How to choose the better F75?

[Paul from Kiev]

I was told that one unit is more sensitive, but another is less sensitive. So, may be they are unequal in quality and stability among themselves, aren't they? How to choose 'the right" detector, if a dealer would suggest me to choose by myself?

 

[Shambler]

How to choose 'the right" detector, if a dealer would suggest me to choose by myself?

Buy a Minelab! Just kidding. From what I've gathered they are all similiarly sensitive, but some are a bit more "chatty" than others.

 

[Sunny Jim]

The F75 is made in a very consistent manner. The same for the other F series machines. Buy what you can afford, with the features you like best. The manuals can be downloaded.

Very few have been unhappy with their F75's and only those few sour grapes, do not read and re-read the manual. There may have been some that had real issues, and that happens with most all consumer electronics. The warranty is 5 years from date of purchase. The F75 is an excellent single frequency machine as it was designed to be. Be sure you get new -in-box and not an abused show-room model from the big box stores.
If you are new to detecting, you may not appreciate how well it performs without a reference. There is in my opinion, no better single frequency platform out there.

The F5 has had good reports and while not offering all the same features of the F75, has had good reports from the owners. Some I think, own both. Fisher is modest in it's advertising and has relied on the testimonies of the owners to promote their products. They have a reason for such confidence in their products, they are strong performers and excellent designs. You can be confident of quality and fisher backing their product. I have heard of no conversation that supports your fears. Maybe someone wants you to buy another make, and scare you away from Fisher????

SJ

 

[Shambler]

lol @ "sour grapes"

See, this is why you don't hear the good WITH the bad on the Fisher specific forums. Most just sell a detector when they think it stinks and take the $300-400 loss if it's high-end AND they unfortunately keep quiet. Helping your fellow hobbyist avoid the disappointment of a machine falling well short of the "best machine ever" label it's given will get you labeled stubborn, stupid, or having a poor attitude (albeit, sometimes in a stinky fruit analogy). There are lengthy threads from two other sites discussing exactly what he's asking. It's why he's asked it. It sounds like he's already decided to buy one, so it may be better to give him some hints on how to tell which among several is better.

I would encourage him to post questions about any manufacturers quality control on a more general forum.

Sunny Jim - how many F75's do you own?

 

[Sunny Jim]

I own one. I bought it from A an d S detectors for $935.00, April 2, 2007 and the serial number is 03073075

And yourself?

Yes this is a fisher forum and has happy fisher owners as a rule.
Over the years there have been those that like to dis the Fisher, FT products and group. SOUR GRAPES

What brand do you use??? Welches?

 

[jim tn]

get the F 75, give it enough time to learn and get used to it and yours will have the same good sensitivity as all of ours. HH jim tn

 

[Shambler]

I'm actually on my second and there's a difference between the two. It's not my go-to machine because as a coin hunter, I'm most often in city parks and on private property. In these locations it is more often unusable than usable. If I find myself on a rural lot or in a wooded area, it's literally unbeatable (when I consider other detectors I now or have used). The weight and balance are unsurpassed and the depth and separation of the stock DD is better than anything I've used. The notch and discrimination stink like small pieces of rotten fruit, however this F75 is better than my previous one. The first one would need a factory reset every 2 hours because the stability would degrade over time.

My reason for asking you how many you've owned is because you took some liberties in assuming everyone is happy with the detector, guessed that there's no quality control issues, THEN preemptively insulted those that might disagree. Your comment about no better performing single freq unit is probably correct - although I've not used MOST of the single freq units out there so I can't make that claim. I've heard from a few people I trust that the CZ70 and CZ3D perform as well and are much more stable units.

Oh yeah...and why did I buy a second one? ...because someone had the GRAPES to tell the truth. If they hadn't I'd have sold the first one, and may have never purchased from Fisher again. Now I see it's a very good unit even though the love affair from these forums is still greatly exaggerated.

Note to Paul from Kiev: If you DO find yourself at a dealer that's crazy enough to hang several on his wall and allows you to chose......use factory defaults first - you will most likely have similar performance between any unit you test (however do some air testing to be sure). Then crank up the sens and either change to JE or notch out something above 30 and pick the one that's most stable. Very "hot" and very unstable or very close on this unit.

