Does A Whites Lower Carbon Rod Fit A GT Straight Shaft?

[Critterhunter]

I'm trying to find out for sure before I order one. Does the lower carbon fiber shaft from a Whites fit inside the stock GT's upper shaft tight with no problems, other than maybe having to drill out your adjustment pin holes?

I've got an aluminum blank from a window cleaning pole that is the same diameter as the stock GT upper shaft, just as stiff, but much lighter since it's not as thick. Since it fits my stock lower GT shaft perfectly I just want to make sure the Whites shaft will also fit this thing before ordering. QXT Pro had to go (for a while, anyway) so I could make room for an M6 in my hangar, so I don't have a Whites lower shaft laying around to check myself.

Has anybody used the lower shaft from a Whites on a Sovereign and were there any modifications you had to make? Seems like the lower fiberglass rod on my GT is much heavier than need be, more so than a Whites and want to save some weight.

 

[Critterhunter]

Got an answer in the Sovereign forum that it does fit. Now I just need to figure out if I should buy the lower tall man rod for the coil instead of the stock one as it's 10" longer and they both are the same price from Whites at $10. I would figure I can cut down the upper rod to save even more weight by using this longer one. Note that I'm not talking about the Tall Man middle rod. This one is meant to replace the stock lower coil rod. Also curious if these things are really carbon fiber. Whites lists the stock one and this one as "fiber" but that could mean carbon fiber or fiberglass. I know they sure look like carbon and I can't imagine them being any lighter. If it is fiberglass they've got the competition beat material wise.

 

[plugger]

You may have too much torque to use the tallman lower rod, especially if you ever use it in the ocean, even a foot deep! The Minelab lower rods are made to hold up to the torque from the Minelab coils. You are only talking about a couple of ounces difference at the most!

 

[Critterhunter]

Good point. I'll stick with getting the normal Whites lower rod. Yea, I know the weight savings won't be much but every little bit adds up with all the things I'll be doing to put the GT on a diet. If I find the lower Whites rod isn't strong enough for the 10" GT coil I'll use it only for the S-5 then or any other lighter coil (like maybe the S-12).

Those lower Whites rods are a fair bit lighter but I've never noticed any flex in them when I've used my Whites as a walking cane to cross a river or climb a hill. Sometimes it's either that or fall on my face in a few spots I get myself into. Fiberglass is less stiff than carbon so if these Whites rods are carbon I don't see that there will be much difference. If I ever do any water hunting with my GT I can always throw the stock shaft back on for that too.

 

[Ron from Michigan]

I agree with Plugger the weight difference isn't worth the aggravation.I'm a competitive cross country ski racer and use carbon composite ski poles.I use Swix Stars the lightest and lowest flex pole ever made.A light rod asm is important but energy can be lost due to flex,which can make it even more difficult for a long hunt.Example my training with road poles{roller skis) a lower grade $200.00 dollar poles flex like hoola hoops compared with the top grade composite.The Whites are not a top grade carbon rod.A carbon posit pole the size of the lower Whites rod asm with that length and diameter would probably cost $500.00. By the way composites poles are strong from the top weight bearing but many have learned in a mass starts a whack from another skiers pole from the side can cause a break.These top xc poles are so light the webs that Velcro onto the gloves are heavier.I could see some manufacturer making such a rod asm but its going to be expensive.I have made different rod asm myself and purchased a few.Plugger makes a great product that works very well and inexpensive.Good Luck Ron

 

[Critterhunter]

I know weight savings may be minimal but I've developed that habit in building RC planes. Every little seeming trivial thing you do in building one can add up to a lot of extra weight and wing loading. I've used carbon fiber rods, fiberglass, and even the odd aluminum tube for strength mods in things such as plane wings to stiffen them up. While I'm dealing with tube diameters much smaller than what a lower shaft is using I'm willing to bet a carbon blank of that diameter can maybe be had in the $25 to $40 range if you find the right place.

I've thought about buying a blank to use for the entire shaft so it wouldn't need to be two pieces. That alone would make things more rigid. From what I understand carbon's strength characteristics such as left/right rigidity versus direct force is based on how the carbon is constructed. They offer different wrap styles that offer one advantage over the other based on where outside forces will be pushing on it. I haven't looked further into this yet, though, so I can only speculate the details on that.

I have no doubt cross country commercial carbon ski poles would cost that much. Take a look at the price they want for a carbon seat pole on a bike. Even small diameter tubes that I have used can be expensive if bought in the wrong place, but I found an online shop where I can get those at about 1/5th the price. Maybe they have a good price on larger diameters as well, but I haven't looked.

 

[Critterhunter]

"Poor taste is no excuse for poor manners"- Unknown. While I may have my faults at least I have the tact not to make public remarks of a personal nature about people. So, while I take a personal inventory on "BS" you might want to think about treating others the way you'd like them to treat you. I may have my opinion but I try not to resort to making personal remarks in order to support my views. Exactly what in the above message of mine are you talking about, anyway? But, so long as we are dropping formalities and using broad generalities to paint people without sugar coating, let me offer up my own opinion in kind...

I get the feeling some people take "issue" with me making certain things instead off buying them, and this remark isn't specifically directed at you or any other single person, so I'll throw that qualifier out there right now to avoid future debate. I have no doubt some of these aftermarket shafts are a great product but I'm getting a little tired of PMs and messages from people pushing certain items for sale. I would have considered purchasing one (even if it was more expensive than I could build it myself for), but since nobody would give me an answer on the weight in past PMs I took that to mean that it isn't what I'm looking for- something as light as possible. I made it quite clear months ago to certain people that I wasn't interested in that kind of price unless I had a weight to compare the stock shaft to.

If your BS comment is about carbon fiber I made it plain in the above message that "I haven't looked further into this yet, though, so I can only speculate the details on that." If I was "BS"ing I wouldn't be saying that, nor pointing out that my experience has only been in carbon tubes and rods (big difference) of much smaller diameter. What little I do know is that carbon can be constructed with various wrapping or construction techniques to offer strength for different applications. But, *as said*, beyond that it's speculation on my part until I investigate further. If it's about the price, I also noted that I know where I can get carbon tubes much cheaper, but admitted that I hadn't checked prices in those sizes yet. I guess even with all the above disclaimers to my knowledge on this subject I didn't do quite enough to keep people from thinking I was "BS'ing. I've never thought of a person who put so many self-doubts into a message as "BS"ing myself, but that's me.

By the way, this probably doesn't even apply to the topic at hand but so long as we are talking about people who BS, I just got back from a bike shop and managed a hand grip and a detector stand (aluminum bottle holder designed to attach to a shaft on a bike) that look like they were made for a Sovereign. VERY light and the stand is $9, about $5 to $10 cheaper than any of the "commercial custom" units people are selling for detectors. Photos/weights soon, as I hope to try to save other people from being sold something that they can buy or build much cheaper elsewhere.

This is the last I'll read of this thread as it appears we've moved from being helpful to just plain critical. If you have any further issue we can take it up in PMs, but I'll not further add to debates of a personal nature in a public forum.

 

[kered]

Have you thought of looking into carbon fishing rod blanks, usually the but end are made to be pretty rigid so as to let the tip do the work, also being slightly tapered may help too, you might pick one up 2nd hand too, cheap, just a thought