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Hey F.O.D..............

A

Art (NWOH)

New member
ID voltage on the GT is measuring 1.732 volts at the connector for all coils.

Beats me why the S-12 still gives a lower than normal ID on the meter. It just don't figure.
It sounds like crap, which is why I replaced it with a 12.5" detech for a larger coil last year.

HH

Art
 
The GT must use a slightly different voltage, but my SunRay DTI III works on the GT as well on Elite and the XS series detectors the same and with its calibration control it is close to the center position. I used a different SunRays on the Elite too when I had it and I thinks it had to be adjusted slightly higher when I took it off the XS2 I had, but only like 5 numbers and felt it was the coil that made the difference as I went form a 8 inch coinsearch to the 10 inch Tornado coil.
I do know from Experience that when you change coils you have to change the calibration a bit as a bigger or smaller coil it will varry the same as when the meter gets hot from the heat.
One thing I will say for those with the Elite or the GT is if you use freq 1 the nickles will read higher on the meter than they normaly will. Instead of the normal 144-145 they will read 147-148 on the 180 meter. The higher conductivity ones will read the same on either freq.

Glad to hear you got it fixed and if I get time latter today I am going to try a new Elite control box on my GT and leave the meter set the same and see what the difference in the 180 numbers are.

Rick
 
Art,

I just had to see what the difference is so I tried a new Elite control box on my GT set up with the SunRay DTI 3.
Being I use the same coil, the same meter I even used the same battery pack so the only difference would be the control box.
I set the GT to read 180 on a quarter and would bounce down to 179 at times which is normal, the zinc penny read 176-177 that is normal and the nickle at 144-145 in freq 2, but in freq 1 it read 148-149 which is all normal.
Now I put the battery in the Elite and use all the same setting and didnt change any of the meter calibrations. The quarter read now 181-182 thew zinc reads 178-179 and the nickle read 145-146 in freq 2, but freq 1 reads 150-151. This shows the GT produces slightly less voltage than the Elite and I bet the Elite is slightly less than the XS series we are used to. Now this is only a number or 2 on the 180 meter, but on a 550 number this could be 4-7 number difference and maybe why the meter wouldnt calibrate to the correct numbers as the 550 meters where those used on the XS2a and then added to the Elites, but they were within spec so they were not changed, but not for the GT as it has slightly less voltage so it wont work unless you do a internal calibration with the coarse control.
The SunRay DTI has a touchier calibration contol and a wider range of numbers is why this dont make any difference on which Sovereign you use this meter on.
I see where Joe Patrick posted he had to do a update for the Patriot meter too for the GT on his fourm.

Rick
 
This was pretty strange, Rick.....

If you were following the posts about how the two different meters were working or not working with different coils on two different detectors, then you should be as confused as I am.

To pretty well sum the whole thing up...........

The new meter needed to be adjusted UP quite a bit.

AND........

The S-12 is FUBAR.

I think I know what the problem is with the S-12, but do not have the test equipment to verify the theory.

The explanation seems plausible as to why the ID voltage would be right while the meter reading is excessively low.

It gets very involved, and unless you have a VERY good understanding of electronics, you would not be able to understand it.

End result........

New meter is on the GT. S-12 is in the "no longer used pile " with the 14" Detech which went FUBAR last year.

Would have did some modification to the new meter if necessary. It's not beneath my dignity to replace a resistor with a 20 turn pot.

HH
Art

 
With only such a small variation I would not think there should be a problem.

I set my new meter up to adjust to slightly over 600 and a little under 500 with the GT. Must say that it is more stable and calibrates easier if adjusted to 500 instead of 550. Not much resolution loss, but easier to live with.
Might just try it this way for a while. (500 cal).

Did not try switching back to the 2a to see what would happen.

HH
Art
 
Just wanted to drop in here on the meter topic. I have an original Sovereign from 1991 and also a new Sovereign GT. I have an updated Patriot meter, this meter works fine on either detector and will auto calibrate each and every time on either detector. I had a problem with the original Sovereign meter (Block cursor type) on the GT; it always read coins lower than on the original Sovereign. On the GT, coins registered at high pull tab with the original (Block cursor type) meter. I really like being able to use the Patriot meter on both detectors, this is a more definitive meter and provides more accurate target information. I have used it with an 8" Coinsearch, Seasearch and 10" Tornado 1000 coils with no problems. The mounting options on the Patriot makes it adaptable to either Sovereign that I use and is very functional as well i.e. handle mount on the GT or pole mount on the S-pole. It may be a little pricey, but I feel that it is well worth the money, especially if you have multiple Sovereign units of different models, one meter works on all of them, I think that over the long run it is a money saver.



Rick (PA)

 
Rick,

This is the same as the SunRay DTI meter as they will work on any of the Sovereigns I have used with no problems. The Patriot may sound like a great meter and one I hope to try someday, but to me I cant see where it can do anything the SunRay cant do, but I will never know untill I try one will I?? I feel for a person new to the Sovereign it may help them learn it more, but for the person that knows the Sovereign well most go by the tones and how they respond more than the meter reading as the deep ones will not be accurate.
Like I say I hope someday to try one and then I will know for sure, but untill then my SunRays will be on my Sovereigns as i know what they can do for me.

I would like to hear more feedback on the Patriot as how deep they can get accurate ID and how often a deep coin will fool the Patriot and ID it as iron.

Rick
 
Art,

I noticed your posts concerning the S-12 which you say is not working properly. I am sorry you are having a problem with it. Have you considered sending it in to us so we can test it? We do have the equipment. We cannot fix anything on an Internet Forum and I do not recall you ever having contacted us with the problem. Call me at 319-636-2244 and I will visit with you about the problem and give you an address to send it to for testing. Thank you.

Ralph (Sun Ray)
 
Hi Ralph.

Never bothered to contact you last year about the coil sounding bad. Made mention of it on the forum at one time, and was told by someone that they have a funny response compared to other coils, so did not think much about it.

There are things I like and dislike about it (can say that about just about anything) and ended up not using it much.

Will give you a call later.

HH
Art
 
Hello Rick. As you are aware I have been using the Patriot meter on my sov Xs for some months now since early this year. As you can expect I have had to change the scale to suite our Australian coins and rubbish targets. Up until I fitted the Patriot meter I have been using the tone system for iding targets and have never used a meter until now. I still go on tone sounds and use the meter to back up my thought on the id of the coin. I use very little discrimination in the parks and no discrimination on the beach. our 5 10 20 50 cents coins have a distinct position on the face of the scale and start from left towards the top end of the meter.Some of the pull tabs and pop tops lie above and below the 10 cent position. The 20 and 50 cent coins are close together with a small opening for our beer bottle tops in between. The $1 and $2 coins come in at the top end of the scale where the 180 position is. All our pre deciminal coins (pre 1966) show up in the same spot at the $1 and $2 coins. The dreaded screw top also comes in at the same spot. I don
 
On the screw caps with the SunRay DTI meter I notice the numbers are 1 number higher in most cases, but that is about 70% of the time, so it is not perfect either, but it helps.

Now I had heard on the iron sentry on the Patriot could not be trusted as it will show iron when it is a deep coin and wondered if anyone else had notice that. I have seen this on the SunRay DTI too a bit in some cases, but doing my 90 degrees pinpoint I can tell it is not iron. I notice on my GT for the first few times iron was fooling me by sounding good, but by going all the way around the signal in disc also helps a lot to see if you can keep it in the same spot.

Like I say I hope to be able to try one of the new Patriot meters soon to see for myself.

Rick
 
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