FOUND OLD HAND GUN.:surrender:

[kcdigit]

Went diving with SD in the big lake after work and found lots of sinkers and this .32 cal. pistol. It appears to be very old and has an octagon barrel, it is made to load the bullets through the side without pulling the cylinder out. Cant see any markings on it, if anyone knows how old it is and possible the brand I would appreciate your input. Gee I wonder why it was tossed in the lake??? Buy the way this is my first gun I have ever found and SD can't have it. My camera is gone so I borrowed one and it has the wrong date on the pictures, so ignore that date

 

[scubadetector]

Super find I would say! Look at this one Kevin Third one down

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H_&_R_Firearms

Herrington & Ridchardson Model 4 or American double action

http://www.northwestfirearms.com/handgun-classifieds/99002-h-r-model-1904-6-shot-32-s-w-revolver-nickel.html

 

[kcdigit]

Thank SD it sure looks like it.

 

[Critterhunter]

If it were me I would turn that in to the authorities. You'd be surprised how they can take even an old rusted gun and still get ballistics out of it to try to match to bullets on record pulled from bodies. Might be an old crime that was never solved, and if the gun can be traced back to the owner then case solved.

I might think that it's something I want to hang onto, but I'd keep thinking if a family member of mine was murdered and the person was never caught I'd want justice.

I'm not trying to tell you what to do, I'm just saying it would bother me to no end if I didn't hand it over to the police just in case there is even a slight possibility it might bring justice to somebody who was wrongly killed.

 

[kcdigit]

Critter Hunter already planned on it. Thanks.

 

[scubadetector]

They WILL NOT do balistics on it. It is inoperatable also. I turned 4 into the police so far. Three I got back after a year and a half. They clean them up and look for a serial number and try to trace them. This one is too old. No serial number that we can see. All they are going to do is ruin it by cleaning it. They broke one of mine in half.

IF you decide you have to give it to the police, DON';T give it to the local sheriff. They hold it for a long time and then give it to the State Police. I would go directly to the State Police with it.

My Taurus is still with the local police department where I found it and that is a different story. It was new and has a serial number. Any gun over a certain age without a serial number is completly untraceable. They will never find out if it was used in a crime.

 

[Critterhunter]

I'm not so sure about that. I've watched those reality crime shows (not the fake ones, but the real "follow the detective" type of shows dealing with real evidence), and I've seen them take guns that looked in worse shape than that and are able to get ballistic fingerprints off them to solve a crime. There are certain traits to the barrel and firing pin that will survive even years of rust. And, if a serial # is grinded off the gun, I've seen them use acid or computer enhanced viewing technology to be able to gather a serial # from it. I think they even use some kind of sound or micro waves to be able to see the serial #s due to slight densitity changes in the metal well below the serial #s from the force of stamping them, even if they grinded the # completely off the gun.

Amazing what kind of things they can do these days to lead to the killer of a crime. But, beyond all that, whether I thought it was possible or not for them to place that gun with some crime, I'd always feel guilty if I never gave them the chance to find out.

 

[scubadetector]

As I stated, they have already had FOUR of my guns. They NEVER tried to do balistics.

 

[bob.oz]

How cool,nice "OLD" gun........ and appropriately represented with all that lead....WTG

 

[Salida]

I agree. Turn it in. At least they can use CSI to get a serial number off it and see just
how old it really is. Could have been used in a crime. More than likely it was; why else
would someone dump it in the water. There is just a slim chance it was accidently
dropped in the water.
Salida

 

[mudpuppy]

Sure it was used in a crime! Thats why it was tossed in the water, from the looks of it, back in the 1800's! Maybe CSI can determine if thats the one Sven used to rob Ole out of his muskrat pelts, which is still an open case I hear...I could understand turning in a fresh one, but not something like this...sooner or later, most of us will come across a fresh drop of this type, and its good to know how to proceed with it...Nice find Kevin!
Mud

 

[Sailorman]

If it's old enough there was never a serial number to start with. even if there's one on an old gun they never ecorded the sale so it's untraceable. Now for reality. If the barrel is well corroded they are not pulling any groove information off the barrel. Same with firing pin markings. Corrosion and time will remove it all. Reality shows rarely have a lot to do with reality. Think of the so called reality shows on detecting.

You got a neat old find. Now a modern arm might get turned in but that's not going to solve any old crimes I think.

 

[Salida]

It might have been used by Dillenger or Bonny and Clyde. Teh heh heh.

