A few more good old finds in potato field tryed all metal mode today

[deepdiger60]

Perfect day to go hunt sunny 70,s i did a loner today no Buddy's with me on a finished huge open potato field i did 5 rows all plowed took about 4 hours , i wanted to try a day hunting in all metal mode with my GT i was impressed a steady good threshold i learned something from OBN he uses all metal mode and sets his Sen,s at max just out of auto , i can tell if it is iron or not and there was alot if i had a iffy signal i would switch over to disc. and glad i did i got a good tone and a 160-170 on my meter as i dug a hole i kept checking with my coil until it read 180 about 7 inches down a nice 1898 Barbar quarter in great shape it looks like it got a few scratches from hitting a few rocks by the plow grrrrrr but ill take it plus a pretty beat up 1842 Canadian half penny bank token the Bank of Montreal ,plus a large bent up old copper spoon i broke the handle off of it , and some big brass copper dudads ,all in all a pretty good 4 hours i cant complain about all metal mode i really like it now and deep targets to . I took a few pic,s and i got a nice bag of fresh dug tatters yellow Yukon's . HH Jim

 

[Critterhunter]

Wow. Some great finds! Too bad about the barber, because it looks pretty good shape as most barber quarters I've dug are worn pretty badly. At least from the pics the back looks like it's got some detail. Can't really tell with the front. The bank token is also a real nice find there.

Did you hunt in PP mode on your GT or in all metal fixed mode? I'm still waiting to hear from OBN if he's talking of PP mode or all metal on some of his tips, because I suspect both are different in ways. I haven't played with all metal enough yet to compare, but I have read in the past tips from guys using the All Metal Fixed mode, so I'm wondering if any of the tips translate between PP and AM or if some are specific to one or the other. I'll figure that stuff out sooner or later as I compare them more on the beach. Don't want to play with either on land until the ease of beach scooping has taught me enough about them to risk committing to digging holes on land down the road. The beach is a great way to learn that stuff. Heck, I even am finally practicing using the center of the coil to PP, because I always just used the tip or tail on land in disc or sometimes PP mode.

So far with PP mode I've learned a few things already. A fuzzy approach and leaving of the target means iron far as I've seen so far. Same deal with one way hits. If they "zing" going one way but you don't hear them or hardly nothing the other turns out for me to be iron every time, although I'm still scooping that stuff to be sure for now. Coin/ring sized stuff may get fainter, but the size of the signal seems to hold the same to indicate their size too. Another thing I think I've noticed is if it won't sound off in PP in the same spot from two 90 degree angles it's also always been iron for me. I've been careful about those though, because if it's a double image I suspect it might be a coin or ring on end, because I've seen that mirror image thing in disc mode over the years with various machines from a coin on end. But I think the difference is that (at least in disc this has always been a clue to me) if the hit is in two spots from the same angle then that's a coin on end, but if it changes spots when you switch angles, then at least thus far it's turning out to be iron for me.

 

[deepdiger60]

Wow. Some great finds! Too bad about the barber, because it looks pretty good shape as most barber quarters I've dug are worn pretty badly. At least from the pics the back looks like it's got some detail. Can't really tell with the front. The bank token is also a real nice find there.

Did you hunt in PP mode on your GT or in all metal fixed mode? I'm still waiting to hear from OBN if he's talking of PP mode or all metal on some of his tips, because I suspect both are different in ways. I haven't played with all metal enough yet to compare, but I have read in the past tips from guys using the All Metal Fixed mode, so I'm wondering if any of the tips translate between PP and AM or if some are specific to one or the other. I'll figure that stuff out sooner or later as I compare them more on the beach. Don't want to play with either on land until the ease of beach scooping has taught me enough about them to risk committing to digging holes on land down the road. The beach is a great way to learn that stuff. Heck, I even am finally practicing using the center of the coil to PP, because I always just used the tip or tail on land in disc or sometimes PP mode.

So far with PP mode I've learned a few things already. A fuzzy approach and leaving of the target means iron far as I've seen so far. Same deal with one way hits. If they "zing" going one way but you don't hear them or hardly nothing the other turns out for me to be iron every time, although I'm still scooping that stuff to be sure for now. Coin/ring sized stuff may get fainter, but the size of the signal seems to hold the same to indicate their size too. Another thing I think I've noticed is if it won't sound off in PP in the same spot from two 90 degree angles it's also always been iron for me. I've been careful about those though, because if it's a double image I suspect it might be a coin or ring on end, because I've seen that mirror image thing in disc mode over the years with various machines from a coin on end. But I think the difference is that (at least in disc this has always been a clue to me) if the hit is in two spots from the same angle then that's a coin on end, but if it changes spots when you switch angles, then at least thus far it's turning out to be iron for me.

