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Farm Field Hunt with High Freq Machine
- Thread starter Carter NY
- Start date
SpiritRelic
New member
We need to discuss this more.I have noticed that the anolog type detectors maintain great sensitivity to micro type jewelry items.Could a digital designed detector lose sensitivity to micro targets?.The Deeptech reminds me of my Tesoro Tejon.This could be important information for design engineers.Why keep up the push for digital detectors when they do not perform as well as the anolog?.I'll tell you why.Digital designed detectors are much easier to mass produce.Why have all these battery draining features on a four pound detector been so widely accepted;when they will not keep up with a lightweight anolog type design?.Because detectorist want all these fancy digital readouts?,I cannot figure this trend out? I feel lightweight, with excellent performance would be the design trend to move forward with in the metal detector industry.Instead we are hammered with over weight detectors.What good is a heavy detector going to do you when you pull your shoulder out the socket?A smart design engineer should go with the most lightweight design possible,while maintaining the performance we need. :-C
Critterhunter
New member
The thing to me about gold jewlery hunting is that I'm mainly after gold rings, as at least IMO that's the most common form of gold jewlery lost by people. I've owned machines known for fine gold sensitivity, such as thin gold chains and tiny earrings, but for my tastes I found it made for too bumpy of a ride when hunting land and would have me chasing tiny flakes of foil or other tiny low conductors that sounded so good that I couldn't pass them by.
When it comes to machines not known for fine gold sensitivity, in terms of even the thinnest/plainest/smallest of gold rings, I've found that some machines not known for fine gold sensitivity will bang such rings at extreme depths, due to the ring being an intact loop, which prevents a larger/strong/more solid hit to the detection field, as they eddy currents travel along it's paramemeter much like it was a solid object such as a coin.
I've done some low conductor hits precisely measured via a ruler in the forgeround of the camera to record them, and found that even a super low foil hit from a sport drink top would hit at deeper depths than a clad dime. The reason? Because of the diameter of the foil top being roughly about a quarter in size, bigger than the diameter of a dime.
Now, if a thin gold ring has a crack, disrupting the pathway for the eddy currents, it can give rather poor responses or lack depth on such a machine not known for fine gold item sensitivity. That's when a fine gold machine will have the clear advantage for such a ring.
Still, I'm not really interested in the fine gold abilities of the Deeptech higher freq unit. What I am interested in is it's ability to hit gold rings and old coins at extreme depths. Still watching contrasts of that to my Sovereign GT in pin point mode, which can relate iron targets by several somewhat unique responses they give as opposed to non-ferrous items.
I have read of some in the beach forum who say PP mode on their BBS units is as deep or deeper than some flagship PI units they've owned, even in mineralized ground, and this is where it sits for me to try to convince myself I might need to add another machine to my line up in contrast to the abilities of PP mode.
I think so far what I've seen of these Deeptech units is fantastic. The price seems reasonable and I'm very intrigued. Still just trying to see how things pan out before making any decisions one way or the other.
Far as analog vs digital goes, I've kind'a got one foot on one side of that and one on the other, to where I prefer some aspects of analog to digital, while prefer digital for others. In terms of audio, I prefer at least a digital machine that hasn't over processed and sanitized the audio into a nice clean wrapper, as I feel a lot of target traits are lost that way in some instances. On the other hand, I prefer the numerous tone alerts that digital can offer so I don't have to constantly watch the meter on a machine when working heavy trash.
I saw an excellent post a while back from a guy who worked in the military on flight systems if memory serves. He related the perks to analog style controls (dials and switches) to that of digital, in that linear adjustment gives more scaling to get things "just right" for a given situation. Sensitivity, volume, or threshold adjustment, for instance, is much easier to get right where you want it with a analog style dial, rather than the limited "steps" of many digital controls.
But his other main point was that of the cost factor of digital vs analog. It's far cheaper labor wise to just slap a push button pad onto a detector with a ribbon cable and LCD screen, rather than have to install physical dials and switches on a device. It's also easier to service, since you just yoke out the old push button keypad and plug in another if there is an issue with one of the button controls.
Analog style VDI has it's perks too, with far more precision scaling of the conductivity values of targets on certain machines, where as targets can be put in pre-determined "slots" or "zones" on a less linear type of VDI response.
