Combined audio and ground balance?'s

[Fire Fighter 43]

Question for You guys that are using the combined audio with open disc pattern. Could you post exactly how you have it set- up? I also see that some of you are ground balancing and doing a noise cancel. Do you feel this gives you more depth?

 

[Crusty]

I usually don't use the manual GB but I do do a noise concel before I start at each location.

Dave

 

[mtwolf2270]

Same here

 

[Digger]

I don't use Ground Balance ON as my soil is moderately mineralized. I do a Noise Cancel evertime I turn on my detector, and occassionally during the hunt. I built several Search Modes using the basic Coin program discrimination and Combined audio. The difference between them is the size and pitch of each bin. You can tweak the amount of discrimination you want, make the bins any size you want, and set the pitch that you like, for your style of hunting. I usually run in Auto +2 or +3 Sensitivity. I start out in +3, but know that I can back it down if it gets chattery. I don't use manual Sensitivity because I've proven to myself that the AutoSensitivity in the CTX is smarter than I am. Some programs have Fast ON, other Fast OFF. Again, it depends on the sites I am hunting. I typically run with Normal Response. But in the areas with multiple targets, I like to stretch the tone out with Long response. If I am out in the middle of nowhere, I also like to have Deep ON. With the CTX 3030, I nearly always use Ferrous - Coin Separation. And I always use Target Trace, Target Trace Pinpoint and Pinpoint Sizing. The functionality is there. Why not take advantage of if? With that said, if I am in a nasty modern park with tons of non-ferrous trash, I'll slip over to a modified Coin mode where I have Multiple Tone Conductive audio, High Trash, Fast ON. In my Combined audio modes, I've moved the Ferrous Line down to 21. That way, if I am using Pattern 1 with the discrimination, I'll still get a low tone on some "not too ferrous" targets. But when I switch over the the open screen of Pattern 2, I hear it all. I also changed the conductive bins to reflect the types of targets I'm looking for. I set bin one up from 01 - 14 for nickels, bing 2 is set from 15 - 23 for non-ferrous other stuff, 24 - 39 is for small silver and copper coins, and bin 4 is set from 40 - 50 for larger silver coins. I have the lowest tone on the ferrous targets, a mid-low tone on bin 2, a mid high tone on bin 1, a bit higher tone on bin 3 and the highest tone on bin 4. On another program I've set bin 01 - 20 for nickels, 21 - 36 for IH cents, 37 - 46 for other coins and 47 - 50 for any wrap around iron. I know I can see the iron in the display. But in some of those 40 acre patches with one lone homesite, I prefer to hunt by ear. In this program, the tones are progressive from lowest to highest. In yet another, I've set bin 1 for 01-23 with a low tone, bin 2 is 24 - 36 with a high tone, bin 3 is 37 - 39 with mid low tone and bin 4 is 40 - 50 with another high tone. This is one I use for hunting old coins in old sites.

As I said, there is no "secret forumla" or "special program". The CTX 3030 offers functionality to suit just about every type of site you search, and can be adapted to any level of experience. Each of us have different styles, hunt for different targets and hunt different types of sites. My best advice is to learn what the functionality is and how to implement the "best combination" for your sites. Then set your CTX 3030 to provide an audio response and target separation to your liking on targets you want to dig, in the sites you hunt. HH Randy

 

[Big Boys Hobbies]

