REVIER
Well-known member
I posted about the second time I have found 2 gold rings on one hunt in an area around one of my favorite sites to hunt...basketball courts.
http://www.findmall.com/read.php?91,1913838
I have had more than my share of luck around these and other real densely packed trashy sites and member mudpuppy noticed and asked about my thought process and how pick them,how I think and what I do at these type of sites to find these great chain, and silver and gold ring targets so in that thread I put down my thoughts.
I re-posted these on another forum and got lots of thanks for the info replies over there too, and one member PM'd me and asked me a few more questions.
In that reply I went into my theory's on masking which is the biggest problem I have at trashy sites and I thought they would be helpful to some so I will re-post them here.
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So, let me get this straight...those gold rings and chains...do they really sound just like trash? I've heard it said that rings sound really clear and not scratchy. So, that may not be true?
Masking, readings and sounds.
When it comes to sounds of gold rings I have found that sometimes they do have a different, clearer, more noticeable tone...but not all the time.
If there is going to be a difference it is usually going to be on the big stuff like large gold class rings.
On my Tesoros I have run over a couple of these and I do remember that on one in particular this zinc signal was so clear and so nice and "sweet" vs a regular zincoln target that I did stop for a second and really take notice before I dug it.
By the way this was right next to my second favorite type of site to hunt, a picnic pavilion, which is just about the same as these trashy b-ball courts with a huge amount of pop top, foil and tab garbage that is usually so bad most hunters avoid it like the plague.
I have also found several silver and a couple of gold rings next to these pavilions so think about using all the same techniques to hunt these and you might find some great stuff there, too.
Sorry to say the bulk of the gold rings that we usually come across will be lower on the scale from foil to tabs, and even though those signals are usually clear, stable and not really jumpy or scratchy I have yet to notice a huge difference in the tones between those smaller ones and a normal good target like a nickel or even shallow trash which could be the same sort of good signal in the ground.
I am really good at listening and hearing tones, even with my F2 that screen does not come into play as much as the tones do when I hunt, but so many great golden targets I have dug have still been such a complete surprise I still decided long ago to dig just about everything solid I roll over.
You just can't take any chances in this hobby as far as I am concerned.
When it comes to masking, this can be a much bigger problem, I have found, then many hunters will realize.
I once missed 3 gold rings at one site and then found them on the next 2 hunts.
http://www.findmall.com/read.php?37,1764960,1765526#msg-1765526
http://www.findmall.com/read.php?37,1766886,1768670#msg-1768670
The reason I missed them was two-fold...
The first time through I was using larger coils and had more than one target under the coil at the same time and 2, trash right next to, or even covering another great target can mess up your settings and completely hide the better target.
You have a great chance of this happening as a possibility when you hunt these sites with a denser amount of trash so close together.
This can happen in larger wide open spaces too.
One time I was at a park and was desperate to find just one great target before I left and was actually running around a wide open area with my Vaq and the big DD coil looking for just one more good signal to dig before I left.
You would have laughed if you saw how fast I was moving doing this that day, but the Vaq is a pretty fast machine and that coil was big so I was hoping for lightning to strike...and it did.
Not much trash out there or many signals at all but my knob was set to find everything from foil on up and I did get a quick solid signal and stopped to investigate it.
The target faded out at tabs and I opened a 3 inch wide hole, flipped over the plug and about 4 inches deep there was a beaver tail pull tab sitting at the bottom.
I plucked it out and stuck my Propointer back in the hole, (always, ALWAYS re-scan every hole after you retrieve any target, good or bad), and in the side of that hole about 1 inch to the side of where the tab was laying and at a depth of about .5 to 1 inch I got another signal.
I dug that out and standing vertical wrapped up in the roots of the grass I pulled out a beautiful 14k woman's wedding ring!
In air testing this ring actually faded out right below zinc and and a little higher than that tab signal I got when both targets were under my coil.
If I didn't stop to dig the tab I probably would never have found this thing.
This phenomenon has happened to me a few times so one day I got curious and did some testing.
I took a couple of gold rings and scanned them with my F2 and got a solid signal with specific numbers.
Then I laid a foil ketchup packet over each ring and scanned them again.
I still got a solid non jumpy tone, but the numbers and target section had completely changed!
Most gold rings I have found have come in disguised as trash, anyway, but in this experiment they were still trash but way different because it was a combination of the two types of metal.
Still solid so I would have dug it anyway, but because of this type of thing happening out there and because try as I might to develop X-Ray vision I still don't know what is down there 100% of the time till I dig it.
Is it any wonder I became a dig it all hunter and after I did started to find much more than my share of chains and gold rings because of that?
I notice you have an Ace350 and an E Trac.
This masking effect and number and section jump will definitely happen with the Ace, but I suspect it will be just as much of a problem with the E Trac.
I have read that the Minelabs are so good at finding great targets in iron infested sites, but I have read very little about having the same ability at foil infested sites.
That, along with tabs, screw on and pop tops of all types and sizes is our enemy at trashy sites like picnic pavilions, volley ball and basketball courts, not iron, and I can see many instances where you would have some kind of this type of garbage one inch deep but sitting directly over a gold ring at 2 or 3 inches.
Would the E Track, or any detector for that matter, give you a great gold ring signal instead of a zinc, foil or steel signal or a combination of any of these?
I think probably not.
Again, there are specific reasons I became a dig it all hunter and I never regretted it for a second and probably never will.
If that ever does happen to me all I will have to do is just look at my large collection of trash signal chains and gold rings to get me back on track.
Go slow, use smaller coils, overlap heavily, hit all sites from several directions if you can and above everything else...DIG IT ALL!
If not all at once but eventually over several hunts.
