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Just Unpacked My F70

dahut

Active member
- - I got this in trade with Mike in KY. Attaboy, Mike! He's known as digginbullits around here and you wont go wrong with him.

I was impressed with the build work of the F70. Some have said it is chintzy and cheap, a mere toy. I didn't get that impression. Now, it isn't a battle tank by any means - more like a cavalry steed. And I would caution anyone against using it as a crutch or to break a fall down a steep slope. But, I'd say that about any detector.

What you get is a lightweight detector that is going to be an all-day swinger. This is the New Fisher getting on the micro-electronics bandwagon in a big way. The rest of the makers have tried to get there, now and then, most notably the Whites Prizm and of course the Tesoro Umax line.
The first has turned out to be a disappointment and the Tesoro's - well, we know how well they've turned out. Smaller aint bad, folks!

Now, I've gotta say that the F70 is not an intuitive detector right out of the box. You turn it on (once you find the on-off knob) and it sorta sits there and does, well... nothing. The audio gives a tiny little "bip," the screen shows a brief logo-esque image and then goes blank. Then it just sits there. There is a line across the word "IRON" in the upper left and you don't know if it is meant to be there or something is wrong. There is no audio threshold and you look at it there in your hand - and wonder.

You have to get in and play with the buttons a bit before anything is apparent. Speaking of buttons, it has the typical tactile membrane pads, all the rage these days. They don't get dirt in them and are safe from damage and I'm okay with them - except when it comes to pinpointing. For pinpoint functions I want a trigger, dangit! The F70 has none. Too bad, too, as I think every detector made should have a trigger pinpoint. This should have been brought over from the F75. When are detector makers going to get this message?

But, once you start monkeying with the controls, you realize there is a lot going on. I see elements of the old CZ7a Pro in there and plenty that is just plain new for Fisher. The lineage from the T-2 is apparent and I'd call it a "T-2 Lite," for lack of anything else. There is a logical progression through the various controls, from DISC through SENS and THRESH and NOTCH and so on. All controlled by the menu button. Shades of Garrett GT series, there. Good - I like that.

I really like the audio response suite, too. No on-off bonging over targets or tinny little tones. It gives a nice clear audio that rises from silence to signal and then drops off again. It has multiple tone choices, to which I say, "HOORAY!" As our good friend Mike Hillis says, "Tones Rule!"
I discovered it has VCO pinpoint, which I like, and it functions like a well behaved, non-motion all metal mode should. Non of that too-fast, retune-into-the-target stuff here. And, lo and behold, it offers audio modulation in response to depth... the deeper the target, the softer the response.
Oh, and did I mention it seems fast over the target? There isn't any processing delay or lagtime with this one. Thank you, Fisher.

Oh, be still my beating heart!!

The coil is very cool. It is small but large at the same time, being an elliptical. It pinpoints in the middle when at depth and off the ends when the target is shallow, as all good concentric ellipticals should. It should cover ground well enough and it looks pretty solid, too. The coil cable has a tough, seemingly indestructible PVC shell and is not too long. Very nice, very nice. Once the coils is on, it stays in position solidly and balances the instrument well. Even with the coil on, the balance is right on the hand grip and feather light.

I did note the fragile nature of the faceplate. Some have mentioned it and I wanted to see if they were right... they were. It seriously needs a face shield of self adhesive vinyl and a rain/dust cover. I'll work something out along those lines to take care of that problem. Fisher needs to develop a retro fit kit for this, to include a face shield and cover for a reasonable cost. Did you catch that, good Fisher folk?

It seems a little tippy with it's narrow stance, and that will be seen tomorrow when I take it out in the real world. I reckon I better cover the speaker with some electrical tape, too, to keep sharp grass and twigs from poking through the grill. Thanks to Tony (FL) for that idea.

First impressions are said to mean a lot. If that is so, I see a lot of potential in this F70. I'm looking forward to exploring that potential. In a word, I like it.
 
It had it on there, I believe... and I think Mike took it off!
Can I get the tape at the local Mega-Mart?
 
I field tested the CZ7aPro and your new one will have to be one helluva machine to match that one. Good luck.

Bill
 
dahut said:
It had it on there, I believe... and I think Mike took it off!
Can I get the tape at the local Mega-Mart?

David, I got the tape at a sports store. I've got a bunch left if you want me to send you some just let me know.

Mike
 
It is the match for the CZ7a Pro. I can tell you one area where it beats it hands down - weight/balance. If you've swung a Tesoro Umax or Ace 250, then you get the idea.