Then there are machines that seem a hybrid of both digital technology internally but with analog-like controls and audio/VDI, yet with tone alerts of a digital unit. To me that kind of setup is the best of both worlds for my tastes.
What I find curious is that some companies are dumping analog-style control machines all together, while others seem to be mating at least certain analog control inputs with a digital screen and electronics. Whites for instance, in their MXT/M6 units.
There is a market for people who prefer analog dial controls for certain functions of a detecting, which among other things besides scaling resolution to tweak it just right, you've also got quick and easy adjustment ability by "feel" and without "thought" so much in what you might be seeing on a screen to indicate where things are set.
For me in my particular tastes I've found the hybrid unit I was looking for. I've owned advanced top of the line digital units, and I've old "primative" analog style units that lacked tone alerts or even a VDI display. In my GT I've found the digital processing power of what is under the hood, along with the numerous tone alerts of a digital beast, but also with very long and detailed "robust" analog like audio combined with it to help me hunt more by ear in certain situations to judge target traits.
Oddly, the VDI system also seems a "throw back" to the analog age, in that it just outputs a voltage scale based on target conductivity. While at first this might sound lack luster, in fact there is no lag time between the audio response of a target and it's VDI conductivity # which can happen with heavy layers of digital processing separating them, along with super high resolution from very low foil hits all the way up to copper penny.
Nickels are about a 136 to up to 146 VDI # (usually in the 142 to 144 range), and round or square tabs start at about 149 and go on up to 169, with a gap of 170, 171, and 172 between the highest of those and a zinc penny at 173. That little "dead zone" gap between the highest tab and the lowest zinc # I rarely see, and when I do and dig it it often turns out to be a keeper like an antique makeup case, old button, or other such item. The tone alerts make it easy for me to notice nickels compared to the higher tone alerts of tabs, but when I see a 141 to 146 VDI # and a somewhat "round" "boing" sound to the target, I can almost bet it's going to be a nickel and it usually turns out to be.
One of the perks of pure digital units that I do like is the ability to use a notching system of numbers in the digital screen to knock out a certain pesky trash item that a site is loaded with. In that particular situation I wish I had more digital abilities on this machine, because as it stands the notch width is preset to about 12.5 digits and can only be moved up and down the scale with the dial. I wish they would have piggy backed a smaller dial on top of the notch dial, to where I could widen or make more narrow the width of the notch. If somebody could figure out how to hack the machine to make such adjustments I'm sure they'd be very popular in modification circles.
When it comes to machines not known for fine gold sensitivity, in terms of even the thinnest/plainest/smallest of gold rings, I've found that some machines not known for fine gold sensitivity will bang such rings at extreme depths, due to the ring being an intact loop, which prevents a larger/strong/more solid hit to the detection field, as they eddy currents travel along it's paramemeter much like it was a solid object such as a coin.
I've done some low conductor hits precisely measured via a ruler in the forgeround of the camera to record them, and found that even a super low foil hit from a sport drink top would hit at deeper depths than a clad dime. The reason? Because of the diameter of the foil top being roughly about a quarter in size, bigger than the diameter of a dime.
Now, if a thin gold ring has a crack, disrupting the pathway for the eddy currents, it can give rather poor responses or lack depth on such a machine not known for fine gold item sensitivity. That's when a fine gold machine will have the clear advantage for such a ring.
Still, I'm not really interested in the fine gold abilities of the Deeptech higher freq unit. What I am interested in is it's ability to hit gold rings and old coins at extreme depths. Still watching contrasts of that to my Sovereign GT in pin point mode, which can relate iron targets by several somewhat unique responses they give as opposed to non-ferrous items.
I have read of some in the beach forum who say PP mode on their BBS units is as deep or deeper than some flagship PI units they've owned, even in mineralized ground, and this is where it sits for me to try to convince myself I might need to add another machine to my line up in contrast to the abilities of PP mode.
I think so far what I've seen of these Deeptech units is fantastic. The price seems reasonable and I'm very intrigued. Still just trying to see how things pan out before making any decisions one way or the other.
Far as analog vs digital goes, I've kind'a got one foot on one side of that and one on the other, to where I prefer some aspects of analog to digital, while prefer digital for others. In terms of audio, I prefer at least a digital machine that hasn't over processed and sanitized the audio into a nice clean wrapper, as I feel a lot of target traits are lost that way in some instances. On the other hand, I prefer the numerous tone alerts that digital can offer so I don't have to constantly watch the meter on a machine when working heavy trash.