Those are the real secrets to my success...but they are just common sense to me and many others and not really so secret after all!
http://www.findmall.com/read.php?91,1913838
I have had more than my share of luck around these and other real densely packed trashy sites and member mudpuppy noticed and asked about my thought process and how pick them,how I think and what I do at these type of sites to find these great chain, and silver and gold ring targets so in that thread I put down my thoughts.
I re-posted these on another forum and got lots of thanks for the info replies over there too, and one member PM'd me and asked me a few more questions.
In that reply I went into my theory's on masking which is the biggest problem I have at trashy sites and I thought they would be helpful to some so I will re-post them here.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So, let me get this straight...those gold rings and chains...do they really sound just like trash? I've heard it said that rings sound really clear and not scratchy. So, that may not be true?
Masking, readings and sounds.
When it comes to sounds of gold rings I have found that sometimes they do have a different, clearer, more noticeable tone...but not all the time.
If there is going to be a difference it is usually going to be on the big stuff like large gold class rings.
On my Tesoros I have run over a couple of these and I do remember that on one in particular this zinc signal was so clear and so nice and "sweet" vs a regular zincoln target that I did stop for a second and really take notice before I dug it.
By the way this was right next to my second favorite type of site to hunt, a picnic pavilion, which is just about the same as these trashy b-ball courts with a huge amount of pop top, foil and tab garbage that is usually so bad most hunters avoid it like the plague.
I have also found several silver and a couple of gold rings next to these pavilions so think about using all the same techniques to hunt these and you might find some great stuff there, too.
Sorry to say the bulk of the gold rings that we usually come across will be lower on the scale from foil to tabs, and even though those signals are usually clear, stable and not really jumpy or scratchy I have yet to notice a huge difference in the tones between those smaller ones and a normal good target like a nickel or even shallow trash which could be the same sort of good signal in the ground.
I am really good at listening and hearing tones, even with my F2 that screen does not come into play as much as the tones do when I hunt, but so many great golden targets I have dug have still been such a complete surprise I still decided long ago to dig just about everything solid I roll over.
You just can't take any chances in this hobby as far as I am concerned.
When it comes to masking, this can be a much bigger problem, I have found, then many hunters will realize.
I once missed 3 gold rings at one site and then found them on the next 2 hunts.
http://www.findmall.com/read.php?37,1764960,1765526#msg-1765526
http://www.findmall.com/read.php?37,1766886,1768670#msg-1768670
The reason I missed them was two-fold...
The first time through I was using larger coils and had more than one target under the coil at the same time and 2, trash right next to, or even covering another great target can mess up your settings and completely hide the better target.
You have a great chance of this happening as a possibility when you hunt these sites with a denser amount of trash so close together.
This can happen in larger wide open spaces too.
One time I was at a park and was desperate to find just one great target before I left and was actually running around a wide open area with my Vaq and the big DD coil looking for just one more good signal to dig before I left.
You would have laughed if you saw how fast I was moving doing this that day, but the Vaq is a pretty fast machine and that coil was big so I was hoping for lightning to strike...and it did.
Not much trash out there or many signals at all but my knob was set to find everything from foil on up and I did get a quick solid signal and stopped to investigate it.
The target faded out at tabs and I opened a 3 inch wide hole, flipped over the plug and about 4 inches deep there was a beaver tail pull tab sitting at the bottom.
I plucked it out and stuck my Propointer back in the hole, (always, ALWAYS re-scan every hole after you retrieve any target, good or bad), and in the side of that hole about 1 inch to the side of where the tab was laying and at a depth of about .5 to 1 inch I got another signal.
I dug that out and standing vertical wrapped up in the roots of the grass I pulled out a beautiful 14k woman's wedding ring!
In air testing this ring actually faded out right below zinc and and a little higher than that tab signal I got when both targets were under my coil.
If I didn't stop to dig the tab I probably would never have found this thing.
This phenomenon has happened to me a few times so one day I got curious and did some testing.
I took a couple of gold rings and scanned them with my F2 and got a solid signal with specific numbers.
Then I laid a foil ketchup packet over each ring and scanned them again.
I still got a solid non jumpy tone, but the numbers and target section had completely changed!
Most gold rings I have found have come in disguised as trash, anyway, but in this experiment they were still trash but way different because it was a combination of the two types of metal.
Still solid so I would have dug it anyway, but because of this type of thing happening out there and because try as I might to develop X-Ray vision I still don't know what is down there 100% of the time till I dig it.
Is it any wonder I became a dig it all hunter and after I did started to find much more than my share of chains and gold rings because of that?
I notice you have an Ace350 and an E Trac.
This masking effect and number and section jump will definitely happen with the Ace, but I suspect it will be just as much of a problem with the E Trac.
I have read that the Minelabs are so good at finding great targets in iron infested sites, but I have read very little about having the same ability at foil infested sites.
That, along with tabs, screw on and pop tops of all types and sizes is our enemy at trashy sites like picnic pavilions, volley ball and basketball courts, not iron, and I can see many instances where you would have some kind of this type of garbage one inch deep but sitting directly over a gold ring at 2 or 3 inches.
Would the E Track, or any detector for that matter, give you a great gold ring signal instead of a zinc, foil or steel signal or a combination of any of these?
I think probably not.
Again, there are specific reasons I became a dig it all hunter and I never regretted it for a second and probably never will.
If that ever does happen to me all I will have to do is just look at my large collection of trash signal chains and gold rings to get me back on track.
Go slow, use smaller coils, overlap heavily, hit all sites from several directions if you can and above everything else...DIG IT ALL!
If not all at once but eventually over several hunts.
Those are the real secrets to my success...but they are just common sense to me and many others and not really so secret after all!
