New Video- 10" Tornado, SEF 12x10, 13" Ultimate, & Sun Ray S-5 Trying To See Clad Dimes Masked In Various Ways Such As Under An Elevated Nail, & Tryin

[Critterhunter]

Give me a bit to get the link going for the video, as I have to fix a few things first here that always seem to creep up. But for now here's some still shots of the various nail masking tests performed with all 4 coils, along with 3 old mineralized red bricks stacked on on top of each other to try to mask a dime via mineralization. Modern red bricks I've tested don't seem to be mineralized like this, or perhaps not as badly. I suspect the old bricks used to be made with red iron rich clay or something else containing a lot of minerals, where as maybe modern bricks are just dyed to look red like they used to?

Either way, testing a coin through mineralized red bricks can at least give some hint as to certain coils being better able to handle mineralization. I saw this test done with an MXT (link posted to that video in my video) using a coil known for handling mineralization to see how it compared to an SEF coil, and the SEF coil could see the coin while the other coil couldn't. He used 1 brick. I figured I'd start with 3 being that the BBS machines (Sovereign/Excal) are known for handling the worst of mineralization and still get amazing depth, not to mention running smooth on such mineralized soils or sands. I figured with 3 bricks it would give all 4 of these coils a real challenge to show what they are made of, and I would take off 1 brick at a time in the video until each coil could hear the coin (if they could...hint...hint).

The video is very short, as I edited it down and all 4 coils are shown on each masked item at once before moving on to the next challenge. That way you have the results of each fresh in your mind as you see each coil do each test together before moving on to the next test.

So for now here's the still shots for a better more detailed view of the masking obstacle course I ran these coils through...

All 4 nail masking tests in one shot. The nail by it's self is to prove on video that these identical nails are not sounding off by themselves and not really the dimes. On video with each coil I sweep that nail first alone to show it's silent and then move on from there...
[attachment 244918 4nails.JPG]
A little closer of the first 3 nail masking tests...
[attachment 244917 3nails.JPG]
The elevated nail masking test. This is a side shot perspective so you can better see that there is distance between the nail on top of a piece of clear plastic and the dime below it. In the video you'll see the dime is directly below the nail. Detection fields can't see past the first object they hit, but with a sharp DD line as you sweep you can be off to the side of the nail and thus it entirely out of the detection field so that the DD line can see the top surface of the coin to it's side away from the nail. With a quality DD coil and a sharp DD line this test is possible, but remember that if any part of that nail is anywhere in the field even far off to the side of the coil it'll never see that dime. That's what makes it such a good test of both a detector's ability and that of how sharp a coil's field is...
[attachment 244919 ElevatedNail.JPG]
The 3 bricks used to test the coils abilities to cope with mineralization...
[attachment 244920 3bricks.JPG]
And a better picture of the bottom brick, because in the video it might only look like there are 2 but I always started with 3 for each coil...
[attachment 244921 Lastbrick.JPG]

I'll get the video link up after I fix a few minor issues...

 

[Critterhunter]

OK, hopefully this thing will work without giving me any more issues. Youtube can be funky with some of it's editing functions and what looks like it's working right when viewed while editing can have a few minor tweaks that need fixed when viewed from the normal user.

There are two long pauses at the start of the video so you can read some text, but just remember that if you are done reading you don't have to wait for the pause to end. Just hit play and it will continue on. Also, the rest of the pauses past the first initial two at the start of the video are only minor very short ones while captions are displayed as to how the coils are doing.

You DO get to hear the coils responses in this video via the built in speaker on the Sovereign (as lousy as the audio is through that stupid thing), because unlike my prior two videos it wasn't important for me to wear headphones in this one while testing stuff.

I'm working on a fix for future videos where I can wear headphones and yet you'll hear MUCH better audio via not using the built in Sovereign's speaker, but rather my pocket camcorder will be fed audio directly from a splitter on the speaker jack.

That terrible built in speaker on the Sovereign I'm sure has cost it some sales if people watch all the Sovereign videos out there and think the audio sounds that flat, harsh, and grainy and such. We all know the audio on the Sovereign is among the best in terms of detail, smoothness, and richness of tones and content, but the built in speaker makes it sound like a total dog nothing like what it really is like with headphones.

http://youtu.be/bKesj7KjcXY

 

[Tin Fin]

CH,

I have to ask; What were the settings on your GT for this test, did the settings stay the same for each coil, or did you end up changing sensitivity/ground balance, manual/auto mode, or anything else between coils? Methodology would dictate ground balancing each coil for the soil with the nail tests, and then re balancing for the mineralized bricks on that soil. Change one variable at a time. Otherwise, well done.

 

[Critterhunter]

A small disclaimer about air testing and what appears to be (or not be) in the video. We all know that air testing in no way accounts for all the variables of actual in ground hunting, so don't take what you see as fact set in stone. Just the same, I feel some aspects of it can be an educational experience in certain respects and can hint to things that should be watched for in actual hunting. The way I see it, air testing can give you a heads up on what to look for in a coil's abilities, and to test that further in the field as you hunt in contrast with your other coils. It could very well be that in actual "ground" conditions certain coils do much better than they did in the air tests compared to others and end up taking the clear lead on certain aspects of performance. What didn't do well in an air test might do the "best" of the whole lot in the ground. I look at it as just one more tool to explorer a machine and it's coils abilities in a different "more visual" way. To me it's just another interesting aspect of this hobby to explorer when I can't commit to a actual hunt for the day.