Critter after doing a good GB i used fix in all metal it worked very good i lowered my threshold to bare minimum and Sen,s just out of auto and i could hear the deepest targets just whispers if it was a iffy target i flipped over to Disc.just to check most low tones where iron but i dug most even if i got spit sound as far as PP goes i rarely use it the stock 10" coil is right on as to the location of the target , the 2 coins came in loud and clear in all metal much different sound then iron , just one more thing i found out today when i flip in noise cancel 1 my built in meter works, in noise cancel 2 it dont work in AMM, so i can see the meter numbers while in AMM just like i was in Disc. mode that helps . Jim

 

[Critterhunter]

Wow, so you are saying the built in meter is working in one of the noise bands? Sure about that? If it is then you've got a weapon there, but I don't see how it could since the GT only outputs a 2V scale for target ID when it's in disc. Far as I know in all metal the ID voltage feed to it goes dead. Way I understand that built in meter it's just hooked up the the output ID pin right behind the coil connector same as an external meter is, or at least I'd figure that it's tapping the same ID pin right behind the coil connector inside the control box. The Sovereign generates a 2V scale for target conductivity in disc that it outputs to the VDI (which is just a volt meter).

One odd thing now that you mention it though. I noticed my external meter a few times showing #s when hunting in PP mode and wiggling over the target. Every time that caught my eye I'd pay attention to the next target and see if it's really doing something ID wise here but whenever I watched and paid attention I didn't see anything. Going to have to watch that more and see. Come to think of it I too was flipping between band 2 and 1 here and there due to 1 seeming to handle the ground minerals with less nulling at the same sensitivity setting of 2. Hmmmm....Now I've got to see if that is causing something to happen here. I'd be shocked though, because far as I know the GT only outputs the VDI voltage in disc from what I've always seen/read.

 

[Critterhunter]

Another odd thing that just came to mind. I remember somebody a while back mentioning he prefered the old Minelab bar graph meter, and he said in PP mode if I remember right that he liked that meter because he could tell target depth by how high the meter was IDing the target. Always thought that was a strange thing to say. Maybe he was using band 1 too because I think he had that meter on a GT where he could switch bands. Next time I'm in the field I'm going to play with the bands and see if the meter comes to life once in a while in PP mode like I thought I noticed it doing the other day and blew it off as my imagination...

 

[deepdiger60]

Wow, so you are saying the built in meter is working in one of the noise bands? Sure about that? If it is then you've got a weapon there, but I don't see how it could since the GT only outputs a 2V scale for target ID when it's in disc. Far as I know in all metal the ID voltage feed to it goes dead. Way I understand that built in meter it's just hooked up the the output ID pin right behind the coil connector same as an external meter is, or at least I'd figure that it's tapping the same ID pin right behind the coil connector inside the control box. The Sovereign generates a 2V scale for target conductivity in disc that it outputs to the VDI (which is just a volt meter).

One odd thing now that you mention it though. I noticed my external meter a few times showing #s when hunting in PP mode and wiggling over the target. Every time that caught my eye I'd pay attention to the next target and see if it's really doing something ID wise here but whenever I watched and paid attention I didn't see anything. Going to have to watch that more and see. Come to think of it I too was flipping between band 2 and 1 here and there due to 1 seeming to handle the ground minerals with less nulling at the same sensitivity setting of 2. Hmmmm....Now I've got to see if that is causing something to happen here. I'd be shocked though, because far as I know the GT only outputs the VDI voltage in disc from what I've always seen/read.

Critter i dont know if you remember my post months ago about the jumper i had to put on the J-2 pins on my built in meter to get a SEF coil to work with it that might be the difference why my meter works while in Noise cancel 1 even if iam not using a SEF coil . Jim

 

[Maxwedge]

Great finds there Jim. Do you have the time to tell us how you can tell the difference in iron and good targets, and what switch combos you use? Who is OBN? Wish you more great hunts. Mark

 

[deepdiger60]

Mark i can hear the difference between iron and a good target while in AMM with a good pair of HP,s i like to call it the difference between a bull frog - iron and a tree frog - silver and copper but i will switch over to Disc. to check, there is no doubt about foil same with some gold it has tones all there own . OBN is Old Beach Nut , Jim HH

 

[OldBeechnut]

Hey those are some great finds Jim.
And glad using the PP mode helped. You and Barry getting out much? I have planned a trip next spring to visit many of the hunters up north, may see you then...