 

[grumpy]

Well its a cool find. The rest is simple put it in your collection and forget the tv shows. I worked for 40 years on guns and i can tell you without a doubt they have no records of that gun. Secondly it is not and never will be shootable to detect a balistic on it, The guns were produced "saturday night specials" by the droves and were not worth fixing when they were new. I remember when I was a young gunsmith I bought out another older gentlemans (gunsmith) estate and got a 55 gallon drum of the things, H&R , Iver Johnson and so on.
Serious it is a cool find put it into your collection and admire, dont waste your time trying to find the shooter of a 30's bootleger bust.
Grumpy

 

[Critterhunter]

So you are saying reality crime shows like "The First 48" are fake shows? If you are then I don't think you've watched a show of this type. They do some amazing stuff with evidence these days, AND....more importantly...When things used in a crime can't yield evidence at this current time, they often bag and store that evidence to see what future technology might be able to do with it. Thank God they did that with items years ago, long before the idea of DNA was even dreamed of, because they had the forsite to know that down the road new technology might come along that changes things.

And how are you guys so sure that gun was used in a crime eons ago? People use old cheap guns all the time in crimes. It could have been pitched 60 years ago or only 5 years ago in the water. Often crooks use whatever guns they steal from break ins. That gun could easily have been sitting in a drawer somewhere and somebody only in the last decade stole it, used it for a crime, and then threw it in the water.

You guys do what you want. All I'm saying is that if you had somebody in your family killed with a hand gun years ago and the crime was never solved, you'd be hoping and praying that anybody who finds a gun metal detecting would turn it into authorities. I'd feel guilty playing god and deciding that I know better than authorities that a gun I found was not worthy of yielding any evidence. That's not my expertise, and even if it can't right now, a few years down the road I've got no idea what they might come up with with advancements in technology.

That's just me though. I wouldn't be able to enjoy such a find sitting in a display case in my house, always wondering if there was even a slight chance something could have been done with it. Morality is a very subjective thing though, so if you think it's not an in moral act to keep the gun then I guess nobody can tell you otherwise, so if you see no problem with keeping a gun and can enjoy it then more power to you.

 

[scubadetector]

I turned in FOUR old guns to the police. They will NOT do a balistics test. Because the lands and grooves are so gone its IMPOSSIBLE to do one also. I was also a cop for 9 years. ALL they will do is see if its opperational AND see if a serial number is on it. If its opperational and no serial number they will destroy it. THAT is ALL they do here.

 

[Critterhunter]

Here's the question I ask myself...If I had a love one killed by a gun and nobody was ever caught, or say they had a suspect but needed more evidence, would I want Joe Public deciding what guns they find metal detecting are not worth turning over to authorities? Of course not, I'd want every person finding every gun to not think for themselves about what they deem worthy of turning in just in case there is one slight little chance they can finally bring somebody to justice.

What if the gun was only recently (last decade or so) pitched in the water and somebody saw the suspect throwing something in the water or he was caught on film doing so. What if they had that kind of evidence and searched the water for a specific gun they are pretty sure he had stolen when robbing a house, and in the act had used to to kill the home owner? Maybe they had their suspect and just needed a bit more evidence to build a stronger case. Maybe that gun was documented with detailed pictures for home insurance reasons and had some distinguishing details that can be seen in pictures?

They may have searched that water right there and didn't come up with what they knew they were looking for, but when a guy metal detecting says "this is where I found it", something clicks and they pull out an old case where their suspect was witnessed to have thrown something in the water at that very spot? If they had that piece of evidence it might not convict the guy but little things like that can add up in building a case. Often people aren't convicted on one solid piece of evidence, but rather a bunch of little pieces that all point to the same conclusion.

You might consider the above to be a ton of "maybes" and a huge stretch, but I'm simply saying that for me that kind of doubt rattling around in my head would kill any enjoyment I got out of keeping a gun, and that I don't feel qualified to decide what I don't need to bother with submitting to the police. All I'm saying is that if there's any chance then I'd have to give it a shot, just so I didn't have any doubt in my mind. That's just me though. To each his own.

 

[a56digger]

I" tried to turn in a .22 mag. revolver to the Abilene P. D. Texas. A city of 110,000 people. The officer of the watch ( highest ranking street cop on duty) was the officer that came to house. He tried to tell me it was a "BB " gun. I asked what made him think I was a "BB" gun. He pointed that ejector rod and spring and said " see here is the cocking rod." I showed him on the other under cylinder where stamped in metal is. 22 MAGNUM ONLY. Told him I a Colt. and a Ruger that I ejected shell cases the same way. The Officer looked it me like I three eyeballs or same thing.