First Question ---- Does the audio and the visual function (report) independently of each other?

[Mike Hillis]

n/t

 

[Rob (IL)]

Yes they are independent of each other. You can set a VDI to zero tone and still see the VDI number. If you uncheck the Visual Reject you can also see the VDI numbers even if you have them rejected.[attachment 162331 Reading.gif].....Rob

 

[Mike Hillis]

Hi Rob,
That didn't answer my question perfectly so let me try again.

Lets me try to rephrase the question. Do the audio and visual reports always match or do they work as separate systems and allow results that conflict with each other. Anotherwords is tone always driven by the VDI number, or could the VDI and tone ID be different. Could I see a low number but hear a higher tone.

On some metal detectors the tone id and the visual id are like two separate detectors, each working independantly off the same signal, each reporting what they interprete the target signal to be. Is the V3 like that?

Thanks,
Mike

 

[TheMarshall]

Hi Rob,
That didn't answer my question perfectly so let me try again.

Lets me try to rephrase the question. Do the audio and visual reports always match or do they work as separate systems and allow results that conflict with each other. Anotherwords is tone always driven by the VDI number, or could the VDI and tone ID be different. Could I see a low number but hear a higher tone.

On some metal detectors the tone id and the visual id are like two separate detectors, each working independantly off the same signal, each reporting what they interpret the target signal to be. Is the V3 like that?

Thanks,
Mike

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Mike, you can make the V3 play Yankee doodle dandy, or respond progressively, tone-wise, for the choice is yours, but to be honest I can't understand why a guy of your calibre is asking such a question?

As you well know, the Fisher F75 process the audio separately (as is done normally in detecting parlance), whilst it samples and produces the visual ID 'Optimally' and usually 'up grades' the value.

I suspect that the latter methodology is to encourage you to dig those targets that that are 'questionable'......

Nothing in the Spectra's reactions, audible or visual, suggests or reflects the Fisher functionalism's.

The White's Spectra is 'honest and true' as per the target's response relative to each frequency applied.

Yes, that means a target can correctly be 'acceptable' @ 22kHz and rejectable @ 2.5 kHz......That's typical of a UK two pence coin.....Copper clad, steel interior.....

The Fisher's VDIs are 'optimistically' categorised compared to the normal audio......

 

[Larry (IL)]

Your VDI #'s can be changed to whatever you want Mike, so yes, you can have a low VDI like 19 and the Tone ID tells me it might be a silver dime. That really gets my attention and my nickel ratio has jumped tremendously since I changed the tone. I expect to find more gold rings that way too. So to answer your question, yes, they are separate and the Tone ID is just a series of assigned tones.......you can change them at will.

 

[Mike Hillis]

No. It was hard for you to tell me that but all of you said the same thing. I thought so but thought maybe I was missing something.

The audio and visual are not independent systems. Everything revolves around the VDI number. The target VDI number drives the tones. You can silence, reject and assign tones to VDI, but in the end it is all related to the VDI number.

Ok.
Thanks,
Mike

 

[bfodnes]

True raw data VDI, I just love the sensitivity to tiny bits of foil and the VDI responses in the 1-5 range.

 

[bfodnes]

I dont see how that can be possible as we can assign each VDI with a tone of our own preference.

Electronics work out the VDI and gives the assigned tone.

I can only come up with one detector that I have had that have separate VDI s from tone and that is the Sov as it has the VDI display inline on the coil wire.

 

[jimpugh]

I aint eating you all's soup .......if you have sound in All Metal in one Ear and Broad band harmonic peaked voltages in three or more frequencies in the other; with High level Equations with 5 processors cooking the beans with tight assembly code..... the fact that with the detector.....(one ear) you can hear a target in all metal..... that is a bouncer (if any thing at all)in the (other ear) ... meter and sound wise .....
I am looking for the fringe..... targets that do not ring true............. until you take A shovel FULL or 2 out of the ground ......Colonial coins are +12 and MORE... in the ground in... 300+ years of trash.....
with the above scenario i am going to rely on the depth gauge and any positive bounce where the screen shot is not to spread out in its pattern and lastly MY good old American Steel Shovel.
I tend to go more for real time snap shots... rather than some one .....cookin the target UP on the display of the fringe domain.... even though both can be effective in the hands of someone that is smarter than there machine....
keep you coil to the soil...