Critter
I have to admit I'm a beach hunter only and a rookie with the sovereign when it comes using it. I hunt with the Excalibur in the PP mode 95% of the time, so any info I pass along is with using the excalibur which PP n AM are the same. Critter as far as the settings on the sovereign, Almetal or PP, I have used the sovereign so little that I'm not sure on it. The excalibur, think I have tried everything...well almost everything, going to go with a different battery, Thunder Power RC..ProPower 65C 1300ma 14.4

 

[Critterhunter]

OBN, thanks for the info. One clearity...PP mode on the Excal is the same as PP mode on the Sovereign (a form of all metal not featuring a ground balance) and not say the Sovereign's tracking all metal, right? Haven't used my friend's Excal enough in the past to really know if it's PP is different in all metal form than the Sovereign's.

Far as the battery thing...I've been running a 3 cell series lipo (12.6V at full charge) in my GT for some time now. Saves a ton of weight, 1 hour charge times without pushing the battery, and no self discharge sitting on the shelf. Sounds like you are planning a 4 cell lipo based on the voltage listed. Be careful about that. You could be pushing the voltage to the extreme higher window of the specs for the voltage regulator. If the Sov/Excal are using a linear regulator they expell excess voltage as heat on a heat sink, and that could spell disaster. If your lucky the regulator will shut down on thermal overload and reset when it cools back down.

Any reason why you are using a 4 cell? you won't get more performance by upping the voltage. The voltage output to the electronics remains a static fixed voltage (say 9V perhaps) no matter what the input voltage is. And due to the LVC (low voltage cutoff, or low battery alarm) on the Excal/GT, they are ideal for a 3 cell, as they will sound the low battery alarm right around 10V, so no worries of draining the 3 cell below 3V per cell that should never be done with a lipo or risk destroying it. a 4 cell series pack = mininum pck voltage of 12V at 3V per cell it should never be drained past. What that means is you can't rely on the low batter alarm of your Excal to tell you the battery is getting low. If it drops past 12V (which it will) you'll probably destroy the pack. The added bulk of the 4th cell and the other issues above...For that reason I'd highly suggest you stick with a 3 cell series pack. The extra voltage of a 4 cell ain't going to change the performance of it. And with a 3 cell, you can squeeze a higher capacity pack into the POD.

Thunder Power? I'm going to assume you are going with them because even though lipos are small/light, the Thunderpower lipos tend to be even smaller/lighter, so perhaps you wanted to use that bring in order to fit that high of capacity of a lipo into your Excal battery pod? Thunderpowers are about the most expensive lipos on the market, so expect to pay a pretty penny for what you can get in the same size pack much cheaper in other brand names like Zippy, Rhino, etc. If you look in the modifications forum I recently posted a thread a month or two back about the lipo conversion of my GT. If you search that forum for "Kered" as the user name you'll also see where he did some conversions to his GT, Elite, and XS2 to lipos as well. Simple as pie. just wire a small plug into the alkaline holder. If I ever wanted to go back to 8AAs in it I just move the plug out of the way, and if I wanted to sell the GT I'd just snip out the plug and no harm done.

My 750ma 3 cell Rhinos cost me around $7 a piece. I could have put a bigger lipo in (Kered used a 1450ma pack) but I was shooting for max weight savings on my custom lightweight land shaft for my GT, even though a 1450ma 3 cell lipo is still very light...I was shooting for every ounce I could save. I get about 2 long hunts out of my GT before I decide to re-charge. Seems my 750ma lipos still out run my stock 1000ma nimh pack, probably due to the lipo holding it's voltage very high until the very end of discharge, where as nimhs or nicads drop more steadily in voltage as they drain.

Please post some pics/mods in a mod thread when you go about your conversion no matter what you do. Also, more lipo conversion thread links in the battery sticky can be found from Kered or me. Lipo chargers are also cheap if you know where to look. I got my computerized (computer screen) charger for $20 and it'll do things chargers costing well over $100 won't. It'll also do nimhs, nicads, lifepo, and several other battery types, as well as save the settings for each of them.

 

[deepdiger60]

Thanks for the infro. OBN and Critter i learn something new all the time on this forum no matter how long i been using the GT Hunting in all metal is pretty good i always used disc. but this change will get me more finds now for sure now iam very familiar with the tones . That would be great OBN to see ya lots of Ocean beaches right next to very old fields out here, gotta get Critter to come this way to hunt in those Ocean waves lol . Oh i cleaned up that 1898 Barbar quarter with just a little baking soda since it is not a key coin came out good not a bad as i thought just discolored a little from farm field HH Jim

 

[Maxwedge]

Pretty coin Jim. Thanks guys for the ammode info. I may try it some time. HH-Mark