I have a cement floor in my shop. The F70 recognizes it as 90 on a mineralization scale of 0-99. The manual calls that pretty severe. It balances to that floor. There on the floor, it appears to be the equivalent of anything I have tried, depth wise - at preset settings. It also gives me 3 inches of separation on targets... the infamous "dime vs. 16p nail" test. It hits the dime with a clear high tone, while either ignoring the nail or burping over it with an iron low tone. This depends on the DISC settings. Either way, that aint shabby.

John(WV) calls it a hyped up Ace 250. If that is so, then it is something to be reckoned with. We shall see.
 
Thats alright Mike. No worries. I appreciate the offer sincerely.
But I can find some around here, certainly. If I get in a bind, I'll let you know.

Tried calling you about 8:30pm, but no answer.
 
You have reinforced some points that I really wasn't thinking about on the F-70. Save it and go out into the real world and get the second part of your field test. Than all you have to do is get it published.

What gets me is how Garrett came out with the Ace 250 and made quite a statement in the MD'ing world. Light weight, powerful, sensitive to small targets and goes beyond what the price tag would dictate. They made lots of money, but than just rode it out doing nothing more. They are stuck on the imaging thing. Their detectors for one are too heavy. They made the Ace which broke their mold and did well. If something is working for them, they should stay on the right track and produced more in that line. They should have come up with something like the F-70. That is why I told you in that PM it is like an Ace on steroids. I think White's has the same problem, they are stuck in a pattern that they can't brake. Big, heavy. and lots of bell and whistles that don't produce better results. The MXT was the detector for my type of hunting, but it didn't have much if any more depth than my Ace. It also weighted a few lbs. more. People in WV. warned me that the MXT couldn't handle the soil here. Lots of people. I feel the F-70 is a much better detector and handles the soil in WV. very well, with great depth at a cheaper price, etc, etc.

You have to get the small coil for the F-70. It is the coil I use most. I have been mainly MD'ing old houses. I ran the stock coil in a field and it ran flawless. I really want to use it more, like on the beach maybe? I have yet to see how the F-70 does on the beach and I would like to test it in the gold fields. You are closer to both than me. One last thing, wait till you use Autotune. It is like taking a race car on an open stretch of hi-way. All out performance. Don't wreck.

When I run it hot, it sometimes acts like it is getting feed back and starts getting noisy. I then have to reset it. I then put my adjustments at a lower setting. All is well. I was just letting the race car get out of control and had to take my foot off the gas. In an open field, I can go full throttle. Have fun.
 
Without ever using your newly aquired F70, you wrote a really informative report on it. I'm looking forward to your report on it after you get to give it a good going over in the field. We respect your comments; they are always honest and right to the point.
Good luck with your new toy. I recently bought one and won't get to use it until Spring. Dave in N.E. Penna.
 
Hope you enjoy your F70.

HH

Mike
 
n/t
 
Got the F70 out in the field today. To sum it up, it was disappointing.

We went to my friends home built in 1902. Around the property are several old foundations where barns and an older house stood. Out there in the toolies, the F70 ran smooth as silk. Set up on the factory presets, all was well. I got the Ground Grab thing down without any trouble, although I couldn't help but wonder what's up with that name. "Ground Grab?" Where did they get that one?

Anyway, I was able to play with the settings and adjust the tones to my liking. The detector was like a whisper in my hand, balancing on two fingers. It chirps and pops a bit, but all in all, I found nothing that was not to like. I didn't find squat, however, in the way of finds except some iron junk.
I had turned the DISC down to zero so I could listen to the clutter and dig the low grunting tones of iron. I still wasn't sure if it was able to detect other metals but I found a bunch of iron.... just like the F70 said. For what it's worth, the other guys didn't find anything out in the woods, either.

I felt pretty good at that point and liked the F70.

That all changed when I got it up around the house. Once out of the woods, Harold told us he had to go take care of some business and must leave - but we were free to stay as long as we liked. So he took off and we were left there to have at it.

I felt pretty good at that point and so I asked my hunting partner Hal if he wanted to give the F70 a whirl. He has probably tried 20 detectors in the past year, so if anyone could give it a first timers test, he could. Away he went with it and I took out my trusty 1236-X2. Within 10 minutes he was back... complaining.
"This thing sure is noisy, aint it? It beeps and goes on so much I can hardly use it!" With that he switched back to his own 1236 and unceremoniously put the F70 away. I pondered his comments for a few minutes. I hadn't seen any such issues. I went and got the F70.

Holy Cow, was he right! A soon as I turned it on, it went to beeping an blipping with all the tones in the book. I had not experienced this before and was baffled - until I looked up and saw the power transformer about 30 yards away. Of course... electrical interference! Problem solved.

Or so I thought.

I adjusted the frequency first. Nothing.
I lowered the threshold from 0 to -5. Nada.
Finally, I brought the SENS down to 30. Nyet.