I saw an excellent post a while back from a guy who worked in the military on flight systems if memory serves. He related the perks to analog style controls (dials and switches) to that of digital, in that linear adjustment gives more scaling to get things "just right" for a given situation. Sensitivity, volume, or threshold adjustment, for instance, is much easier to get right where you want it with a analog style dial, rather than the limited "steps" of many digital controls.
But his other main point was that of the cost factor of digital vs analog. It's far cheaper labor wise to just slap a push button pad onto a detector with a ribbon cable and LCD screen, rather than have to install physical dials and switches on a device. It's also easier to service, since you just yoke out the old push button keypad and plug in another if there is an issue with one of the button controls.
Analog style VDI has it's perks too, with far more precision scaling of the conductivity values of targets on certain machines, where as targets can be put in pre-determined "slots" or "zones" on a less linear type of VDI response.
Then there are machines that seem a hybrid of both digital technology internally but with analog-like controls and audio/VDI, yet with tone alerts of a digital unit. To me that kind of setup is the best of both worlds for my tastes.
What I find curious is that some companies are dumping analog-style control machines all together, while others seem to be mating at least certain analog control inputs with a digital screen and electronics. Whites for instance, in their MXT/M6 units.
There is a market for people who prefer analog dial controls for certain functions of a detecting, which among other things besides scaling resolution to tweak it just right, you've also got quick and easy adjustment ability by "feel" and without "thought" so much in what you might be seeing on a screen to indicate where things are set.
For me in my particular tastes I've found the hybrid unit I was looking for. I've owned advanced top of the line digital units, and I've old "primative" analog style units that lacked tone alerts or even a VDI display. In my GT I've found the digital processing power of what is under the hood, along with the numerous tone alerts of a digital beast, but also with very long and detailed "robust" analog like audio combined with it to help me hunt more by ear in certain situations to judge target traits.
Oddly, the VDI system also seems a "throw back" to the analog age, in that it just outputs a voltage scale based on target conductivity. While at first this might sound lack luster, in fact there is no lag time between the audio response of a target and it's VDI conductivity # which can happen with heavy layers of digital processing separating them, along with super high resolution from very low foil hits all the way up to copper penny.
Nickels are about a 136 to up to 146 VDI # (usually in the 142 to 144 range), and round or square tabs start at about 149 and go on up to 169, with a gap of 170, 171, and 172 between the highest of those and a zinc penny at 173. That little "dead zone" gap between the highest tab and the lowest zinc # I rarely see, and when I do and dig it it often turns out to be a keeper like an antique makeup case, old button, or other such item. The tone alerts make it easy for me to notice nickels compared to the higher tone alerts of tabs, but when I see a 141 to 146 VDI # and a somewhat "round" "boing" sound to the target, I can almost bet it's going to be a nickel and it usually turns out to be.
One of the perks of pure digital units that I do like is the ability to use a notching system of numbers in the digital screen to knock out a certain pesky trash item that a site is loaded with. In that particular situation I wish I had more digital abilities on this machine, because as it stands the notch width is preset to about 12.5 digits and can only be moved up and down the scale with the dial. I wish they would have piggy backed a smaller dial on top of the notch dial, to where I could widen or make more narrow the width of the notch. If somebody could figure out how to hack the machine to make such adjustments I'm sure they'd be very popular in modification circles.
Sven
Well-known member
Here's what I did when doing a Ground Balancing mod without using a 10 turn, getting the same effect.
Something like this may work for you.
Take the original GB pot, select a 10:1 smaller pot, and wrap it around in parallel on the two outside legs of the original pot. Connect the outside legs of each pot to each other, it gives you a fine tune pot "in parallel".
Set fine tune pot (lower value) in the middle of the tuning, then set the original GB (higher value) pot as good as you can,
Something like this may work for you.
Take the original GB pot, select a 10:1 smaller pot, and wrap it around in parallel on the two outside legs of the original pot. Connect the outside legs of each pot to each other, it gives you a fine tune pot "in parallel".
Set fine tune pot (lower value) in the middle of the tuning, then set the original GB (higher value) pot as good as you can,