 

[Sunny Jim]

I said.

"Very few have been unhappy with their F75's and only those few sour grapes, do not read and re-read the manual. There may have been some that had real issues, and that happens with most all consumer electronics. The warranty is 5 years from date of purchase. The F75 is an excellent single frequency machine as it was designed to be. Be sure you get new -in-box and not an abused show-room model from the big box stores."


She said,
"My reason for asking you how many you've owned is because you took some liberties in assuming everyone is happy with the detector, guessed that there's no quality control issues, THEN preemptively insulted those that might disagree. " ( i interpret as: whatever)

You are entitled to be happy with what you own, but it is up to you.
Some consumer products have a 90 day warranty. That is because through the study of statistics, that is the period of proof when most failures occur. That is an acceptable warranty.

The F75 has a 5 year warranty. That in some instances is worth the cost of a new machine if it should fail in that period. If you have warranty issues, get the bag balm out and deal with it. The metal detector manufacturers all have good warranties, some better than others. When you see a 5 year warranty, that is significant because if the the thing smokes in 4.5 years, you get it serviced under warranty. If you ever worked in manufacturing (made something) you would know things can go wrong. That is why there are quantity controls. Please read Statistical Quality Control Handbook, by AT&T,... FYI.

The metal detector industry has some good warranties, and unlike the majority of consumer electronics out there you are not faced with the reality of having to buy a new product because there is no one to service it.

SJ

PS A Space Shuttle launch was scrubbed because a microchip failed: Somebody sneezed in the clean room! Big name Manufacturer too. Poo-poo happens.

 

[Shambler]

I wonder why folks want certain serial numbers for the CZ3D when most of those have a LIFETIME warranty.... never mind we already know.... later models performed differently AND warranty had nothing to do with it.

The question was, is there a difference among the detectors and how do you tell. You've again made a leap of faith based on a warranty that means little if they send it back not fixed, no longer DBA as the same company, or repair it 5 times during the hunting season. First year business students (who haven't MADE a damn thing) know warranty statistical analysis is based ENTIRELY on profit so your premise may not apply depending on the profitability of the system.

If a widget costs $1 to make and I can sell it for $50 and my reliability is 50%, then I can hand out warranties like candy. I'm certainly not saying that's the case with THIS "system", but you can see how basing a purchase or opinion of a product on warranty doesn't work.

Calling me "she" is exactly what causes problems here - come on man!.

 

[marcomo]

I was going to stay out of this. I think Shambler and Sunny Jim both make valid points here.

But Sunny Jim, your "she said" aside was uncalled for.

 

[jim tn]

n/t

 

[jmaryt]

warranty can be crucial when you are dealing with a delicate electronic instrument!..like a metal detector!..today IF you can get a manufacturer to warranty an item for 5 years,then rest assured you have an EXCELLENT warranty!..if fisher is willing to stick it's proverbial neck out,and gurantee the f-75 for 5 years,then "hot damn!" it HAS to be better built than most people say it is,OR they just would NOT give such a long warranty!..makes sense!,and is just excellent marketing strategy as far as i am concerned!..gotta tell ya!..it SOLD me!

(h.h!)
j.t.

 

[Sunny Jim]

Sorry, I thought you were a woman.

Sounds like you are an expert on tangential discussions.

So back to my question, What do you own?

And,... are you happy with it or does ownership cause you to bleat?

First year students do not have a clue about the real world and to get to the level of understanding on the book I mentioned, takes some prerequisite advanced math. And BTW, this handbook is not for sale through ordinary commercial channels. It is not stat 101.

To say that applied statistics is "ENTIRELY" all about profit is so very, very wrong. I think you are confused with cost accounting.

STATISTICAL QUALITY CONTROL HANDBOOK COPYRIGHT 1956 by Western Electric Co.

page 3, part A: INTRODUCTION TO STATISTICAL QUALITY CONTROL
"Statistical Quality control is a scientific method of analysing data and using analysis to solve practical problems. It can be applied to anything that is it is possible to express in the form of numbers. In a manufacturing plant it can be applied to
Engineering problems
Operating problems
Inspection problems
Management problems
Accounting and clerical problems
or virtually any other field of activity. Few of us can think of anything, in connection with our own jobs, that is not associated in some way with numbers."