It was still acting the fool, almost too hard to use. I also found that in the midst of all the interference, I could not get a Ground Grab. Now this was starting to worry me. I had heard about the sensitivity of this unit, but I was running the SENS down to 30 and the TRESH down near minium - and still having problems For the rest of the hunt at that site, I fought the beeping and blipping, trying all sorts of adjustments to no avail. Worse, the other two detectors I had along - dead simple 1236-X2 and an Ace 250 - were oblivious to any of this.

When I got home I headed out back to try it again and found the same problem. And yes, in my yard is a power transformer on the pole out back.
I have never seen such a severe case of interference in 20 years of detecting.

Finally, I got a little relief. I discovered that by switching from the multi-tone audio modes into the 1, 1F, or 2F modes, I could bring the interference down to tolerable levels. In the end, I was able to run the SENS up to about 40 and the THRESH around 0, but that was the limit.
The noise was still there, but it was just under the surface and really not a problem. But, this bodes ill for the future.

I hunt in plenty of urban environments, where electrical interference is likely present. Up 'til now, I haven't noticed this problem with any detector I've owned.... and that's been plenty of them. So, I'm wondering - what will the F70 do when I try it in those places?
 
Had about fifty detectors including two CZ70 pro's.One CZ6 and three CZ 5'S. I know they are great detectors but we just never meshed. I am still on my first set of batteries. So far I am in love with my F70.......Jack
 
Since my last update, I spoke with my friend Mike, in KY about my F70 noise issues.
He suggested I contact another Mike, this time Mike Scott, at First Texas Service. The second Mike, Mike Scott, knew the first Mike, from KY, quite well. Apparently, they are old pals.
Oddly, the second Mike, Mike Scott, who works for Fisher/First Texas - is actually in Wisconsin for the Hollydays, not Texas. The nice folks in Texas gave me his number in Wisconsin, so I could contact him. So between the Two Mikes and First Texas-Wisconsin, some progress has been made.

According to Mike Scott in Wisconsin, the one who works for First Texas, I very likely have a "microphonic" coil. This problem was found on the early F70's and is responsible for the noise issues I am experiencing. Wisconsin Mike, the second one, said I should be able to run my SENS as high as 70 without any noticeable interference issues.
Kentucky Mike, the first Mike, also noted the same thing, so the problem has been with the detector since day one, I guess. First Texas Mike, the second Mike in Wisconsin, has promised to help me work out the issue, so we will proceed come Monday.
What day is Monday in Texas? Or is it Wisconsin? :wacko:




I did a few obligatory air tests with the F70 earlier. Here are the results:
DISC - 15
Tones - 4H
SPEED - default
GROUND GRAB - clear air

GAIN: Max (99), THRESH: 75% (+5) (This was the first setting I reached where micropohnic noise was abated.)

Nickel .............................................. 7"
14K Wedding Band .......................... 8.5"
Clad Dime ....................................... 9"
Clad Quarter .................................... 10"

GAIN: 50% (50) THRESH: 75% (+5)

Nickel................................................ 7" (31 VDI, hi tone)
14K Wedding Band............................. 8" (43 VDI, mid tone)
Clad Dime ......................................... 8" (76 VDI, hi tone)
Clad Quarter ..................................... 9" (80 VDI, hi tone)


GAIN: 50 (50%) THRESH: 50% (0)

Nickel ................................................ 6.5" (33 VDI, hi tone)
14K Wedding Band ............................. 8" (41 VDI, mid tone)
Clad Dime .......................................... 6.5" (70 VDI, hi tone)
Clad Quarter ...................................... 7.5" (82 VDI, hi tone)

It seems the THRESH has a great effect on the response, complementing the gain. I look at it like a sort of boost mode.
I thought it was notable to see how well the 14K wedding band responded.
 
I heard about the problems people were having. It seemed that for every person who praised the F70, there was another who got one with some sort of problem. I went ahead and took the plunge, knowing this, so I shoulder the challenge at this point.

I've read the manual over twice now, noting it's long passages about electrical interference and the F70's susceptability to that phenomenon.
While there appears to be what can only be called an acceptance of interference issues, the fact that they put it in print only heightens my sense of dread, in light of my current experience. The one rather reinforces the other, if you get my meaning.

However, I intend to give it a fair shot, since:

A. I'm committed now, on all fronts.
B. It still recommends itself to me as precisely what I am looking for.

Item "B" is very important to me. It's the reason I got into the F70 in the first place.
I'm confident the Fisher tech specialist, Mike Scott, knows what he's talking about and there is nothing wrong with the detector itself... just the coil.
 
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