NASA-Tom quote "Life begins at 3 feet" Do you agree?

[Hastings]

NASA-Tom [ PM ]
Re: On my mind -- Random Thoughts
January 30, 2017 03:19PM Registered: 10 years ago
Posts: 7,378
Wounded.

In the past 7 months....... I have run into 4 State Archaeologists ....... completely independent of one-another...... of whom have made nearly the exact/same statement to me:

"Life begins at 3-feet"

After the 4th Archaeologist made this statement......... it 'frustrated' me enough to pin him down for some 'questioning'. In short:
1) "You" detectorists are only playing in the top 12" of peat. "You guys" haven't even gotten down to the 'dirt' yet. You may find a proverbial 'acorn' in your peat top-soil......just enough to keep your interest.
2) If you want to find things from the early 1700's........ you need to dig 3-feet. "Life begins at 3-feet". ((He showed me many documents proving exactly this.))
3) "Be a real man........ and dig pits in strategic locations....... and your eyes will be opened".

I'm well aware of these facts; yet, wounded again by this 'reality-check'........and from multiple scientific fact-based sources.........,,,,,,,,,,, that do this for a living.
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[Tom Slick]

I agree if you're looking for stone tools, bones, and pottery shards or other indications of early man in the U.S, but those old ancestors didn't use much in the way of metal for coins, jewelry, or tokens and the sort. Folks find 1700's coins back East without digging 3 feet deep so a lot of it depends on where you're hunting. Here in the West, we only date from the 1800's for the most part except a few Spanish mission sites. I find 1800's coins in the desert literally sitting on the surface. There's a site I've visited near Barstow CA that they've dug down closer to 15 feet and found fire rings. I visited a roman bathhouse that was found during remodeling of the basement in a building in London, England. It about 20 feet below street level, so some old stuff can be pretty deep and some of it can be pretty shallow. I'm not digging three feet for nothing. It would probably be a rusty nail.

 

[jim tn]

We have some pit diggers on here, maybe they will chime in. As for me, I am inclined to agree, but certainly have never dug anything that deep to know for fact. HH jim tn

 

[still looking 52]

Way more work than I'm willing to do. My little shovel and my back wouldn't take much of that before giving out.

 

[MI-AuAg]

I agree with Tom.

I, and many others in my state, find arrowheads and other stone implements as eyeball surface finds. I believe that is a fairly common occurrence throughout the country. Those items date back to the original inhabitents.

Generall speaking, IMO, unless something has been intentionally buried, or through ground excavation by man, or natural geological events such as sedimentation, floods, etc., I wouldn't think a dropped item such as a coin, would normally sink that deep.

Coins dating back to our nation's beginning and before, are regularily found well within a metal detectors depth limits. I believe a coin or similar objects natural sink rate due to water, insect activity, and freeze/thaw cycles, etc., generally reaches a point where the soil density inhibits further sinking. (through natural means)

At any rate, I guess it doesn't really matter much to most detectorists. Good luck finding a landowner, or public location where you'd be allowed to bring in a backhoe, and strip off several feet of ground to look. I don't think many would want to, unless knowing beforehand there was a very good chance of something worthwhile being there.

 

[Dan-Pa.]

Perhaps but if you ever dug a foot silver dime with a CZ or Explorer with a conventional digger you wouldn't have to ask yourself that question....lots of work.....

 

[dfmike]

That's kind of disheartening but one can't argue with empirical evidence. Realistically even if modern VLF metal detectors could go that deep on the small stuff, who would dig a 3 foot hole to get to it ? I can just imagine the work, the mess and the very real possibility of getting arrested. Thankfully there's plenty of cool things to find within a few inches.

 

[bootyhoundpa]

Not sure if life begins at 3ft but i believe it usually ends at 6ft..lol.. back east in my area we have a topsoil layer of generally between 8 to 12in give or take..below the topsoil is either a clay layer or shale and nothing sinks in shale and ive only ever found 1 coin that sank into the clay layer and it was only maybe 1inch in..

 

[MarkCZ]

I agree with Tom.

I, and many others in my state, find arrowheads and other stone implements as eyeball surface finds. I believe that is a fairly common occurrence throughout the country. Those items date back to the original inhabitents.

Generall speaking, IMO, unless something has been intentionally buried, or through ground excavation by man, or natural geological events such as sedimentation, floods, etc., I wouldn't think a dropped item such as a coin, would normally sink that deep.

Coins dating back to our nation's beginning and before, are regularily found well within a metal detectors depth limits. I believe a coin or similar objects natural sink rate due to water, insect activity, and freeze/thaw cycles, etc., generally reaches a point where the soil density inhibits further sinking. (through natural means)

At any rate, I guess it doesn't really matter much to most detectorists. Good luck finding a landowner, or public location where you'd be allowed to bring in a backhoe, and strip off several feet of ground to look. I don't think many would want to, unless knowing beforehand there was a very good chance of something worthwhile being there.

