do with this new feature, like detuning while in the middle position of the Mode switch in the all-metal mode. You can shrink the all-metal signal down to the size of a dime with the RETUNE button by bringing the coil just off of the center of the target and pushing the button all the way in, fully release it.. then go back over the target. Just be sure to lift the coil in the air away from the ground and fully press the RETUNE button again to restore signal strength before changing back to Disc. mode , this is where some people got confused with this feature.

...One other thing I like about the Outlaw is that the Disc. circuit reminds me of the older original Bandido ll, the Outlaw behaves better in the iron than the Bandido ll µMAX with less popping and spitting while discriminating the nails.

 

[D&P-OR]

Thanks for your responses Monte & Randy--appreciate it.---------Monte--those two mint Tesoros here in Baker City was meant for you to have them--I'm happy for you that you got them.-----Now if you can just find that mint El Dorado---right?-------I think there's a CHOICE Eldo in your future! ----------That was interesting what you were saying about the Outlaw retune button Randy----------------Del

 

[Monte]

About the RETUNE button, I tried as much as I could to make it malfunction, it just did not happen to the one I had. I had read about the problems some had with it, so I made a point to use it often. I played with it every time I got out with the Outlaw,...

One I borrowed and one the Distributors had that I checked out worked as intended. Another that I borrowed and the first Outlaw I had both got glitchy with the Retune/Function-Change, two-position Pushbutton. Sometimes too touchy as if the button itself had a problem and it wasn't easy to work the half-pressed function, and at times it just didn't know for sure what it was supposed to be doing. Dumb button!

The original idea of having a Pinpoint pushbutton feature was fine, such as on the Silver Sabre µMAX or current Cibola. The original idea of using a simple toggle switch to select the search mode, All Metal or Discrimination, was just fine. The addition of the Normal [size=small](manual Retune)[/size] or Auto [size=small](for Auto-Tune)[/size] toggle selector was also just fine. The Outlaw was an attempt to combine these multiple functions in one two-position Pushbutton control and, honestly, I didn't care for it and at least a dozen of my Tesoro-loyal friends who checked out the Outlaws also didn't care for it. Like me, they rely on the good-old favorites with toggle switches which work just fine.

... there are a few tricks you can do with this new feature, like detuning while in the middle position of the Mode switch in the all-metal mode. You can shrink the all-metal signal down to the size of a dime with the RETUNE button by bringing the coil just off of the center of the target and pushing the button all the way in, fully release it.. then go back over the target.

That's no different from conventional manual Detuning using the Normal Retune function in the All Metal mode. Simple and efficient, without a possible button defect/performance issue.

Just be sure to lift the coil in the air away from the ground and fully press the RETUNE button again to restore signal strength before changing back to Disc. mode, this is where some people got confused with this feature.

I do not have that problem with ANY of my other Tesoro models and it IS a problem with the Outlaw. Many times I have heard from people who noted a lack of Sensitivity and performance with their Outlaw when switching between search modes, all because of the design glitch that requires a 'Retune' to reset the original operating Sensitivity level for the Discriminate mode.

One other thing I like about the Outlaw is that the Disc. circuit reminds me of the older original Bandido ll, the Outlaw behaves better in the iron than the Bandido ll µMAX with less popping and spitting while discriminating the nails.

Now on that I will kind of agree, but it's only sort-of-similar. I worked the Outlaws against my 'original' Bandido and a Bandido II µMAX I had and didn't find it better than the 'original' and really closer in performance in iron trash handling to the Bandido II µMAX.

In the end it all becomes a matter of personal preference. I know people who don't like the 'original' Bandido or Bandido II because they are not as light as the Bandido II µMAX or Outlaw, regardless of how well they perform. The Outlaw is generally an 'OK' detector, unless you have a glitch, or you just happen to not like it as well as some other Tesoro model. I'm in the latter group.

Monte

 

[Hombre]

Monte..

...If you are having problems with the RETUNE button, you do not have to use it, just use the 3 position Mode switch. I always power up the Outlaw with the Mode switch set to AUTO as that is the all-metal mode to ground balance with. Then after ground balancing, I switch to Disc. mode to hunt with, using Min. disc, setting. It does away with any so called "glitches"on the Outlaw.