Cody Question: Accuracy of Smart screen

[Anonymous]

Cody,
I have many questions regarding the accuracy of the Explorer smart screen. I have had my Expl a litle over a month. I have been experimenting with hunting with various amounts of discrimination and listening to the tone to ID coins. I have been hunting in IM -10 and the stock coin discrimination pattern. My other settings are: gain between 7 - 9, deep on, fast off, variability 9, ferrous on, and all others default settings.
I find that hunting in IM-10, over the default coin pattern opens up the machine to those targets that seem to make the target jump around on the screen. The other day I dug a silver 1964 Rosie that sounded like a iffy deep coin but the curser was reading on upper left of screen and jumped occasionally to middle upper right of screen. I was never able to pick it up on the coin pattern.
I am having a difficult time determinng when to dig. I really don't know how much faith to put on the curser/digital readings versus the tone. Even the depth gauge jumps around so much I am never sure what the depth is for targets that seem like they may be deep or iffy (no problem with depth on most shallow clad).
I have several questions relative to the above.
First, How much faith do I put in the tone versus the screen readings to include depth reading? Do I just dig with fluty high pitched coin tone even if curser or digital readings don't reflect coin readings? Or do I listen to tone, verify curser at least jumps to area of expected target areas, and try to verify acceptable depth?
Secondly, I would be greatful to hear the process others use to hunt coins while in IM mode or with Smartfind with little discrimination.
Third, I seem to be digging signals that sound like silver coins and I more often than not just dig a hole and the signal goes away or it is a zinc penny. Any ideas what could be happening?
Forth, I have been digging signals that sound like silver but it jumps from left to right upper portions of the screen. Usually they only come in good on from only a few angular positions as I sweep around the target. How to I determine if a signal like this is just the Nails falsing and not multiple targets on top of or next to each other?
Thank you for reading this message and appreciate any help I can get on all these questions.

 

[Anonymous]

You are asking all the right questions. For only a month experience you are doing well.
The short answer is that everything you are seeing is normal and it takes much experience to determine when to dig. It will come eventually if you stick with it.
The screen ID is 100 percent accurate when the target is shallow, there is no ground mineralization, there is no nearby trash, there is no electrical interference, etc. In short, almost never.
However, as you do multiple sweeps over a target you will see the crosshairs bounce around, how they bounce determines whether to dig. Another thing to remember is that the crosshairs do not move from their last position until the electronics have a chance to recover. In high trash areas this may be difficult and is one of the reasons people do the minelab "wiggle". The tones do not need this recovery time and tend to respond quicker.
You've already discovered why minimal discrimination is best, you could get the dime with im-10 but not the more discriminatory coin pattern. I'm pretty sure in this case there was iron buried very close to the dime that masked the signal.
So Questions 1-4..
Some people go strictly by tone. I don't, tone is what initially catches my attention and then I start to circle the target and sweep over it possibly dozens of times, always watching where the target crosshairs are. They generally will bounce all over on a deep or iffy target but if they hit at least a few times in the right area I will dig. This is where experience comes in.
Depth meter is kind of an iffy deal, under some circumstances with some coils it is quite accurate. I keep the gain at 7 and go by signal strength.
Get a probe to help with those signals that disappear. You'll be amazed how little that is a problem once you do this. Some zinc pennies sound very good, especially if they've been buried in acidic soil. Nothing you can do about this.
Generally iron falsing will bounce extreme upper left to a little bit lower on the upper right. Iron also is generally a bit more difficult get a fix on in the ground, the location seems to jump around a bit.
The real trick is coins buried next to iron. In many worked out areas this is all that is left and the explorer in the right hands excels at sniffing them out. You will often only get a signal from one or two angles and a lousy one at that. It is more of a gut feeling that comes from digging thousands of targets more than something that can be explained.
Hope this helps, check the archives, tons of good posts there, and keep at it.
Chris

 

[Anonymous]

Great post with all the right questions and Chris has given outstanding answers. When you read his answers you say to yourself <span style="background-color:#ffff00;">now he really knows the detector and how to use it.</span>Kalvin I knew you were just starting with the Explorer and was impressed that you nailed the areas that we have to deal with to get to the deep goodies.
I will post something later today on how to locate, and ID a target, simply to add to what Chris is saying. Again great questions and answers.
Have a great Sunday and catch you afer Church.
HH, Cody

 

[Anonymous]

You are doing very well in the short time you had your unit..For clarifcation lets think a silver dime.
If its shallow or deep without any masking you can almost bet it will have the cursor in the upper right hand corner of the screen. If not swinging slowly over it the cursor will usually move along the top and from time to time hit the far right upper area. We all have different hearing but a silver dime audio will stop me in my tracks. I hunt in the advanced digital mode and it very seldom lies.
I use all of the above to dig or not to dig and an oddball silver dime on edge or really worn one can fool the best detectorist on the board. Personally I would dig a lot until all starts to fall in place and it will with time in the field. I remember my first outing with an Explorer I dug very deeply for 8 wheaties and a merc and walking half and in the summers heat was sweating profusely, but I learned quickly how a wheatie acts and rarely dig one unless in an extreme old area where some oddball older coins may be.Nothing is an exact science but if you use all 3 facets after a while you will almost know you are after a silver coin..Getting down into the nickel and gold ring range is another story, but for right now would concentrate on silver coins and they will come..

