Need comparison of CZ21 to Excal in saltwater

[rbdigger]

I am looking for information from those of you who have direct experience with both the CZ21 and Minelab Excal in salt water. I am waffling between getting a CZ21 and an Excal. I know the Excals find gold and silver and avoid iron well as I have hunted with friends who have them. The negatives of that machine as far as I can tell are the poor customer service, a tendency to not be very durable, and the iron null slowing down the recovery speed. I have no experience with the CZ21, but they appear to have good customer service and good durability. However, do they GB without a problem in salt and will they find the gold and silver rings and other jewelry at the rate of the Excal?

Please let me know what you have found regarding the pos and negs of both machines and in comparison to each other.

Thanks.

 

[scubadetector]

I used my CZ-21 in Florida for 3 weeks. I had absolutly no problem with it. I hope Gulf Hunter gives his 2

 

[therover]

I have used both CZ's ( CZ6a, CZ70, CZ20) and an Excal on the salt water beaches in NJ. For what it's worth, performance wise and sensitivity wise, to me there was not much difference at all. The main differences in my opinion, between the 2 machines has to do with personal preferences.

Do you want an automatic ground balancing unit ( Excal) or a manual gb unit ( CZ) ?

Do you like DD coils ( Excal) or concentric coils (CZ) ?

Multiple tones ( Excal) or 3 tones ( CZ ).

Do you want the unit to null on iron in discriminate mode ( Excal) or do you want to hear iron ( CZ) ?

Other differences include the pin point operation ( which is pretty much useless in my book when beach hunting), the configuration when hip mounting if one so desires, warranty, customer service, etc.

Bottom line in my book is the units in terms of performance are neck n neck.....it's the features of each unit that are very different, and it depends on what you want to have when hunting.

I am used to CZ's and since I have been using them for 20+ years, and they never let me down and have found me 1000's of cool targets, they are the ones I prefer on the beach.

 

[rbdigger]

Thanks so much for the information so far. I really appreciate it. Hopefully some additional people will chime in. Can never get too much good information before making a decision.

 

[Gerry]

As an owner of an Excal and a new owner of the CZ 21 which I am about to use for the first time shortly, your question about ground balancing is worth noting. Guys who have used both how easy is the CZ to GBalance, as per the owners manual which method do you use?

Gerry

 

[therover]

I use the bobbing method since that way you can fine tune the GB to dead on or slightly positive or negative depending on the conditions.

 

[scubadetector]

I put my ground all the way to 10 and my sensitivity as high as I can. If I get too many false beeps I turn them both down a hair till I get stability. I am sorry, I was in Florida about 5 years ago. I don't remember at all what I had my machine set at. That is the only time I ever detected salt water. My ground always stays at 10 in fresh water.

 

[rbdigger]

Still looking for more head to head information on CZ21 versus Excal. I had hoped more people had used both in saltwater.

 

[scubadetector]

This MIGHT not be the forum to ask that on. You might want to ask on the Beach and Scuba forum. This forum has mostly CZ users in it that love their machines.

 

[Steve O]

rbdigger, you may not know it because you aren't familiar with the people here,yet, but therover is one of the top dogs for info on cz's and excals. His advise is solid.

 

[therover]

Some hunters do not know that the GB on a CZ can help with falsing and can work in tandem with the sensitivity setting to calm it down.

 

[therover]

n/t

 

[tvr]

Yes, it is a lot about preferences. I've got more CZ time than Excal but some observations / thoughts / opinions ...

