Buried a 3-ring minnie at 11" in the backyard...

[jbow]

First I used the GT, a Tejon, and an F75LTD to be sure that there was no iron in or nearthe hole. I dug the hole about 6" in diameter, measured 11", laid the bullet in the hole, replaced the dirt a few inches at a time and packed it back each time. I did notice some charred material at maybe 9", wood I suppose.

So, once I got it done... it promptly disappeared to every machine except the Sovereign GT. (I have not tried the Explorer SE but I did try the E-TRAC w/pro coil. Tried the White's V3 with the D2 coil, high settings/low settings recovery at and above 100 all ground filters at 10khz high and lower... swung fast and slow... wiggled... nothing. No null no peep. Same with the E-TRAC... nothing. I could get maybe something with both the T2 and F75 with the 5" coils but nothing that I would dig and nothing that I am even surte was the target. The Tejon did an interesting thing, it will signal at about 6" past the target in any direction but give no signal over the target, especially in AM VCO.

The SovereignGT is the ONLY machine that would hit it but it hit it with a null, but consistantly. It would not null in auto but with the sens around 12:00 it will null every time and will wiggle in a rising TID number everytime, I saw it hit 173 once but mostly it would climb to around 150 (173 is the correct number). I was using the 10" Tornado coil. I didn't check to see if the tone, once wiggled, was correct... I don't remember if the tone is tied to the number, i'll have to recheck it. I have another minnie that I got out to bury a little less deep and I checked them to see that they read identical to each other and they did.

So, I am impressed with the Sovereign but disappointed with the other machines... maybe I am asking too much from my soil. It is red clay. There were lots of iron mines and furnaces here in the 19th century. Maybe i'll put the other one at 9". That minnie isn't the first target that has disappeared in my yard, most everything I bury at around 10" just vanishes. Some even more shallow. I've buried three quarters that I know approximately where they are. I measured well from a fence post with this target, it is 84" out from a post.

Any suggestions? Should I leave it for a while and see if it improves or dig it up and make it a little less deep? Any idea what the Tejon was doing?

This makes me want to try the Sovereign at a few places, working slowly and checking nulls...

Julien

 

[jbow]

Will things improve for the other machines over time or do you think it is out of range. Have you hunted "nulls" at cleaner sites with deep targets (get a null in disc, stop and try to wiggle in a rising tone). I have heard this somewhere, sometime but never experienced it until yesterday.

What was the Tejon doing?

Thanks,

J

 

[muggsc]

I'm a newbie with the GT and your findings are very interesting. can't wait to get out and try some different settings.
Thanks,
Cal

 

[Sand Scoop]

I wonder if after time and the metal starts reacting with the soil that you might get a signal or tone.

 

[shortribs]

Jbow wonder if u used the 11 head on f75? In pb mode or je. mode.Did u try am mode on f75? I have a GT on order since x-mas but ordered a power booster for mine for the same reason u are experiecing.

 

[Neil]

Its hard understanding this post, not very clear on what coils where used, are you very proficient with each machine and so forth. plus your soil sounds extreme, doubt anyone could say except those who have hunted it.
as far as the tejon if Im understanding your correctly, it sounds like it isnt properly ground balanced and is sounding off on the disturbed ground.
I cant see how it can be found with the gt but not the etrac, how did you have your etrac set up? and the f75 is surely a deep seeker, like shortribs says, did you use the all metal motion mode, ground balanced properly and if so what was your sens set at?
Ive got about the same machines as you except for the whites machine and Im pretty good at using the etrac/explorer/gt and tejon but I could use more time in on my f75. the results should all be about the same if iron and other targets where cleared away from the buired bullet, which is a rather good sized target.
are you saying the gt performed better in auto than at a manual setting?

 

[jbow]

With the F75 LTD I used the 11" coil and tried DE, JE, PF, BP, CL, and AM both motion and static modes, I swung fast and slow, sens med and high all tones... I basically tried everything with it. Same with the E-TRAC auto+3, manual 24, manual 30, deep on, slow swing/fast swing, conductive, ferrous, 2 tone and multi-tone, relci pattern and open iron mask. I pretty much tried everything on every detector.

I have heard before about the Sovereign hitting a deep target as a null but I have never experienced it before but it did it and wiggled in a good tone and number and it obviously said ... "I'm a deep target.. dig me." I was really surprised that the E-TRAC didn't signal anything... nothing and neither did the F75 LTD, I didn't expect that.

I think I am going to leave it in the ground for a year or so and see if things change... maybe i'll water it in overnight.

You wont need an amp for a Sovereign. Most targets aren't that deep and how deep do you really want to dig? Unless you are in the woods there aren't a lot of places you can dig over a foot deep.

