"Deep / On" and Gain at 30?

[Idaho PRB]

Does anyone know if having "Deep / On" is a redundant setting if "Gain" is set at 30? I'm afraid to turn the "Deep" setting off but sometimes run my gain at 30 and sometimes at 24. I'm sure that when the weather warms up and I can do some experimentation with test items I can see for myself but I was hoping someone could give me a report in the meantime. Thanks Folks!
Idaho PRB

 

[LabradorBob]

I personally have never found the need to turn (Deep) on.
I do run my gain at 30,but others run it at 8 or 10.
The reason being they want to hear the depth of the coin.
Deeper coins at a lower gain will give a fainter tone.
A high gain will cause you to lose some target id on the screen, not in the id itself but
the ability to change numbers faster. It tends to stick as i would call it.
Running a high gain i mainly am hunting by sound alone.
and it is costing me some coins in heavy trash!

LabradorBob

 

[Andy Sabisch]

This is a common question and you will get differing responses based on personal preferences and the areas being searched.

I leave DEEP on and then vary the Gain as the conditions dictate. If you have DEEP = ON, the weaker signals get boosted but teh louder signals are not affected. If you run with GAIN = 30, all signals are affected which can result in overload and missed targets in some areas especially if there is trash present. By running with a lower GAIN setting, target separation - especially if there are shallow targets or multiple targets under the coil - will be cleaner. The DEEP = ON will ensure small or deep (weak) signals are not inadvertaly missed.

Hope this answers your question

Andy Sabisch

 

[Idaho PRB]

Thank you very much! Yes, that is exactly what I wanted to know.

 

[silverman]

Oh, what does Andy Sabisch know. Just kidding, you're the man Andy.
Thanks for the tip!

 

[mcb613]

Andy, what did you have in mind with" Lower Gain"? i am brand new with the E-trac. However, have used a EXPII for 2 yrs and have your book... great job! BTW, can I out you on speed dial for questions I have while learning? Boy wouldn't that be nice!. Thans for any advise you have. Regards, MIke

 

[silvereagle]

This is a common question and you will get differing responses based on personal preferences and the areas being searched.

I leave DEEP on and then vary the Gain as the conditions dictate. If you have DEEP = ON, the weaker signals get boosted but teh louder signals are not affected. If you run with GAIN = 30, all signals are affected which can result in overload and missed targets in some areas especially if there is trash present. By running with a lower GAIN setting, target separation - especially if there are shallow targets or multiple targets under the coil - will be cleaner. The DEEP = ON will ensure small or deep (weak) signals are not inadvertaly missed.

Hope this answers your question

Andy Sabisch

do you have a preferred setting on the GAIN on the beach versus say a nice plowed field?

 

[joedirt]

I turned my gain down to 7 towards the end of the day and I think I have a better idea now why I'm not digging the right targets.

With the higher gain, 15 or higher, everything sounds the same to me. 2" targets and 8" targets sound just as loud. (as they should by design of the gain setting)

This may explain why I've been digging so much clad. I get a valid signal showing 8" and dig it only to find out it is clad coin at 1" or 2".

If my gain was lower, the 2" target would have sounded louder than the 8" target and I could have been able to tell when the E-Trac was misreading the target due to its shallowness.

I may try the Deep On setting later, but for now I need to train myself to tell the difference between a deeper weaker valid signal and a shallow target. Even if it turns out to be clad, I just need to know that if it sounds a like 8" target, and the E-Trac says it is at 8" target, that is is actually at 8 inches and not 2.

I think having my gain too high has actually been hurting rather than helping.

 

[Neil]

next time your out detecting try the settings you are in question about on the targets you locate. this takes time but you will learn how your machine reacts better and what works better for your area.
Im a hands on person, I learn by doing and Ive read Andys book as well but Ive also tried alot of those settings instead of just going out and hunting them as if they are what works best where Im at.
also your learning on actual in ground, been there for awhile targets, instead of air testing/test garden testing.