What is your point?
SJ

 

[Elton]

N/T removed by poster

 

[Shambler]

Have you answered the man's question yet? My above post says I have owned two. I had one that went to Fisher 3 times and came back with "nothing" wrong. When I asked questions about it, I was accused of being too stupid and stubborn to operate it (but just barely smart enough to operate my EXII I suppose). I sold it! I swung another individuals F75 a few months later and it was an entirely different machine. Based on that, I picked one up used. It's very different. There are a few places where you can speak more frankly about these things than Findmall - and this thread is an example of why.

My point? Well brother, you based your opinion of Fisher's quality control - in relation to Paul's question, which was a request for advice on how to tell the difference between two possibly different manufacturing runs of a detector - on Fisher's warranty. Then you used that warranty to make an argument that there can be no quality control issues with these detectors. And I'm diverting the discussion? This was all said regardless of known issue with this one and known issue with previous models. Different runs can produce different detectors.

statistics is "ENTIRELY" all about profit

Booooo! You misquoted me to make a different argument :sad: (and then said I was doing the bait-and-switch game in the argument.... )

Statistical analysis of your product to determine an appropriate warranty length is based on profit. No business could offer you a lengthy warranty (especially on a device designed to be rubbed on the ground, thrown in the back of a truck, etc.) based on a statistical analysis that did not have profitability at the top of the equation. For example, you can take two pieces of similarly graded steel and make them into the same size wrench ONE will sell at Wally's with a Stanley name and have no warranty. The other will be stamped Craft5man, be marked up 40% and have a lifetime warranty. A statistical analysis of the failure rate of the two wrenches will present no difference, but the one has a lifetime warranty. The warranty proved nothing other than you were willing to shell out money for false peace of mind.. It certainly didn't tell you that one was better than the other.

If I had to guess (and I have no idea if I'm correct - but I bet I'm close), I'd say the manufacturer can replace the one circuit board or the coil in these detectors 4 or 5 times before the profit margin is gone.

Back to Paul from Kiev: The difference in my two as I was trying to say early in the thread was stability or as some have described "susceptibility to EMI". I'd crank them all up and see which is b1tching at you the least. Good luck Paul.

This all reminds me of a hilarious scene in Tommy Boy where Chris Farley is discussing a Guarantee stamped on a box. LOL. Those of you that have seen it will get a smile remembering it

 

[Sunny Jim]

OK Shambler, you win the brow-beating.
I am glad you like what you own, having given the F75 a second chance.

I hope Paul is happy in his selection too.

Sorry if I misunderstood the value of a good warranty and misquoted you. I did not know warranties were some kind of way to skin the customer and maintain the profit margins.

If I was misleading in trying to answer Paul's concern, I was not knowledgeable of your particular distress. Shame on me!
No harm intended Paul.

have a day.
SJ

 

[Daniel Tn]

One of my hunting buddies just got a F-75. Of course that is my primary machine as well. We were hunting side by side the other day and I thought it neat that two units of the same make/model could operate so close together without interference. I always run my frequency on F-7 and I asked him out of curiousity of which one he had his on since I had shown him how to set the machine up. He had his on F-7 as well. Hmmm. Now why were those two able to do that without chattering? Well I began flipping through the 7 frequencies and my unit on F-6 absolutely goes CRAZY with his on F-7. But when the two are on F-7 they can hunt within a couple of yards of one another. Seems like they would only chatter if on the same frequency but on those two machines, they are obviously different frequencies even if its showing they are the same.

 

[Shambler]

What would be really cool is if someone had inside information on how many are run at a time and what's the delay between runs. Are they the same factory making the boards each time they manufacture? Is there any change in board level components between facilities? It's stuff we'll probably never know...

 

[Dan-Pa.]

Ones ground mineralization and outside interference potential.

Operator ability.

Properly operating unit and shipping can contribute as Fisher may send operating properly and shipper may or may not conribute to it not operating correctly.

Heck tolerances of units are not 100 percent and tuning may vary so units may differ a tad.( just a fact of life with detectors no matter what the brand)....