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Monte regarding question
- Thread starter findit
- Start date
[quote findit]quote:True or false*** So the Vaquero would do better at hunting iron infested sites than the Tejon. Because it doesn't accept as low as the Tejon. And it wouldn't be as affected by masking!
someone asked this question i would say false it is just the opposite am i correct?[/quote]I didn't get a chance to answer until almost 2:am, but my reply to that post is below.
In short, the answer is they are both going to perform ALMOST the same, because if they both adjust low enough to respond to the iron, then they should be able to be adjusted to the setting where they just barely reject the iron, resulting in similar discrimination settings. As I explained, if a model had a more limited low-end of adjustment, they would be more affected and have more masking issues, but if they can be set similar to each other, you might get similar performance.
Of the two, however, I think many would prefer the somewhat cleaner iron rejection of the Vaquero than the Tej
someone asked this question i would say false it is just the opposite am i correct?[/quote]I didn't get a chance to answer until almost 2:am, but my reply to that post is below.
In short, the answer is they are both going to perform ALMOST the same, because if they both adjust low enough to respond to the iron, then they should be able to be adjusted to the setting where they just barely reject the iron, resulting in similar discrimination settings. As I explained, if a model had a more limited low-end of adjustment, they would be more affected and have more masking issues, but if they can be set similar to each other, you might get similar performance.
Of the two, however, I think many would prefer the somewhat cleaner iron rejection of the Vaquero than the Tej
What brought the question to mind was an encounter I had with a veteran treasure hunter using a cheap md which couldn't detect a nail at all. He stated he had never dug small iron. Just guessing the detector he is using may not even be ed-120. But he seems to do well with what he uses. This got me to thinking, if I could adjust my machine to a simular setting, masking of good items would all but disappear.
[quote Monte][quote findit]quote:True or false*** So the Vaquero would do better at hunting iron infested sites than the Tejon. Because it doesn't accept as low as the Tejon. And it wouldn't be as affected by masking!
someone asked this question i would say false it is just the opposite am i correct?[/quote]I didn't get a chance to answer until almost 2:am, but my reply to that post is below.
In short, the answer is they are both going to perform ALMOST the same, because if they both adjust low enough to respond to the iron, then they should be able to be adjusted to the setting where they just barely reject the iron, resulting in similar discrimination settings. As I explained, if a model had a more limited low-end of adjustment, they would be more affected and have more masking issues, but if they can be set similar to each other, you might get similar performance.
Of the two, however, I think many would prefer the somewhat cleaner iron rejection of the Vaquero than the Tej
[quote Monte][quote findit]quote:True or false*** So the Vaquero would do better at hunting iron infested sites than the Tejon. Because it doesn't accept as low as the Tejon. And it wouldn't be as affected by masking!someone asked this question i would say false it is just the opposite am i correct?[/quote]I didn't get a chance to answer until almost 2:am, but my reply to that post is below.
In short, the answer is they are both going to perform ALMOST the same, because if they both adjust low enough to respond to the iron, then they should be able to be adjusted to the setting where they just barely reject the iron, resulting in similar discrimination settings. As I explained, if a model had a more limited low-end of adjustment, they would be more affected and have more masking issues, but if they can be set similar to each other, you might get similar performance.
Of the two, however, I think many would prefer the somewhat cleaner iron rejection of the Vaquero than the Tej
Your logic doesnt make sense. People buy the Tejon for its great depth. Turning the disc up to quiet the machine down is a rather idiotic way to quiet a machine down. Why not just turn the sensitivity down? The Tejon is a very sensitive machine. If you want to a sensitive machine you have to put up with occasional pops and snaps, but I would not call the Tejon noise by any means. Some people dont like that extra power chatter so the Vaquero would be a better choice for them. It is the same electronics, with the gain dropped down to make more stable and quieter.
[quote markg]What brought the question to mind was an encounter I had with a veteran treasure hunter using a cheap md which couldn't detect a nail at all. He stated he had never dug small iron. Just guessing the detector he is using may not even be ed-120. But he seems to do well with what he uses. This got me to thinking, if I could adjust my machine to a simular setting, masking of good items would all but disappear.
[/quote]There are a few reasons why it might initially appear that one model is a better performer than another based upon the amount of finds made, or the amount of iron trash NOT found. Let me share some examples of what I mean.
