difference between running deep on and volume gain @ say 20,,,

[grouser]

verses deep off and VG at 29 or 30.... From the ML teck advisors, they actually say deep on will make shallow targets weak and maybe should not be used if there are no deep targets expected. So if volume gain makes faint/deep targets louder,,,, and that is what "deep on" does in my understanding, then why are there two ways of doing the same thing and how should it be set up to take advantage of each tool properly? A little confused,,,,, if you read the entire artical ( below) and take the last sentence to heart,,,,,, there is no time to use "deep on" when coin hunting cuz coins are not large targets,,,,

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The Recovery Deep setting on the E-TRAC, Explorer and Explorer SE detectors is designed to enhance the detection and identification of deep targets. This article will explain the way in which deep recovery mode enhances the operation of the detector and points out those situations when you may not choose to use this setting.

When Recovery Deep is turned on, it only has an effect on weak signals, stronger signals remain completely unaffected. When Recovery Deep is turned on and a weak signal is detected, the identification signals undergo stronger filtering to smooth out the data. This leads to more stable and consistent Ferrous and Conductivity values. Given this, it may seem that as Recovery Deep could be turned on all of the time. Unfortunately, as in all things, there can be too much of a good thing. There are two situations when the Recovery Deep setting is undesirable.
In the case of weak, shallow targets, the stronger filtering of the Recovery Deep setting will cause the strength of these short, sharp signals to be decreased. The grid below shows the effect of Recovery Deep and these different classes of target.


Also as a result of the stronger filter, signals from weak targets become smoothed. In environments with multiple deep targets relatively close together this smoothing may make adjacent targets start to appear to be merged. In this case the ID that the detector displays may become mixed between the two targets.

In summary, the Recovery Deep setting should be used in situations where you are expecting to find sparse, large, deep targets and in these situations you will experience more stable and consistent IDs.
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[stasys]

I never was able to understand Deep if I always use max gain, but its looks like the same.

 

[EZrider]

Coins are not a weak target even shallow. Why adjust a couple of settings when you have to adjust one ? I think that is the reason for the deep setting. Given that. It all boils down to target ID. This is where the ET shines above all others.

 

[Ray-Mo.]

n/t

 

[grouser]

Coins are not a weak target even shallow. Why adjust a couple of settings when you have to adjust one ? I think that is the reason for the deep setting. Given that. It all boils down to target ID. This is where the ET shines above all others.

what about a coin on edge deep or shallow would give a weaker signal,,,,, and I do love the etrac ID system but I rely more on a solid tone for when to dig or not,,,,, not arguing just trying to understand if there is a difference in what the two setting do,,,, if I can amplify the weak deep signals with volume gain and have no other ill effects why do it with Deep on and suffer?

 

[Goldmanjace]

Coins are not a weak target even shallow. Why adjust a couple of settings when you have to adjust one ? I think that is the reason for the deep setting. Given that. It all boils down to target ID. This is where the ET shines above all others.

what about a coin on edge deep or shallow would give a weaker signal,,,,, and I do love the etrac ID system but I rely more on a solid tone for when to dig or not,,,,, not arguing just trying to understand if there is a difference in what the two setting do,,,, if I can amplify the weak deep signals with volume gain and have no other ill effects why do it with Deep on and suffer?

Very good point, will be intersting to see more answers.

 

[EZrider]

It comes down to ID stabability. I never really understood it untill i used the ET when beach hunting. Getting and locking onto a solid ID at the fringe of depth detection.

 

[Goldmanjace]

It comes down to ID stabability. I never really understood it untill i used the ET when beach hunting. Getting and locking onto a solid ID at the fringe of depth detection.

So what is the solution?

 

[EZrider]

This is a common question and you will get differing responses based on personal preferences and the areas being searched.

I leave DEEP on and then vary the Gain as the conditions dictate. If you have DEEP = ON, the weaker signals get boosted but teh louder signals are not affected. If you run with GAIN = 30, all signals are affected which can result in overload and missed targets in some areas especially if there is trash present. By running with a lower GAIN setting, target separation - especially if there are shallow targets or multiple targets under the coil - will be cleaner. The DEEP = ON will ensure small or deep (weak) signals are not inadvertaly missed.

Hope this answers your question

Andy Sabisch

 

[Goldmanjace]

This is a common question and you will get differing responses based on personal preferences and the areas being searched.

I leave DEEP on and then vary the Gain as the conditions dictate. If you have DEEP = ON, the weaker signals get boosted but teh louder signals are not affected. If you run with GAIN = 30, all signals are affected which can result in overload and missed targets in some areas especially if there is trash present. By running with a lower GAIN setting, target separation - especially if there are shallow targets or multiple targets under the coil - will be cleaner. The DEEP = ON will ensure small or deep (weak) signals are not inadvertaly missed.

Hope this answers your question

Andy Sabisch

Very good, this is exactly the answer I was waiting for. Thank you Andy.

 

[Ray-Mo.]

as I remembered ,no difference in signal at all with deep on or off.I lowered gain to 15 where the signal was very quiet with deep off and then tested with deep on and absolutely no improvement in signal.The test silver dime is a full 9" deep with one inch of grass on top in very mild soil.

Perhaps if you want to know how these settings effect your machine you will need to test in your area and soil types.As for me, deep on does nothing at all on small to medium sized coins/targets.Perhaps results would be different on larger coins/targets as alluded to in official Minelab statements.

This test was done in conductive multi tones with both coins mode and open quick mask......

 

[moose]

Very, very interesting subject. I will toy with deep this Thur. at my local park and see if it produces or fails and fill all in with what I find.

Thanks for subject,

Moose

 

[JamesBondaka]

The big point to make is that this ONLY applies to signals that are very weak, not on a good signal. As a matter of fact, I check often and I dont hardly ever see any difference on changing the deep on/off or fast on/off etc. Likewise, when I change from manual to auto +3...It doesnt seem to make any difference. I try to boost my signal to go deeper but all I seem to get is more noise AND possibly masking out good targets because Im hearing more things going on. I think it even talks about this senario in Andys book. Other than change the upper screen pattern on the standard coin program...I think that MOST of the factory defaults are the way they should be...at least for my area and it doesnt seem to help to change anything for more possible benefits.

 

[grouser]

It comes down to ID stabability. I never really understood it untill i used the ET when beach hunting. Getting and locking onto a solid ID at the fringe of depth detection.

so if I got it right...... that is what "deep on" will do for you and "volume gain " will not,,,, VG simply boost the weak signal and does nothing to help analyze and stabilize the TID

 

[EZrider]

Volume gain only makes what signal that is read louder. The Deep setting is not a depth boost. If you air test a target just to hear what it sounds like at the end of detection. You will notice the sound bounces. Some times so much so that you might pass the target by. Deep on takes that fringe of detection signal and cleans it up to a readable, stable signal.

 

[Goldmanjace]

This is a common question and you will get differing responses based on personal preferences and the areas being searched.

I leave DEEP on and then vary the Gain as the conditions dictate. If you have DEEP = ON, the weaker signals get boosted but teh louder signals are not affected. If you run with GAIN = 30, all signals are affected which can result in overload and missed targets in some areas especially if there is trash present. By running with a lower GAIN setting, target separation - especially if there are shallow targets or multiple targets under the coil - will be cleaner. The DEEP = ON will ensure small or deep (weak) signals are not inadvertaly missed.

Hope this answers your question

Andy Sabisch

In this case, what would be the gain setting?? Especailly before it starts to overload with DEEP ON? I usually run my gain at 23 to 24 and DEEP ON.