I don't use Ground Balance ON as my soil is moderately mineralized. I do a Noise Cancel evertime I turn on my detector, and occassionally during the hunt. I built several Search Modes using the basic Coin program discrimination and Combined audio. The difference between them is the size and pitch of each bin. You can tweak the amount of discrimination you want, make the bins any size you want, and set the pitch that you like, for your style of hunting. I usually run in Auto +2 or +3 Sensitivity. I start out in +3, but know that I can back it down if it gets chattery. I don't use manual Sensitivity because I've proven to myself that the AutoSensitivity in the CTX is smarter than I am. Some programs have Fast ON, other Fast OFF. Again, it depends on the sites I am hunting. I typically run with Normal Response. But in the areas with multiple targets, I like to stretch the tone out with Long response. If I am out in the middle of nowhere, I also like to have Deep ON. With the CTX 3030, I nearly always use Ferrous - Coin Separation. And I always use Target Trace, Target Trace Pinpoint and Pinpoint Sizing. The functionality is there. Why not take advantage of if? With that said, if I am in a nasty modern park with tons of non-ferrous trash, I'll slip over to a modified Coin mode where I have Multiple Tone Conductive audio, High Trash, Fast ON. In my Combined audio modes, I've moved the Ferrous Line down to 21. That way, if I am using Pattern 1 with the discrimination, I'll still get a low tone on some "not too ferrous" targets. But when I switch over the the open screen of Pattern 2, I hear it all. I also changed the conductive bins to reflect the types of targets I'm looking for. I set bin one up from 01 - 14 for nickels, bing 2 is set from 15 - 23 for non-ferrous other stuff, 24 - 39 is for small silver and copper coins, and bin 4 is set from 40 - 50 for larger silver coins. I have the lowest tone on the ferrous targets, a mid-low tone on bin 2, a mid high tone on bin 1, a bit higher tone on bin 3 and the highest tone on bin 4. On another program I've set bin 01 - 20 for nickels, 21 - 36 for IH cents, 37 - 46 for other coins and 47 - 50 for any wrap around iron. I know I can see the iron in the display. But in some of those 40 acre patches with one lone homesite, I prefer to hunt by ear. In this program, the tones are progressive from lowest to highest. In yet another, I've set bin 1 for 01-23 with a low tone, bin 2 is 24 - 36 with a high tone, bin 3 is 37 - 39 with mid low tone and bin 4 is 40 - 50 with another high tone. This is one I use for hunting old coins in old sites.

As I said, there is no "secret forumla" or "special program". The CTX 3030 offers functionality to suit just about every type of site you search, and can be adapted to any level of experience. Each of us have different styles, hunt for different targets and hunt different types of sites. My best advice is to learn what the functionality is and how to implement the "best combination" for your sites. Then set your CTX 3030 to provide an audio response and target separation to your liking on targets you want to dig, in the sites you hunt. HH Randy

Great post here!

 

[Reeseb]

Hey, Digger! Thanks for another great post. Did you hunt in manual senstivity with the E-Trac? After about two weeks with my E-Trac, I learned that I could go a lot deeper with manual than auto and I never went back. I had to live with some falsing but it really paid off. Maybe the 3030 auto works better than the E-Trac.

 

[earthmansurfer]

Hey, Digger! Thanks for another great post. Did you hunt in manual senstivity with the E-Trac? After about two weeks with my E-Trac, I learned that I could go a lot deeper with manual than auto and I never went back. I had to live with some falsing but it really paid off. Maybe the 3030 auto works better than the E-Trac.

Reese, I almost posted the same thing before! I tested auto+3 vs manual 30, and auto would hit the target
IF it was in the 23 ish range - down to 9" or so. I just dealt with the small increase in falsing.

I'm curious to test deeper targets in the above way on the CTX.

Albert

 

[pspr]

Digger, can you explain how pinpoint sizing works? I tried it but didn't get good results. I also put various coins on the ground and it didn't seem to give me a good approximation of the size when passing the coil over them in pinpoint.

 

[Digger]

Reese, I would use manual Sensitivity on the E-TRAC if the ground had not been tilled, and if the targets were far between. But I would set up in Auto first, then make the adjustment according to where Auto suggested I be. I understand the thought of boosting the Sensitivity. But I also understand how the Auto Sensitivity software was designed with three separate signal channels. These three channels are used to measure ground interference, and automatically adjust the Sensitivity individually for each channel. On the Sensitivity bars in Auto, the left bar indicates the highest setting that any of the three channels is operating at. The right bar indicates the suggested Sensitivity level. Each of the three channels are set to a different level, in an effort to maintain maximum Sensitivity, without the adverse effects of ground noise (falsing), and the most stable target identification. In Manual Sensitivity, the left bar indicates the level you set it, and the right bar indicates the "suggested" level. The difference is that, in manual, there is nothing to measure the ground effects, and all three channels are set to the same level.