Thanks,

Julien

 

[jbow]

n/t

 

[jbow]

Sorry if I wasn't clear. I tried most everything that one can try. I used both the stock coil and a 5.75 widescan on the Tejon and I took extra care with the GB and got it very slightly positive, seems to work best that way around here. I use all the machines a lot. I am probably most experienced on the F75 and E-TRAC but i've use the Tejon, T2, and GT extensively. I hit it in AM and disc with every combination of tones and modes on al the machines.
No, the GT didn't hit it in auto. It hit it in wit the disc at about 1:00 with a null then I was able to wiggle in a rising tone and number. It hit 173 one time, just for a second but was mostly around 150...

I wrote about it here too (F forum) and maybe I explained it a little better, well, i'll just copy/paste the other post...

So... I found a clean spot in my backyard. I checked the spot with the F75 LTD, the Tejon, and the SovereignGT. I checked it in disc and AM with all three. Then I buried a 3ring minnieball at exactly 11". I used my "ground Shark" relic shovel to dig the hole. The hole was about 6" in diameter. When I got down about 8 or 9 inches I hit some charred material, more like shavings or splinters than like coals or chunks. I assume that there was a woods fire or maybe a farmer burned a field at some point in time. I'm pretty sure the yard used to be farmland. Perhaps that little bit of charred material could be having an impact. Plus our dirt here is red iron bearing clay.

I put the dirt back in the hole in four parts, tamping down each part, finally the top plug went back in and the minnie was GONE... I tried to hit it with the LTD in every mode, mid and high sens, all different tones, disc and AM... nothing. I was using the 11" coil and I will try the 5" coil. The T2 signalled something but it signalled something pretty much everywhere... nothing certain or repeatable. I tried the V3 using the D2 coil and lots of settings, high sens, mid sens, recovery delay 40, 100. 120, 200; ground filters from 10khz down to 5khz... swung slow, swung fast... nothing... nada. Tried the E-TRAC with the Pro coil.. nothing, tried ferrous/2 tone and conductive/multi-tone, tried auto+3 sens, manual 24 sens, manual 30 sens, deep on fast off. swung fast, swung slow... nothing nada.. not even a null. tried iron mask open... nothing...

SovereignGT... sens at 1:00, swinging medium slow... slow enough to keep a steady threshold, when I passed over the mnnie I got a null, no tone but a null. I got the null consistantly AND.. when I stopped to "check the null" witha wiggle... the number began to rise and the tone came up. It actually hit the correct TID of 173 once but it mostly would rise with the wiggle up to around 150. The top TID number on the GT is 180... that is darn goode!!

The Tejon did something that I don't yet understand... it would signal about 6" past the target in any direction but was quiet over the target. I was in all metal but not VCO. It was almost like the opposite of what you will sometimes get when a detector will signal a good hit if you swing between two pieces of iron that are maybe 10 or 12 inches apart... right in the middle you get that good tone and number but it is just the iron doing something. I don't know what you call it or even what it is.. I just know two pieces of iron will do that. It was like the opposite of that with no signal over the target but 6" swinging after passing over the target in any direction, not swinging up to the target... only after passing over it.

So... this is something that the LTD would not do for me that I thought it should do. If the GT will do it why wont the LTD? I tried DE, JE, PF, BP, CL, and All Metal modes... I tried everything I could think of... fast swing in DE, JE, and PF.. slow and fast in BP... really slow in CL.. I even tried static AM mode... nothing... nada. I'll let you know if the 5" coil makes a difference. I am going to a different part of the yard and bury an identical minnie at 8" to see how that goes. FWIW, in this same part of the yard I have buried and lost a quarter. I think I get iffy signals in the spot but I didn't mark it well, I had no idea it would vanish... it was about 10" too. I know exactly where this minnie is though... 84 inches from a fence post. No EMI back here, some on one side of the house from underground utilities but none in the back.

Thanks,

Julien

 

[Neil]

Thank you for clarifying. I have no idea how to explain that. The only thing I can think of would be to retrieve the bullet, repack the soil and see what each detector does there. For sure the etrac and explorer should at least equal the sov there. what does a three ringer read out of ground on a sov or etrac. Ive only got one that someone gave me a while back.
by the way the best depth Ive ever gotten out of the tejon is with the 10X12 widescan, if you like your tejon you might look into that coil. and it sounds like you should be hunting the sov more

 

[goodmore]

An explanation could be the Dixie mods. Did your GT ever have it done?

 

[jbow]

Yes it has the mods... do you think they make a difference in depth? I didn't think of that.

J

 

[Critterhunter]

Another thread to print out and read over a smoke. Thanks, I'm sure it's going to be a good read!