Low-Boy/LCPM
Active member
Can you tell me how old this is. It was found in California
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- Thread starter Low-Boy/LCPM
- Start date
The shield looks exactly like the shield on seated liberty dimes.
I've never seen an embossed eagle quite like that.
What are the dimensions?
What other types of things were found nearby? Could you post pictures of them if any?
Is it belt buckle size or suspender buckle size?
Just by the style I'm thinking gold rush era (1840's to mid 1850's).
I've never seen an embossed eagle quite like that.
What are the dimensions?
What other types of things were found nearby? Could you post pictures of them if any?
Is it belt buckle size or suspender buckle size?
Just by the style I'm thinking gold rush era (1840's to mid 1850's).
ThatCannonballGuy
New member
Macaco [Steve in California] wrote:
>I've never seen an embossed eagle quite like that.
If you have a copy of the A.H. Albert button-book, go to page 200 and look at the photos of NY-17. It shows the exact same eagle flying over the same shield. This was the emblem the New York National Guard (a.k.a. the NY State Militia) at the time the buckle was made.
>Just by the style I'm thinking gold rush era (1840's to mid 1850's.
From going "just by the style" that's a very good guess, Steve. : ) In view of the dates of the NY Guard buttons, your guess is dead-on correct.
Regards,
TheCannonballGuy [P.C. George]
>I've never seen an embossed eagle quite like that.
If you have a copy of the A.H. Albert button-book, go to page 200 and look at the photos of NY-17. It shows the exact same eagle flying over the same shield. This was the emblem the New York National Guard (a.k.a. the NY State Militia) at the time the buckle was made.
>Just by the style I'm thinking gold rush era (1840's to mid 1850's.
From going "just by the style" that's a very good guess, Steve. : ) In view of the dates of the NY Guard buttons, your guess is dead-on correct.
Regards,
TheCannonballGuy [P.C. George]
Angela (Australia)
New member
n/t
FrontierWest
New member
n/t
Chuck@TreasureHut
New member
Incredible find, and I concur with the previous members guesses. Definitely militia, and definitel pre-1860. Great find!!!
CXhuck@TreasureHut
CXhuck@TreasureHut
Steve in PA
New member
n/t
The tongue and wreath buckle there, is actually from two different buckles. Both pieces are of stamped brass, and from buckles that were commercially manufactured during the 1850's. That particular tongue (high domed flying eagle over a shield), fits a narrow wreath with a design that resembles berries and leaves. The correct wreath for that buckle tongue, also has a narrow belt loop with the lined design.
The wreath pictured with buckle tongue above, is a plain style stamped wreath. There are several varieties of buckle tongues for this particular style wreath. The most common, is the upright spread wing eagle on a lined background, with a rope border. Another variety is one made by Bondy Brothers of New York, with a eagle design in the center, along with their company name in a circle around the eagle. The stamped brass Bondy Brothers buckles also have the company name stamped in the belt loop portion of the wreath side .
These stamped buckles were mass produced, to supply the great demand for ready made clothing during the California Gold Rush. These thin stamped buckles, copy the style and design of the military buckles of the Mexican War, and earlier years.
In this photo of young "Argonauts of '49"; the fellow on our far left wears a leather belt with a tongue-and-wreath buckle. This buckle appears to be a cast brass 1840 artillery style buckle.
[attachment 26711 silverandgold9.jpg]
With the great influx of thousands of gold seekers, and the enterprising businessmen that followed; there was a tremendous demand for clothing. Prior to the Gold Rush, there was virtually no ready made "off-the-shelf" clothing available to buy anywhere in America. Clothing at that time was custom made by tailors, and seamstresses. The California Gold Rush changed everything. Dry goods dealers, and supply houses in New York, and other cities and areas; began selling ready made clothing in popular sizes and styles. Factories were established, employing hundreds of people to cut, and sew cloth, for clothing. Many of these East Coast supply houses opened branch offices, and stores, in California. William Taussig was one of the principal New York dealers, in goods and supplies, opening a branch in San Francisco during the height of the Gold Rush. The business of W. Taussig & Co. , offered cloth belts with stamped brass tongue-and-wreath buckles, that had the company name prominently featured in the design on the buckle face. This was a form of early advertisement to generate name recognition, and brand loyalty, (like Tommy Hilfiger, Nike, and scores of others do now). During the 1850's, other companies, and clothing dealers, also had cloth belts with the stamped brass two-piece buckles. These thin stamped buckles were cheap to make, and easy to produce in quantity. Even though they were made cheap, the companies that supplied these buckles no doubt still sold them at a very good profit in the inflated markets of the California Gold Rush. Sort of like Wal-Mart, except you didn't have to watch for falling prices; those prices were heading the other way! Businessmen soon found that there was easier gold pickins' in the pockets of miners, than in the rivers and streams!
These thin buckles rarely held up for long in the rough-and-tumble life "Out West". Although bits and pieces of these stamped buckles are frequently encountered. The complete, and intact, buckles are rarely seen.
Here is a example of a buckle from; Taussig, Pollack & Co.
This dates to around 1855, or 1856, when Taussig formed a partnership with Pollack.
[attachment 26713 TaussigBuckle.jpg]
This M. Cohen & Brother / San Fransisco Cal., buckle is in remarkably near perfect condition, and even has the original belt adjuster. I know of only a few other examples of this buckle.
[attachment 26721 CalBuckle3.JPG]
CC Hunter
The wreath pictured with buckle tongue above, is a plain style stamped wreath. There are several varieties of buckle tongues for this particular style wreath. The most common, is the upright spread wing eagle on a lined background, with a rope border. Another variety is one made by Bondy Brothers of New York, with a eagle design in the center, along with their company name in a circle around the eagle. The stamped brass Bondy Brothers buckles also have the company name stamped in the belt loop portion of the wreath side .