I found the CTX 3030 to have more "punch" than the E-TRAC. By "punch" I mean if I hit a deep target using +3 on the E-TRAC, I could hit it at +1 or +2 on the CTX 3030. When I'd go back over it with the E-TRAC at +1 or +2, I wouldn't get enough of a signal that would have made me stop to investigate. In manual mode, I found that a 24 on the CTX would be similar in "depth" to a 26 or 27 on the E-TRAC. If I went higher on the E-TRAC, it would get squirley. But if I raised the CTX to 26 or 27, it would remain stable and the depth was greater than achieved with the E-TRAC. JMHO HH Randy

 

[Reeseb]

Reese, I would use manual Sensitivity on the E-TRAC if the ground had not been tilled, and if the targets were far between. But I would set up in Auto first, then make the adjustment according to where Auto suggested I be. I understand the thought of boosting the Sensitivity. But I also understand how the Auto Sensitivity software was designed with three separate signal channels. These three channels are used to measure ground interference, and automatically adjust the Sensitivity individually for each channel. On the Sensitivity bars in Auto, the left bar indicates the highest setting that any of the three channels is operating at. The right bar indicates the suggested Sensitivity level. Each of the three channels are set to a different level, in an effort to maintain maximum Sensitivity, without the adverse effects of ground noise (falsing), and the most stable target identification. In Manual Sensitivity, the left bar indicates the level you set it, and the right bar indicates the "suggested" level. The difference is that, in manual, there is nothing to measure the ground effects, and all three channels are set to the same level.

I found the CTX 3030 to have more "punch" than the E-TRAC. By "punch" I mean if I hit a deep target using +3 on the E-TRAC, I could hit it at +1 or +2 on the CTX 3030. When I'd go back over it with the E-TRAC at +1 or +2, I wouldn't get enough of a signal that would have made me stop to investigate. In manual mode, I found that a 24 on the CTX would be similar in "depth" to a 26 or 27 on the E-TRAC. If I went higher on the E-TRAC, it would get squirley. But if I raised the CTX to 26 or 27, it would remain stable and the depth was greater than achieved with the E-TRAC. JMHO HH Randy

Thanks, Randy!

 

[mblemmy]

some things i did with the etrac was to hunt in manual as high as possible. every time i come across a deep iffy signal i would pinpoint and mark center with a little twig than i would switch over to auto and see if signal on the target changed. even with plus 3 it was diferent some of the time.... sometimes no differance. other times i couldnt pick it up in auto so to me i feel more confident in manual. but it still comes down to being one with the machine. with the additional chatter running wide open you may miss a target or two... so again its a personal preferance . im looking forward to doing the same field testing with the 3030.

happy hunting

 

[Reeseb]

some things i did with the etrac was to hunt in manual as high as possible. every time i come across a deep iffy signal i would pinpoint and mark center with a little twig than i would switch over to auto and see if signal on the target changed. even with plus 3 it was diferent some of the time.... sometimes no differance. other times i couldnt pick it up in auto so to me i feel more confident in manual. but it still comes down to being one with the machine. with the additional chatter running wide open you may miss a target or two... so again its a personal preferance . im looking forward to doing the same field testing with the 3030.

happy hunting

I agree. A good way to run manual is to try each ground setting and find the highest manual setting that has tolerable falsing. I'm manual guy with the E-Trac maybe I'll be an auto guy with the 3030. I'll just have to see.

 

[Digger]

Keep in mind that when Pinpoint is activated, the CTX 3030 operates as a non-motion detector with zero discrimination. So be careful to not be too near any target when you press Pinpoint. In normal pinpoint, the audio response of the target will become "narrower" with each pass of the coil. By continually Xing over it, you can determine a very close approximation of it's location by listening the the sound. In Pinpoint Sizing, the audio response does not change with each pass of the coil. Once you have isolated a target, move the coil over to the side and press Pinpoint (sizing). Slowly sweep over the target and listen to the tone. As the target enters the "detection field, make a mental note as to the position of the center of the coil in comparison to the ground. Then as you continue passing over the target, as the audio fades away, make another note of the coil location as the target left the detection field. Coins and small targets will give a narrow response. And since Sizing does not change as you pass over the target repeatedly, the narrow sound will remain consistent. If the sound comes from an area that "seems" to be much larger than a coin sized target, it probably is. Again, there is no magic. And based on Sizing Pinpoint, you won't be able to tell a nickel from a quarter. But by using Sizing Pinpoint in conjunction with listenting to the audio response and glancing at the TID, you should have a good idea as to when and where you want to dig. HH Randy