\

Don't forget soil growth! from YEARS of grass clippings (like a park, or lawn) or just decomposing foliage. In the woods around where I live you can dig maybe 4" and find clay, that is to say 4" of top soil. Now, on the other hand in our city park the top soil may go down 8" and that's not counting any fill dirt added.
Also, on the side of slopes with some run off I find a reduced amount of top soil, meaning targets are usually not as deep as compared to the flatland in the same area.

Mark

 

[Larry (IL)]

That statement might be true in peat but many of us has clay or rock under the top soil. I'll stick with the top 8-12 inches thank you and the Archaeologists can have the rest.

 

[MarkCZ]

That statement might be true in peat but many of us has clay or rock under the top soil. I'll stick with the top 8-12 inches thank you and the Archaeologists can have the rest.

Well, I was thinking everywhere on the planet (except maybe a Desert) has a base under the is topsoil, be it clay or rock. my point is that that if modern man (the USA) drops something on the ground its most likely somewhere in the top soil, and not in the beneath crust. My point was that the top soil depth can vary do to reasons like a more abundance of decomposing vegetation at the surface, mowed lawns or parks that the clippings are left will produce more soil growth than wooded areas that may only have leaves for decompose soil growth. Now they're places in the woods that seem to be natural collection places for windblown leaves to pileup, in those places the top soil can be VERY deep.

Mark

 

[marcomo]

Absolutely I believe 3'+ depths in areas using metal coins and objects in the early 1700's

Paraphrasing something else Tom D. said: If you could remove 6 inches from the sites you detect, the results would be eye opening.

Quoting him exactly: "How do you know what you are missing, if you do not know that it even exists?"

 

[Mike Hillis]

I would say that quote refers to Florida.

HH
Mike

 

[sprchng]

If that's the case , and there's nothing worth while close to the surface , then why are so many areas off limits to detecting?
More archie propaganda................
location , location , location

 

[MarkCZ]

Here in Huntington WV in the 80's we used to hunt city curbs (those grass strips along sidewalks) well at that time the fresh drops of the 20's and 30's were probably in the 4" to 5" depth range, now due to soil growth from grass clippings even the stuff from the 50's isn't reachable and it would probably be amazing if the top 6" could be peeled off and then metal detect the area because you would be in range of the fresh drops from the 1890 up to the 1920's. The soil growth along those curbs is now WAY above the concrete curbs. We have pretty much gave up curb hunting altogether several years ago, the good stuff is to deep and the home owners in the area put up to much of a fight about digging in the curbs in front of their houses (even though they don't own the curbs, the do mow and edge them,

Mark

 

[slingshot]

Untrue. I'm enjoying the heck outta life with the first 6". Gold rings, occasional silver, even found 3 $20 bills laying in a schoolyard. What a great hobby!

 

[MI-AuAg]

I agree with Tom.

I, and many others in my state, find arrowheads and other stone implements as eyeball surface finds. I believe that is a fairly common occurrence throughout the country. Those items date back to the original inhabitents.

Generall speaking, IMO, unless something has been intentionally buried, or through ground excavation by man, or natural geological events such as sedimentation, floods, etc., I wouldn't think a dropped item such as a coin, would normally sink that deep.

Coins dating back to our nation's beginning and before, are regularily found well within a metal detectors depth limits. I believe a coin or similar objects natural sink rate due to water, insect activity, and freeze/thaw cycles, etc., generally reaches a point where the soil density inhibits further sinking. (through natural means)

At any rate, I guess it doesn't really matter much to most detectorists. Good luck finding a landowner, or public location where you'd be allowed to bring in a backhoe, and strip off several feet of ground to look. I don't think many would want to, unless knowing beforehand there was a very good chance of something worthwhile being there.

I SHOULD HAVE BEEN MORE SPECIFIC, MY AGREEMENT WAS WITH TOM SLICK'S POST.

 

[amberjack]

I have sites I would love to rip 6" off the top of I know there is stuff down past 12" not all sites are the same but I agree that there is stuff "coins" etc.. past 12" in many spots.

AJ

 

[Flbchbm]

Here in Florida's sandy soil, it would be great to be able to dig pits for the old finds! This past summer they redid a playgroung here in town and stripped off the turf- probably about 4"- revealing some early to mid 1900's coins that had been out of reach. Oldest coin I have found here is a 1872 indian head at about 9" and I suspect it was brought shallower by long-ago utility work based on the area in which I found it. Wish I could strip off 6" at a time until there were no more finds!

 

[pasttom]

So given their belief 3 feet is the start of the goods is it not absolute hypocrisy that they care so much what we do in our tiny foot of 'dead' dirt?