Looking for some input - PI vs. VLF...

[cubfan64]

I've been mulling over getting a new detector this fall or winter going into next year and have spent alot of time researching numerous machines. Once question that I seem to find myself flip flopping back and forth over and over on is the pro's and con's of a PI vs. VLF machine.

I know the basics:

1. Depth - PI's are generally deeper than VLF's (almost to the point of annoyance on some items)

2. Descrimination - PI's have none while VHF's have variable ranges of descrimination

3. PI's - generally are more stable in salt water (seen conflicting reports on this)

4. Gold Jewelry - PI's have the edge at picking up small gold items
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The issue I'm having is that often one ends up digging every target when water (fresh and salt) hunting and/or beach hunting - it can be annoying at times and it's obviously more time consuming, but in the end, your odds are greater of getting gold. If that's the case (digging every signal), then why not go with a PI detector and get the better depth and better sensitivity to small gold? Sure you dig more trash, but wouldn't you also dig more gold?

I'm not looking for advice as much as I am just some input from those of you who use or have used both types of detectors when water hunting. I really appreciate the help!

thanks

 

[Gulf Hunter]

Here's my take on the matter. I own both: Excal 1000 and Aquasearch PI. I think there is a time and place for both units. If I feel like the area I want to hunt is iron infested, then I run the Excal. I can cover so much more water with it and not waste time digging crap. If the surf area is reasonably clean of ferrous and I can maintain a better trash to treasure ratio, then I opt for the PI. This is generally a shallow to deep water surf area. I found a honker diamond ring with it that was so deep, you can't believe it. No lakes or bays with this 1. You need 1 of each in my opinion. Get both!

 

[alsway]

YOU ARE SO RIGHT,ABOUT THE TWO,ONLY THING I SEE IS YOU WILL MOVE SOME WHAT A LITTLE FASTER USEING THE VLF,I MY SELF WOULD PREFER PI. I HOPE YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT WATER HUNTING. AL.

 

[Craig-PI]

I hunt with my PI only in the water because there is less trash, If I was to hunt the wet sand or dry I would use a VLF machine but 90% of my detecting is done in the water and I don't need a VLF in there. If you are going to detect in freshwater besides saltwater then you need a VLF machine.

 

[UK Brian]

I use both P.I.'s and multi frequency but the multi frequency rarely.
The P.I. is insensitive to silver foil, ring pulls have to be dug with any machine to avoid the lose of small/thin rings....that leaves iron. Elongated iron will double blip so is not to much of a problem and other large iron can be avoided by experience and the use of the SAT control if your P.I. has one.
If the SAT is advanced to narrow the target response you can then pick up on the relationship of width of target to the audio output. This avoids the digging of much iron but you do have to get your ear in to do it. A few weeks off from beach hunting and I have to spend a couple of hours to get back in tune with what the machine is saying.
You can also use the 'dropped gold' method with many P.I.'s but its a little time consuming and not 100% accurate.

 

[cubfan64]

Thanks for the info. UKBrian - I've heard some diehard PI users state that with some experience, they can tell enough about a target to avoid digging too much trash. I have a couple questions for you though...

SAT control - what is this and how does it work? (I'll look it up online as well, but may as well get a users definition)

What is the "dropped gold" method?

Thanks again for the info. - I still have plenty of research to do.

 

[UK Brian]

S.A.T. is Self Adjusting Threshold. Some machines (Goldquest SS, Deepstar II have it some don't).
Normal recommendation is to set it at the initial position to give maximum depth. It does in theory but the signal response you hear is a little wide and fluffy. Increase to halfway or slightly over and the signal becomes nice and sharp allowing the width of the buried item to be traced. As for the slight drop in depth on most bad/black sand beaches an increase in SAT improves performance.

As for dropped gold discrimination you do need the right type of machine (not Craig's Whites). Deepers, Goldquest SS, later models Beachscan, C-Scope CS6 or 7UMD or a Headhunter. This is because the method relies on increasing the delay when the sample pulse is taken. Other makes/models as you adjust the pulse delay depth loss occurs on all targets so it won't work.
Assuming you have the right machine as the delay is increased objects having low conductivity ie gold are ignored while high conductivity items still provide a strong signal (and iron to a P.I. is the highest conductivity).
So find a target, increase the delay and if the signal disappears the target should be gold. If you still have a strong response its most likely not gold. (While experimenting on the beach mark the delay knob with the rough point that most gold rings disappear....saves time turning the knob to far).
Drawback. A nice large near surface gold ring will give a almost an overload due to its sheer bulk so will not drop out as the control is advanced. The combination of size/volume helps to spot these.