 

[pspr]

Thanks, Digger. I'll have to try using sizing again. When I tried it before I would get the signal to begin as soon as one edge of the center bar (1.75" wide) of the coil began to pass over the target and then remain until the other side of the center bar had completely passed over the target. So, if you had a 1" dia. coin, it was telling me I had about a 2 3/4" wide target. I would like to be able to disquingish a coin sized target from a target about the size of a pop can top. I'll test it again tomorrow.

 

[Digger]

If a 1" coin was giving you the 2.75" target response, I'd surmise a pop can will be proportionally larger as well. One suggestion I would offer is to X over the target with a faster sweep speed. See if that differentiates the smaller and larger targets. HH Randy

 

[pspr]

OK, I'll experiment with doing that also. Thanks.

 

[Big Boys Hobbies]

Lots of great info here!

 

[Gonehunting]

I don't use Ground Balance ON as my soil is moderately mineralized. I do a Noise Cancel evertime I turn on my detector, and occassionally during the hunt. I built several Search Modes using the basic Coin program discrimination and Combined audio. The difference between them is the size and pitch of each bin. You can tweak the amount of discrimination you want, make the bins any size you want, and set the pitch that you like, for your style of hunting. I usually run in Auto +2 or +3 Sensitivity. I start out in +3, but know that I can back it down if it gets chattery. I don't use manual Sensitivity because I've proven to myself that the AutoSensitivity in the CTX is smarter than I am. Some programs have Fast ON, other Fast OFF. Again, it depends on the sites I am hunting. I typically run with Normal Response. But in the areas with multiple targets, I like to stretch the tone out with Long response. If I am out in the middle of nowhere, I also like to have Deep ON. With the CTX 3030, I nearly always use Ferrous - Coin Separation. And I always use Target Trace, Target Trace Pinpoint and Pinpoint Sizing. The functionality is there. Why not take advantage of if? With that said, if I am in a nasty modern park with tons of non-ferrous trash, I'll slip over to a modified Coin mode where I have Multiple Tone Conductive audio, High Trash, Fast ON. In my Combined audio modes, I've moved the Ferrous Line down to 21. That way, if I am using Pattern 1 with the discrimination, I'll still get a low tone on some "not too ferrous" targets. But when I switch over the the open screen of Pattern 2, I hear it all. I also changed the conductive bins to reflect the types of targets I'm looking for. I set bin one up from 01 - 14 for nickels, bing 2 is set from 15 - 23 for non-ferrous other stuff, 24 - 39 is for small silver and copper coins, and bin 4 is set from 40 - 50 for larger silver coins. I have the lowest tone on the ferrous targets, a mid-low tone on bin 2, a mid high tone on bin 1, a bit higher tone on bin 3 and the highest tone on bin 4. On another program I've set bin 01 - 20 for nickels, 21 - 36 for IH cents, 37 - 46 for other coins and 47 - 50 for any wrap around iron. I know I can see the iron in the display. But in some of those 40 acre patches with one lone homesite, I prefer to hunt by ear. In this program, the tones are progressive from lowest to highest. In yet another, I've set bin 1 for 01-23 with a low tone, bin 2 is 24 - 36 with a high tone, bin 3 is 37 - 39 with mid low tone and bin 4 is 40 - 50 with another high tone. This is one I use for hunting old coins in old sites.

As I said, there is no "secret forumla" or "special program". The CTX 3030 offers functionality to suit just about every type of site you search, and can be adapted to any level of experience. Each of us have different styles, hunt for different targets and hunt different types of sites. My best advice is to learn what the functionality is and how to implement the "best combination" for your sites. Then set your CTX 3030 to provide an audio response and target separation to your liking on targets you want to dig, in the sites you hunt. HH Randy

Good advice Randy!!! thanks