 

[Anonymous]

Chris, Dan, and Cody,
Thank you for your great responses to my questions. At least I know what I am going through is normal and it is not my machine. I can see the deepies can be a challenge but I am starting to see the light.
You guys on this forum are great and are such a help getting past the initial learning curve of using the Explorer. I look forward to being able to recipicate and help newbies in the future.
Thanks again and I look forward to any other input anyone may have. I also can't wait to post some goodies that I find.
Thanks again for all your help. It makes this hobby that much more enjoyable.
Kalvin

 

[Anonymous]

I mostly hunt using the Digital Screen in conjunction with iron mask. I use the Smart screen to for setup so let me explain and <span style="background-color:#ffff00;">there are some illustrations attached. </span>If we want to set the iron mask to any of the setting it is an all or nothing acceptance or rejection at that iron mask. What if I want to reject with only half of an iron mask setting? I cannot use the IRON MADK ON to does that? I can go to the Smart screen and duplicated and iron mask with any height and width I desire. Let

 

[Anonymous]

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[Anonymous]

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[Anonymous]

Thanks for your help with these questions. Went out detecting today to use the help I recieved from you the forum. I came home with my second silver Rosi (1949), and a couple of wheats. Left about four strong silver hits for another day since I ran out of light.
Thanks again for your help. It really made a diffence today.

 

[Anonymous]

I am curious about a few of your settings. Is that right that you are hunting with ferrous tones? What kind of sites are you hunting? The reason I ask is hunting in ferrous tones can be frustrating in a place that has much trash. Ferrous tones are great for fields and such because hits grab your attention.
If you are hunting in conduct sounds I would suggest changing your variability to 8. That way iron will have more of a high pitch than silver and it's slightly easier to tell the difference. I personally have a hard time telling the difference between a zinc and a dime. I can tell a wheatie from a dime... not sure if it's me or not. I am one of the people who highly recommend going totally by sound. Once I started going by sound ID and not looking at the screen my finds increased dramatically. I went thru the same things as you on how much to trust the LCD. Alot of the time when it was good hit the cursor would be in the middle or buried on the left but the sound ID said dig. The sound ID is highly reliable. IMHO, it's the only way to hunt with the Explorer. Another problem with being a 'LCD watcher' is that the crosshairs will NOT update until the threshold returns... if the LCD does update the LCD ID is bouncing all over the LCD display. That's a problem when your using the Explorer in heavy trash and using the LCD to ID targets... with sound it's not a problem. As far as IDing iron falses... to me iron falses usually seem to sound like the Explorer is struggling to make to sound. Real iffy hits I'll cross from N-S E-W. Usually that will elimate most iron falses. As you get better you will get to the point where you don't have to hit the target from multiple angles to decide if it's diggable or not.
I did want to say you seemed to have picked the Explorer rather quickly and are doing great already. Don't get caught up in trying to apply everything or anything on this forum at once. You're doing good a keep everyones suggestion in your head to apply as your feel comfortable. It would be a pity to see your understanding and abilities go backwards instead of forwards.
-Bill

 

[Anonymous]

Kalvin,
At this writing I have not read all the responses below and I may be duplicating some of those responses.
I have had many of the same problems (relating to tone ID and a bouncing cursor) that you describe. I am sure that you will get a lot of different opinions about that the cause and solution of that problem. I will just relate to you my own experience.
#1. I generally hunt in the Iron Mask mode with the IM set in the range of -10 to -12. I vary the IM setting depending upon the conditions.
#2. I generally hunt in the Conductive mode, but do use the Ferrous mode at the ocean beaches and on other occasions.
#3. I will get a tone ID that suggests a coin target. The tone ID seems to be reasonably repeatable (in the Conductive mode), but when I look at the cursor, it is bouncing around left to right indicating that the ferrous component of the ID is unstable.
#3.1 One of my explanations for this phenomenon is that the target is not under the center of the coil. Rusty iron will have a ferrous reading that varies considerably when the target is near the outer rim of the coil. As the center of the coil is moved closer to being over the target, then the cursor becomes more stable.
#4 To solve this problem I do the following when the cursor is bounding around from left to right.
#4.1 I turn off the Iron Mask to generate an open screen. Then I go through the pinpointing process to zero in on the target. Almost always the cursor settles down to a reasonably stable condition.
#4.2 Somewhere in the pinpointing process I may switch to the Pinpoint mode that I find is very usefull and generally time saving (and very accurate in my opinion). But, there is a lot of difference of opinion about the advantage of ever going to the pinpoint mode.
#4.3 As the user becomes more experienced, then they may be able to resolve the issue without even thinking about it. For me, I have not yet reached that experience level.
#5. One conclusion from the above discussion is that the cursor can be very unstable while the tone ID is very stable. The reason is that the tone ID is only measuring one component of the cursor position, while the cursor is displaying two components of the target ID. The ferrous component of the target ID is the one that is unstable and you are not hearing in the headphones.
With the procedure outlined above, the bouncing cursor has become a non-issue for me.
HH,
Glenn

 

[Anonymous]

<STRONG><span style="background-color:#ffff00;">Outstanding post</span></STRONG> The lack of stability of ferrous metal has interested me for some time as you kow. They can stop the crosshairs from jumping and have between the models. For most hunting I use the digital screen and switch to iron mask as I don't care for the crosshairs. The crosshairs are my last check if needed.
Good to see your post.
Have a great day,
Cody

 

[Anonymous]

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[Anonymous]

Bill,
Thanks for your post. I appreciate your time and insight. It really helps. I agree that I need to change to variability of 8. I went to 9 last night and it seems to help a bit.
I have been detecting around my house which is situated on one acre and has areas of high trach and some lighter trash. I use conductive tones in trashy areas and when I am in the open I use ferrious tones. It allows me to get my attention to the left side and I spend less times looking at the screen.
I seem to have a bigh iron falsing problem on my property. I guess it is a great place to learn since no one can complaint about my digging holes.
Again thanks for the great advise.
Kalvin