 

[grouser]

I think Niel has a great idea,,, take the time to see/hear the differences in an actual target

 

[Goldmanjace]

I know that some of the detectorists in England run it with sens on 30 and gain on 30 or 29 and ALWAYS deep ON. I know that these guys are producing good finds shallow as well as deep. They are just moving slow, I mean slow. They hunt on roman sites that have tons of trash on them and they fair well. I think if you slow down you will find it works here in the US too.
Andy, maybe you can tell us why that type of hunting in Europe such a success is but not here in the US?

 

[stasys]

I know that some of the detectorists in England run it with sens on 30 and gain on 30 or 29 and ALWAYS deep ON. I know that these guys are producing good finds shallow as well as deep. They are just moving slow, I mean slow. They hunt on roman sites that have tons of trash on them and they fair well. I think if you slow down you will find it works here in the US too.
Andy, maybe you can tell us why that type of hunting in Europe such a success is but not here in the US?

In Europe we have to dig all targets, discrimination is used just for Iron or not at all, coins can be very small and thin- something like foil. Not all etrac users use 30 sensitivity -its a bit extreme, but gain 30 helps to dig in iron and small items, no time to waist listen its deep or shallow.

 

[Goldmanjace]

I know that some of the detectorists in England run it with sens on 30 and gain on 30 or 29 and ALWAYS deep ON. I know that these guys are producing good finds shallow as well as deep. They are just moving slow, I mean slow. They hunt on roman sites that have tons of trash on them and they fair well. I think if you slow down you will find it works here in the US too.
Andy, maybe you can tell us why that type of hunting in Europe such a success is but not here in the US?

In Europe we have to dig all targets, discrimination is used just for Iron or not at all, coins can be very small and thin- something like foil. Not all etrac users use 30 sensitivity -its a bit extreme, but gain 30 helps to dig in iron and small items, no time to waist listen its deep or shallow.

I realize this but will the following not apply to you also?
"By running with a lower GAIN setting, target separation - especially if there are shallow targets or multiple targets under the coil - will be cleaner. "

 

[grouser]

I know on the Fisher CZ3D the gain only effects and AMPLIFIES the weaker/deeper signals. It has no effect on louder/shallower signals. It has nothing to do with target separation or ID it simply makes the deeper/fainter signals the same level audibly as any other signal. It's just a volume knob for weak signals. I thought this is what it did on the ETRAC and the "Deep ON" was the function that effects the processing of the signal (of deeper fainter targets) thru different filters and makes for better target ID. But, as Andy states this is not the case,,,,,

 

[Goes4ever]

My gain is set at 29, and I can still clearly hear the difference between an 8 inch deep dime VS a 2 inch deep dime, the shallow dime will literally scream out, and the deeper one will be solid but softer, you may not agree, but I can still HEAR the difference in deep coins VS shallow clad with a high gain

 

[Greek2Me]

I run with 29 gain and DEEP off. My question is, will you still be able to hear the 8 inch deep coins that give you that blip blip sound? The ones that sound like a nail. If i turned the gain down to around 15, would the sound be so faint on those that I would miss them?

G2M

 

[Goes4ever]

yes IMHO you will hear the deep blip blip coins. I run my etrac the same way

 

[earthmansurfer]

I am going to play with a lower gain with deep on and see what happens. Just the last two times out I started dropping my gain to 24 and it was quite noticeable on the deeper targets. Going down to 15 and I thought I might pass some up as they were a bit too soft with the iron/trash level. Clearly, there is an important relationship here.

I agree with Goes4Ever - as I have been running mine on 29 for 6 weeks and I swear I could hear the subtle difference on an 8" target. Like he said, it's still solid, just a bit softer. I will start slowly dropping this as well as playing with a drastic change with deep on, as mentioned above. I need to find that happy medium for the iron level I'm hunting in. Jump in if you have any suggestions. (I'm guessing 23 to 2.

Very interesting regarding Deep On as I had given up on it. In all my testing, it seemed to make things worse on 8"-9" targets. But now I can try it with a lower gain and see what happens as well as slowing down my swing.

Great thread,
Albert

 

[Big Boys Hobbies]

My gain is set at 29, and I can still clearly hear the difference between an 8 inch deep dime VS a 2 inch deep dime, the shallow dime will literally scream out, and the deeper one will be solid but softer, you may not agree, but I can still HEAR the difference in deep coins VS shallow clad with a high gain

I agree and great post!