Happy Trails
Jim Pugh

 

[Rob (IL)]

OK, here goes,
I guess the answer is no. There is only one input signal, well, one for each of the 3. The audio can be driven off the unfiltered data input stream - no filtering, pinpoint or all metal search with SAT off, the all metal audio input stream with the SAT, gives indication of the strength of the target, search only all metal search or the all metal portion of mixed mode or the input stream with the ground filters, which gives VDI results, or disc search only. So, in all metal, the VDI display is driven off the input stream that has the ground filters applied, but the audio is driven off the input stream with the SAT applied - does that make them different? Still the same input data though different filters. In disc search, the VDI is calculated from the input stream with the ground filters applied and the audio tone ID is determined from that calculated VDI. The calculated VDI is what is also displayed. So they are the same and the VDI values are what is used to determine if the target is accepted or rejected and the audio adjusted accordingly. Even with tone ID off, the VDI still determines whether to sound the target tone when the target is accepted or go quiet if the target is rejected.

Does that make sense?............[attachment 162483 Reading.gif]........Rob

 

[jbow]

I hate it when you talk Cajun... but I think I know what you said.

Julien

BTW.. Old Forrest is one of my few heroes, I gather from your tagline that you like him too. Have you ever read, "Bedford Forrest and His Critter Company"? It is a great book about a great man.

 

[tony (Orlando FL)]

Mike,

I was out today and had a signal that was broken up/iffy at best. It was kinda good sounding but the vdi never hardly came out of the iron range of about -13ish.

I was getting a hi tone 50% of the time along with tones all the way down to the iron range growl.

It was a 1944 wheat cent along with a nail and plenty of residual rust in the hole

I understand your question and I feel confident the answer is YES. While the V3 has only one input from the coil, it does seem to be analyzed/processed in various ways by different sections within itself, thus the ability to show one vdi and also provide a different audio output IF it is required to do so based on what it has determined the item to possibly be.

I may be incorrect, however it looks to do as you are asking, INDEPENDENTLY is my vote.

Tony

 

[Rob (IL)]

Remember Mike and Tony I also said YES early in the post. What I posted last came from Whites. You don't think I know that much about the electronics processing. But then that's why I don't build detectors.[attachment 162593 rolling.gif]...Rob

 

[TheMarshall]

Your VDI #'s can be changed to whatever you want Mike, so yes, you can have a low VDI like 19 and the Tone ID tells me it might be a silver dime. That really gets my attention and my nickel ratio has jumped tremendously since I changed the tone. I expect to find more gold rings that way too. So to answer your question, yes, they are separate and the Tone ID is just a series of assigned tones.......you can change them at will.

****************************************

Hi there Larry!

Can you expand on that section of your post, underlined, for it reads is if you are saying that the operator can change a target's VDI assignment?

It may read differently to different folk, but it implies that the USER can alter directly (by keyboard intervention ) the VDI apportioned to a target....

The designer/PROGRAM
ER can indeed do that.....but not the detectors.

Each frequency produces a different VDI assessment for the same target, which of course is the NON-NORMALISED value, but again, it is the program that alters it to its NORMALISE ( 7 Khz) value.

As you well know, the user can assign tonal equivalents for each numerical VDI as well as colors and icons.....which you rightly state,...but he cannot alter the program's coded assessment algorithm for the VDI.

Like you, I also now give preferred targets higher tones, rather than using the simpler linear scaling relationship of low tones for low numbers, and increasing pro rata.

All good stuff being discussed,but we have to be careful not to confuse those new to the V3 or indeed the hobby..........TheMarshall

.

 

[Larry (IL)]

You caught me Marshall, I left out the word audio. Should have read Your VDI #'s AUDIO can be changed............

 

[jimpugh]

n/t

 

[Rob (IL)]

[attachment 162656 2010-05-19_131959.jpg].........Happy Tuesday Larry............Rob