These stamped buckles were mass produced, to supply the great demand for ready made clothing during the California Gold Rush. These thin stamped buckles, copy the style and design of the military buckles of the Mexican War, and earlier years.
In this photo of young "Argonauts of '49"; the fellow on our far left wears a leather belt with a tongue-and-wreath buckle. This buckle appears to be a cast brass 1840 artillery style buckle.
[attachment 26711 silverandgold9.jpg]
With the great influx of thousands of gold seekers, and the enterprising businessmen that followed; there was a tremendous demand for clothing. Prior to the Gold Rush, there was virtually no ready made "off-the-shelf" clothing available to buy anywhere in America. Clothing at that time was custom made by tailors, and seamstresses. The California Gold Rush changed everything. Dry goods dealers, and supply houses in New York, and other cities and areas; began selling ready made clothing in popular sizes and styles. Factories were established, employing hundreds of people to cut, and sew cloth, for clothing. Many of these East Coast supply houses opened branch offices, and stores, in California. William Taussig was one of the principal New York dealers, in goods and supplies, opening a branch in San Francisco during the height of the Gold Rush. The business of W. Taussig & Co. , offered cloth belts with stamped brass tongue-and-wreath buckles, that had the company name prominently featured in the design on the buckle face. This was a form of early advertisement to generate name recognition, and brand loyalty, (like Tommy Hilfiger, Nike, and scores of others do now). During the 1850's, other companies, and clothing dealers, also had cloth belts with the stamped brass two-piece buckles. These thin stamped buckles were cheap to make, and easy to produce in quantity. Even though they were made cheap, the companies that supplied these buckles no doubt still sold them at a very good profit in the inflated markets of the California Gold Rush. Sort of like Wal-Mart, except you didn't have to watch for falling prices; those prices were heading the other way! Businessmen soon found that there was easier gold pickins' in the pockets of miners, than in the rivers and streams!
These thin buckles rarely held up for long in the rough-and-tumble life "Out West". Although bits and pieces of these stamped buckles are frequently encountered. The complete, and intact, buckles are rarely seen.
Here is a example of a buckle from; Taussig, Pollack & Co.
This dates to around 1855, or 1856, when Taussig formed a partnership with Pollack.
[attachment 26713 TaussigBuckle.jpg]
This M. Cohen & Brother / San Fransisco Cal., buckle is in remarkably near perfect condition, and even has the original belt adjuster. I know of only a few other examples of this buckle.
[attachment 26721 CalBuckle3.JPG]
CC Hunter
..........with the correct original wreath. This one here belongs to a friend of mine.
[attachment 26724 EagleShieldBuckle.jpg]
My father has found two of those very same style buckle tongues. I have personally found one perfect tongue, along with a damaged wreath.
These stamped brass tongue-and-wreath buckles often turn up in 1850's, and early 1860's sites on the West Coast. Rarely are these buckles found in sites that date after the Civil War period.
CC Hunter
[attachment 26724 EagleShieldBuckle.jpg]
My father has found two of those very same style buckle tongues. I have personally found one perfect tongue, along with a damaged wreath.
These stamped brass tongue-and-wreath buckles often turn up in 1850's, and early 1860's sites on the West Coast. Rarely are these buckles found in sites that date after the Civil War period.
CC Hunter
..........with the correct original wreath. This one here belongs to a friend of mine.
[attachment 26725 EagleShieldBuckle.jpg]
My father has found two of those very same style buckle tongues. I have personally found one perfect tongue, along with a damaged wreath.
These stamped brass tongue-and-wreath buckles often turn up in 1850's, and early 1860's sites on the West Coast. Rarely are these buckles found in sites that date after the Civil War period.
CC Hunter
[attachment 26725 EagleShieldBuckle.jpg]
My father has found two of those very same style buckle tongues. I have personally found one perfect tongue, along with a damaged wreath.
These stamped brass tongue-and-wreath buckles often turn up in 1850's, and early 1860's sites on the West Coast. Rarely are these buckles found in sites that date after the Civil War period.
CC Hunter
..........with the correct original wreath. This one here belongs to a friend of mine.
[attachment 26726 EagleShieldBuckle.jpg]
My father has found two of those very same style buckle tongues. I have personally found one perfect tongue, along with a damaged wreath.
These stamped brass tongue-and-wreath buckles often turn up in 1850's, and early 1860's sites on the West Coast. Rarely are these buckles found in sites that date after the Civil War period.
CC Hunter
[attachment 26726 EagleShieldBuckle.jpg]
My father has found two of those very same style buckle tongues. I have personally found one perfect tongue, along with a damaged wreath.
These stamped brass tongue-and-wreath buckles often turn up in 1850's, and early 1860's sites on the West Coast. Rarely are these buckles found in sites that date after the Civil War period.
CC Hunter
Low-Boy/LCPM
Active member
It is not a perfect match but close so I still don't know the year?
A
Anonymous
Guest
Prior to the War of the Great Rebellion, CA had a number of US Troops stationed there. I have a number of pre CW relics that came from CA. Two of the more famous figures stationed in CA were Hancock and Armistead. They were as close as brothers and fate found them facing each other at Gettysburg in July 1863. Armistead was mortally wounded at the stone wall (3rd day @ "Pickett's Charge) and Hancock was wounded but survived the battle. If your plate is thin stamped brass, it is referred to as a sash buckle. Heavier brass would have been for field use. Nice find, David @ Dixie