- In wet sand areas with a lot of bigger iron pieces (not iron flakes in the sand) I like the Excal. The DD separates better, I let it recover from null and move on. I like that the DD effectively sweeps more sand volume for a given coil size.
- In the areas with heavy black sand or a lot of small iron flakes, the CZ is the way to go. The Excal spends so much time nulling and recovering, even at very low sensitivity settings and very slow sweeps, that I get impatient.
- In the salt water deeper than knee deep, the Excal seems to start loosing depth while the CZ doesn't. I've read some other people post about the Excal loosing some depth as the salt water column above the coil increases, so I don't think it is just me (although it may be, I have not tried to set up any controlled tests).
- The CZ seems to average down the id tones on deeper targets more than the Excal. You just need to understand that so that you take a little time to explore deeper low tone targets with the CZ to make sure they are iron and not something you really ought to be digging.
-The Excal coil, at least the newer style tornado coil, has less drag in the water than the CZ coil. I use the 10 inch on the Excal and the the 8 inch CZ-20 and the Excal still takes a little less effort to slice the water. When I just wet sand hunt, I'll go with the CZ6a and the 12.5 inch SunRay coil. I still think about possibly wiring up one of the SunRay's (if I could find and affordable one) to a CZ 20 or 21. The SunRay does not have much drag in the water at all; comparable to the 10 inch tornado on the Excal.

I have both and plan on keeping both. I prefer one or the other depending on conditions. Both CZ's and Excal have more than paid for themselves.
Cheers,
tvr

 

[tailofdog]

Yes, it is a lot about preferences. I've got more CZ time than Excal but some observations / thoughts / opinions ...

- In wet sand areas with a lot of bigger iron pieces (not iron flakes in the sand) I like the Excal. The DD separates better, I let it recover from null and move on. I like that the DD effectively sweeps more sand volume for a given coil size.
- In the areas with heavy black sand or a lot of small iron flakes, the CZ is the way to go. The Excal spends so much time nulling and recovering, even at very low sensitivity settings and very slow sweeps, that I get impatient.
- In the salt water deeper than knee deep, the Excal seems to start loosing depth while the CZ doesn't. I've read some other people post about the Excal loosing some depth as the salt water column above the coil increases, so I don't think it is just me (although it may be, I have not tried to set up any controlled tests).
- The CZ seems to average down the id tones on deeper targets more than the Excal. You just need to understand that so that you take a little time to explore deeper low tone targets with the CZ to make sure they are iron and not something you really ought to be digging.
-The Excal coil, at least the newer style tornado coil, has less drag in the water than the CZ coil. I use the 10 inch on the Excal and the the 8 inch CZ-20 and the Excal still takes a little less effort to slice the water. When I just wet sand hunt, I'll go with the CZ6a and the 12.5 inch SunRay coil. I still think about possibly wiring up one of the SunRay's (if I could find and affordable one) to a CZ 20 or 21. The SunRay does not have much drag in the water at all; comparable to the 10 inch tornado on the Excal.

I have both and plan on keeping both. I prefer one or the other depending on conditions. Both CZ's and Excal have more than paid for themselves.
Cheers,
tvr

I have been having a detecting break and, sold my Excal. Nice machine but, i hated the knobs being so delicate.
Also the wires had to be really protected.
I had a Sovereign chest mounted that, i loved but, a wave killed it.
Now i had a CZ3D that i, chest mounted and, loved the build but had a bad coil new.
It did not appear to like black sand and, i have to ask about quality control. I live in Australia and would hate to get a CZ21 with a faulty coil.

 

[Darkflamedesign]

Excal provides EXCEPTIONAL salt water / Wet Sand rejection .. I use it with a WOT 15 coil and yet to find a machine that will hit deeper ( without knob adjusting ) . It has great response to very small items even with such a large coil ..... GB is a snap . Place into AllMetal , bob coil until threshold settles and go.

Pinpoint is easy .... I engage target and use a narrow tight sweep while pulling coil back from target . Using the " crown " edge of coil ( where sound just drops ) allows unessary digging.
I hunt behind other hunters ( garrett , whies surfmaster ) and dig multiple targets. The king of the beaches will always be the minelabs. ( both excal and sov Gt )

The iron mask ( null ) is a fabulous feature that is welcome in the beach enviroment . These have a slow recovery speed that most hunters forget . If you use a sweep that is too fast you will lose targets . My swing speed is based on a count .... One thousand one , one thousand two . I am able to hit very small item ( like a bobby pin at 20" ) , even if that is a trash item i can still leverage my techniques to hit the small targets i am after.

There is a reason they are popular. I owned various P.I. Machines to compare and have sold every one , except my excal II and Sovereign GT.