I have and use a TID model most of the time, I just seldom use the TID feature, unless it is really applicable for a site and application. One of my all-time favorite TID models is the White's XLT. I might get another just because it is good at what it CAN do, and I know and deal with the things it CAN'T do well. The XLT makes a great "cruising" detector, as I call it. Since it's a 4-filter type design, I can sweep an area faster with it and not lose performance like I usually would with a slow-motion, 2-filter design. In many locations I might employ both Visual Target ID as well as the Audio Tone ID, putting the total TID capability to good use. The result, if hunting with someone using something like, say, a Tesoro Vaquero, is that I can cover more ground, and due to the target info I can be a lot more selective on what I spend time recovering. In the end, there's an excellent chance I would have many more coins and far less trash at the end of a hunt with a fellow/gal using a Vaquero.
If a person using a Vaquero or other non-metered model increased the Discrimination to knock out annoying pull tabs, they would lose all US 5
[/quote]There are a few reasons why it might initially appear that one model is a better performer than another based upon the amount of finds made, or the amount of iron trash NOT found. Let me share some examples of what I mean. I have and use a TID model most of the time, I just seldom use the TID feature, unless it is really applicable for a site and application. One of my all-time favorite TID models is the White's XLT. I might get another just because it is good at what it CAN do, and I know and deal with the things it CAN'T do well. The XLT makes a great "cruising" detector, as I call it. Since it's a 4-filter type design, I can sweep an area faster with it and not lose performance like I usually would with a slow-motion, 2-filter design. In many locations I might employ both Visual Target ID as well as the Audio Tone ID, putting the total TID capability to good use. The result, if hunting with someone using something like, say, a Tesoro Vaquero, is that I can cover more ground, and due to the target info I can be a lot more selective on what I spend time recovering. In the end, there's an excellent chance I would have many more coins and far less trash at the end of a hunt with a fellow/gal using a Vaquero.
If a person using a Vaquero or other non-metered model increased the Discrimination to knock out annoying pull tabs, they would lose all US 5
[quote Scully]Your logic doesnt make sense.[/quote]My "logic" does make sense because I thought he was asking about handling iron trash so as not to dig it, and not over-do the rejection to cause more masking. Perhaps I misunderstood the question? I don't think so.
[quote Scully]People buy the Tejon for its great depth.[/quote]People buy the Tej
[quote Scully]People buy the Tejon for its great depth.[/quote]People buy the Tej
The Tejon sensitivity can be turned down and of course you could find the happy spot where it equals the V, but if you dont want the extra depth of the Tejon the Vaquero would be a better choice. The Vaquero IS the Tejon with the gain turned down to make it stable and quiet. But by doing that the V lost a little depth on the Tejon. Also, the Tejon is at a higher frequency than the V and tends to hit a little harder on gold and brass targets so its not just a depth issue.
I am not sure what your question is about your friend, is he getting deep targets he doesnt want to dig? Turn the sensitivity down, then, its that simple. Or you do mean he ISNT digging anything deep? Or maybe he just needs to get a bigger shovel.
As far as iron targets, bigger pieces will fool the Tejon, as it will many machines. But properly tuned, with the audio control set at 3 O'Clock position, with practice you can tell an iron target from a good target by the audio characteristics. You will need good quality headphones for the Tejon language is a very subtle one, but to be sure, with practice you will be able tell iron by the sharpness of the beep. It has a snap to it that good targets done have. Good targets have a real smooth, repeatable signal.
I am not sure what your question is about your friend, is he getting deep targets he doesnt want to dig? Turn the sensitivity down, then, its that simple. Or you do mean he ISNT digging anything deep? Or maybe he just needs to get a bigger shovel.
As far as iron targets, bigger pieces will fool the Tejon, as it will many machines. But properly tuned, with the audio control set at 3 O'Clock position, with practice you can tell an iron target from a good target by the audio characteristics. You will need good quality headphones for the Tejon language is a very subtle one, but to be sure, with practice you will be able tell iron by the sharpness of the beep. It has a snap to it that good targets done have. Good targets have a real smooth, repeatable signal.
re-reading your post, but it could be easily misunderstood (just as I misunderstood). But when I read it the first time it sounded like you were telling people to turn up their disc to quiet down the machine. If I misunderstood, others might as well so its good we had this interaction.
Also, not all relic hunters WANT to dig iron, I certainly dont.
Also, not all relic hunters WANT to dig iron, I certainly dont.
[quote findit]now that we have seen the difference in disc for example ed-120 to ed-180. is there a difference in how low, say for example a compadre which has true ed180 compared to another entry machine like the ace 250 will go? Monte would like here your input on this[/quote]Even though Tesoro offerings have ranged from something close to 100