 

[Ron from Michigan]

Critter,interesting video.Thanks Ron

 

[Critterhunter]

Thanks Tin Fin and Ron.

Tin Fin...

There is no ground balance to set on the Sovereign for discrimination mode. You only set ground balanced for all metal fixed mode by first setting it (pumping the coil or sweeping around) in track first, but discrimination and pin point use no ground balance. The FBS and BBS machines handle ground balance in a very unique way that involves no setting, and it isn't auto ground tracking like on other detectors that can track out targets at depth.

Far as other settings- All the same for all the coils. Sensitivity at full blast due to a low EMI environment and all coils were stable, except the Ultimate had a slight here and there chatter, but that's the edge of stability I ride a coil, so I felt it only fair to keep it at that for it as well even though it was a hair unstable where as the others were rock solid. Noise band 2. Discrimination and notch at zero. Iron Mask ON mode. Threshold obviously can't be adjusted to a whisper using the external speaker of the Sovereign and no headphones, but not really important for this kind of test so I just left it static for all 4 coils. Threshold mode of course and not silent search.

 

[Jack Flynn]

Dang Critter, good video, you show are long winded, I thought something was wrong with the video I had to restart it so many times then I realized you wanted us to read the video. LOL.......... Looks good and interesting. You need to get a Deus.................

 

[Tin Fin]

It might be kind of interesting to see this same thing done in all metal mode too; you might get through three, or four bricks that way. I wasn't disputing your methods or what air testing shows, was just curious about the set up itself.

 

[Critterhunter]

Jack, I'm just a stickler for details. Always had a very technical mind that way where I want specifics when I investigate something and not just some "look what my coils did" type of description when I read/investigate stuff. That's why the video says right at the top to hit play to skip any pauses. There are only two pauses at the start of the video with any kind of length to them. All the rest of the pauses throughout it right before each test are like only 3 seconds or so just so people can read the title of the next test or what I'm doing here.

 

[Critterhunter]

Tin Fin, I've already just did a video that I haven't posted yet where I'm testing all 4 coils on fine gold jewlery (various thickness gold chains, small earrings, and a small gold cross). I wanted to find out a few things- A) is any of the 3 modes (disc, PP, all metal fixed) deeper. B) are any of the 3 modes more sensitive in those modes to fine gold, C) to see if any of the coils are deeper than the other coils, and D) to also see if any of the coils are more sensitive to fine gold than the other 3.

The video is a nightmare to edit because of all 3 modes testing all 4 coils on all 7 targets, so I've been working on it here and there. Sooner or later it'll get finished editing and I'll post it. I think it's going to shock a few people if what I suspect is right, but to tell you the truth I'm not real sure about that because I lost track of time and space while testing all 4 of those coils in all 3 modes on all those targets. I just have a vague impression of what I think happened but have to watch the video and edit it thru to see if I'm right about a few things.

 

[Critterhunter]

By the way, for those who didn't watch the video, I'm really let down by the S-5 in terms of left/right separation and handling the mineralized bricks, but of course in terms of length wise separation it's still going to do better than a larger coil, but that can be got around by gridding at two 90 degree angles with a larger coil to some extent. Either way, I'm trading it off for a 8" (actual size 7 & 1/4") Tornado because many seem to love that coil for working dead parks due to it's excellent separation being a small coil and yet it gets stellar depth. I'm suspecting the 8" Tornado has a much sharper DD line than the seemingly big and fuzzy one on the S-5, just based on the field reports of those using the Tornado in high trash areas. I think what the S-5 did (or should I say didn't do) was the most shocking part of the testing to me.

Conversly, I was well pleased to see how well the Ultimate did in left/right separation, holding it's own with the 10" Tornado and 12x10...But I still suspect the Ultimate *might* not separate as well just due to it's physical size and also due to the unique shape of the SEF coils which really compresses the width of the DD line beyond belief. That said, the Ultimate hasn't shown me anything yet that it couldn't separate that the SEF could.

I'm very impressed with the Ultimate thus far, and for sure it gives you an even more easy feeling of coverage than the nice improvement the 12x10 does in that respect over the stock 10" Tornado. It's just a little bit easier to cover the ground in front of you faster so as not to hold back your steps as much compared to the 12x10, but as said the 12x10 is still a noticable improvement in that respect over the stock 10" coil.

I should also add that the Ultimate is one rock solid non-finicky coil like the 10" Tornado and 12x10. While the Ultimate appears to be a tiny more unstable at the same sensitivity settings as the 12x10 some times, for sure it's still one rock solid stable coil that isn't going to drive you nuts with stability or chatter. While I haven't used it on a salt water beach, at least in my mineralized beaches and land sites it's a very stable coil. Just seems a little more prone to EMI than the 12x10, thus usually not allowing quite as high of a sensitivity setting, but in terms of handling mineralized ground it seems *perhaps* just as able as the 12x10 thus far to me. And that's saying a lot, because the 12x10 is the pinacle of stability in the worst of grounds. Just don't know yet if the Ultimate will see as deep in mineralized soils/sands as the 12x10, because I found in my soil a larger coil (in this case the 15x12) was taking in too much ground signal and so washing out target quality at depth, even though the coil appeared perfectly stable.